qbs

[Hoop Fan]

Lay off Bartel personally. He is going to be a fine drop back passer, if he isn't already. The problem, as its been forever, is pass protection. A pocket passer like Bartel needs a pocket to throw from, and its just not there. He was throwing off balance on the run and with guys in his face too much last night, even against Baylor. If we aren't gonna get some better protection, you need a more mobile qb. Phillips looks very intriguing to me. And if Meeks has the potential people say, it might be better to separate them with a redshirt year for one but not the other. This aint Bartels fault, but that doesn't mean there might not be another option worth trying.

[Diehard Pony]

I agree that this should be seriously considered...specifically pulling Phillips red shirt off. Without game breaking receivers, a mobile quarterback (who can pass as well) would buy more time for receivers to get open, and would provide an effective option to run the ball from the quarterback position.

I also agree that this is not Bartel's fault, but with less than a perfect offensive line, and the kind of receivers we have, this could add some life to our anemic offense.

As others have mentioned, more diversity on offense would help as well. A reverse would have been nice to see last night.

[Hoofprint]

I strongly disagree with the idea of taking the redshirt off Phillips or Meeks. Tate Wallis can run better than Bartel, and so can Ashton Nixon, but it's way too early to hang Bartel. The guy has what .... 6 games of college experience under his belt? Think back to his performance against LaTech last year, when we were all ready to call him the next great college passer. Well, that was too early for that title, and it's way too early now to dump him. Let him grow with the team - Bartel is our best option at QB.

[Hoop Fan]

Whose dumping him? I started off by saying he is a good drop back qb. But if the line can't protect him you it doesn't matter if you have Troy Aikman back there. All I was saying is Phillips might have a dimension that this team really needs right now. And like you said, this is only Game 6 for Bartel. Its not like he is a 4 year starter or that the offense has lit it up with him, except the La Tech game. To you guys that thought Rossley was a guru, one person made that thing work to the modest extent it did: Ramon Flanigan. The guy was Houdini back there. Looks to me like we need another Houdini to make this thing fun at least until reinforcements arrive.

[WildHorse]

I'd like to see Richard start for the whole year, and then a decision can be made on his future - while Meeks and Phillips still have four years of eligibility left. And when that time comes around, I bet Bartel is still in the driver's seat.

[KnuckleStang]

I agree, shaky as Bartel may be early this year, pulling the redshirts off is NOT the way to go.

Reminds me of something I saw on 20/20 a couple years ago. They were testing "emotional intelligence." They put 4-year-olds in a room alone, one at a time, and put a single M&M on the table in front of the kid. They said, "Here's one M&M. You can eat it now, or you can sit and stare at it for 20 minutes. If you haven't eaten this M&M after 20 minutes, we'll give you another M&M, and you can eat them both! If you eat it without waiting, that's the only M&M you get." The 4-year-olds who waited 20 minutes and pigged out on 2 M&M's were said to be more "emotionally intelligent."

Don't know what I think about the concept of "emotional intelligence," but I do think the same concept applies here. Bartel can be good. Let's show some patience and build for the future with a long-term view.

[Nacho]

Dumbest thread ever. So stupid it's sad. Starting a true freshman. Are you out of your mind? Get a grip! Repeat after me: Bartel did not lose the freaking game. He was 12/25 with 5 drops. Could have been 17/25 with those catches. Help me, help you.

[Stallion]

I swear that most of these people criticizing Bartel must not be at the games in person because he ain't anywhere close to our biggest problem. I think WR may be the biggest recruiting emphasis on the team-it is a barren wasteland as far as having people who can turn this program around rather than winning a couple of games in the WAC.

[Hoop Fan]

I assume your frustration is speaking Nacho. Nobody wants a true freshman at any position ever. But this program needs to show something now, period. Call me crazy, but I don't see any offensive line miracle coming this season or even next. The reason Bennett is so conservative on offense now is the same reason Wallis got the nod early last year: our poor pass protection severely limits everything we can do. Our qb never has more than a quick 3 count to chuck the ball, so our plays never have a chance to develop. Wallis had some escapability, thats a big reason he played. Yes, there were drops last night, but that was partly because the timing of the plays was off because the plays didnt have time to fully develop. IF there is a talented guy in the program who can throw and run, what do we have to lose? Nothing after last night. The bottom line is SMU will not be remotely successful with a pocket passer until the offensive line improves its pass blocking drastically. You tell me when that is gonna be. If it sounds like I'm desperate and willing to try anything to work around a weakness, your damn right. I see CUSA slipping away as we speak.

[Diehard Pony]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Hoop Fan:
<B>I assume your frustration is speaking Nacho. Nobody wants a true freshman at any position ever. But this program needs to show something now, period. Call me crazy, but I don't see any offensive line miracle coming this season or even next. The reason Bennett is so conservative on offense now is the same reason Wallis got the nod early last year: our poor pass protection severely limits everything we can do. Our qb never has more than a quick 3 count to chuck the ball, so our plays never have a chance to develop. Wallis had some escapability, thats a big reason he played. Yes, there were drops last night, but that was partly because the timing of the plays was off because the plays didnt have time to fully develop. IF there is a talented guy in the program who can throw and run, what do we have to lose? Nothing after last night. The bottom line is SMU will not be remotely successful with a pocket passer until the offensive line improves its pass blocking drastically. You tell me when that is gonna be. If it sounds like I'm desperate and willing to try anything to work around a weakness, your damn right. I see CUSA slipping away as we speak. </B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


That was my point as well. I was at the game and I do not blame Bartel for the loss. I think he played as well as he can under the circumstances...i.e., limited receiver talent and suspect O-Line. I think with a good O-Line, and quality receivers he could have a chance to light it up. But that is not the case.

The idea of Phillips was to take a shot at salvaging this season. He would have the possiblity of adding an extra element of mobility that buys time, and can keep the defense somewhat at bay if they are leary of his running ability.

As to the idea of true freshmen starting, nobody relishes that, but we are in losing spiral that we don't seem to be able to escape. Other true freshmen have succeeded at that position when they are exceptional. I can think of two at SMU that did pretty well as true freshmen, specifically Mike Ford and Lance McIlhaney. I don't want to debate the differences in circumstances, I know they exist, but in my opinion the Phillips possibility should be considered IF he is practicing well.

[Hoop Fan]

Anybody watching Vikings-Bears on Sunday Night Football? ESPN analysts explained the reason Chicago switched qbs from Jim Miller to Kordell Stewart. They said Miller was a good qb but was "a sitting duck" behind the Bears bad offensive line. They needed someone to throw on the move and avoid the rush. So do we. I don't know the answer, but I know the problem. There is a reason Josh McCown made so many turnovers at SMU and then ends up making NFL money and it wasn't just play calling.

[FloridaMustang]

Too bad Kordel sucks too.

I've been a little harsh on Bartel. I know the kid can play.. it's just so frustrating. I haven't had the opportunity to go to a game and I won't at all this year. And our play by play is like, wow.. are those guys actually at the game? It's like a 5 second delay and none of the details I want. They sound like they're in a bunker somewhere reading the play by play off a printout.

Well, anyway, Bartel will be more effective if this o-line gels. Recievers don't just learn how to catch a football overnight. They have a great coach, they just don't have the talent.