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We need linemen!

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Re: We need linemen!

Postby ponytalk » Wed Dec 06, 2000 11:28 pm

Very interesting, Scott. I enjoy hearing your opinion. It sounds like you really have a good head on your shoulders about college football and education. Sorry it did not work out here, we sure could have used you. I wish you the best of luck where ever you go.
I find some of the things you have said interesting to hear. The stuff about the strength program and getting along with the coaches might begin to explain why our record has fallen every year, and our schedule is not the toughest in the league.
Your support and encouragement of the team is also nice to know, sounds like you have some faith in these guys. You have kind of helped me in determining my opinions of this team and staff.
Thanks, and I think I am speaking for some other ponyfans by saying, keep posting if you want to.
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby South Texas Pony » Wed Dec 06, 2000 11:39 pm

For what it is worth, I have heard an OL close to me say the exact same thing about the strength program here. I find it rather ironic that Scott said the same thing. Perhaps this facet of SMU FB, as well as the lack of a training table, will be looked into 2001!
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Guest » Thu Dec 07, 2000 12:16 pm

Do you really want to know what is wrong with the strength program that everybody keeps talking about. It is not that the people they have running it are bad. When the head guy comes from Nebraska, the mecca of strength training, turns down offers to other D-1 schools who are a lot better off than we are, and is very highly regarded in the strength community it is not him. As I have stated, I am fresh out of this program and let me tell you that it is not necessarily the staff that is so bad. I love the guys on the team because I have been with them in football and experienced very much with them but the vast majority halfass it when they are supposed to be working out and getting bigger. And that brings me to my soapbox of proper nutrition. There is none given nor do they try to do it on their own to a degree. Yes there are some who give it their effort but few and far between. Scott I believe what you have seen as far as the players dedication. However, I saw this false dedication for 5 years and see it today because many of my friends are still on the team or just finished their last season. As long as I can remember guys would skip parts of their workout or just run through it as worthless as they could so they could hurry up and get done and go home and call some girl or somethiing else. People can gripe that it is the coaches job to motivate and make sure the workouts are done correctly. How can this be done when Copeland and the budget only allow 1 head man, 1 full-time assistant, 2 GA's, and 1 intern for the whole athletic strength program. Most program have atleast 2-3 assistants and that many GA's for football alone. Also, blaming a coach soley for lack of motivation or care that is visible in players is a copout. I do agree that they play a major role and it is very important with this but the individual has to have some pride and get ready to play or lift on their own. The coach helps build it and exert it but the player has to already have it on their own and I'm telling you some of the players that are here do not care!! I can think of one guy who goes out and bartends and gets drunk on nights of the week when you should be resting for practice or workout the next day. He would rather be playing coctail rather than thinking about football or school. And believe me, it is not the money he is doing it for, he has plenty of that. Don't get me wrong, there are those who would do anything for this program and you know who they are by watching them play (VV). I am sorry if I sound to rough on some of the guys because they are all really great people but great people don't always make the best players. Get some more VV's in here and everything would be ok, heck even I could coach them. Lets get some guys in that want to win no matter what the cost
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Guest » Thu Dec 07, 2000 1:07 pm

Hey bartender, do you know how to make a red eye?

Seriously though, all the preaching in the world on this board will not make a difference. It has to come from the players. It will take more VV's and Mac's to get where we want to. Once again stanglover you are right on the money
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Joe » Thu Dec 07, 2000 2:21 pm

Great post stanglover. You bring up some excellent points that probably most often get overlooked. Let me ask you this, how do you think it can be policed more? I mean, there has to be a way to make the athletes bust there [deleted] for the hour or so that they are in there. What is the punishment for skipping a workout. I would think, and please correct me if I am wrong, that the strength and conditioning part of of the program has got to be one of the biggest keys to having a successful football program. I read somewhere that one of the biggest changes that Franchione made to the TCU program was to improve there S&T program. I also read that everyone on the team, expect for about 8 guys can bench over 400 lbs, and something like all but two o-lineman can bench over 500 lbs. If that is right, those are some impressive numbers. Please let me know what you think. You seem to be very informative.

bho78, what are you doing these days. I am guessing from your screen name that you are are former guard for SMU.

[This message has been edited by Joe (edited 12-07-2000).]
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Guest » Thu Dec 07, 2000 3:27 pm

Well Joe, as far as those unbelievable numbers that TCU put out, I really don't believe them and I'll tell you why. One of my good friends is a good friend of the strength coach at TCU and he told me something that happened when Frachione first came to TCU. The day he got there he told the str. coach that he wanted so many guys benching over 400 and so many squating over 500 and if he can't give it to him then he will find somebody that will. The man's job was on the line and I know for a fact there are ways of cheating to get higher numbers when maxing out. I had discussed these outrageous claims with our staff and they said its funny how numbers come up when you start allowing the bar to be bounced off the chest or not going completley paralell on the squat. Now, is TCU very strong, yes I do believe that-just look at them. Are they earth movers--NO, but the are a lot stronger than we are right now. How can you police this? It might seem a bit extreme but I love discipline. At Nebraska under Coach Osbourne and I assume Solich now, the strength coach during off-season was the head man and that is in Osbourne's words. The football coaches do not do a lot of work with players during off-season so they are out of the picture. Osbourne told his players that if they did not do what the strength coach told them and work as he saw fit then he (the strength coach) had the authority to kick them off the team no questions asked by Osbourn. I like this. I doubt it can work at SMU but the players need to know that off-season is not fun time but a time to really work and get better. If they know that a screw up could result in dismissal then work ethic tends to rear its head. This is what I believe in and sounds stupid to some but thats why I love this web-site.

Long live the fat kids!!!
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Hotel California » Thu Dec 07, 2000 3:40 pm

Thanks for the insight. I cannot tell you how valuable it is for people that don't play the game or never played the game to hear an actual former college athlete explain things. I really do appreciate it. That is very interesting to hear about Nebraska's strength program. I had no idea. I guess that would certainly do the trick. And thanks for the insight on the TCU program.

By the way, are you going to tryout for the XFl, and if so, how is that going?
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Guest » Thu Dec 07, 2000 5:28 pm

Hotel California, are you any relation to ponyfanman? As far as the XFL, I am hanging up my cleats and starting a new career. The xfl possibility is still open but what I have dealt with thus far which isn't much but only the peak, it is looking too much like a business and I don't want to remember football like that. I don't know if I would make it but I think it is just time to forget about it and move on. Thanks for the interest though.

Long live the fat kids!!!
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Guest » Thu Dec 07, 2000 5:29 pm

Joe,

I am working for a sports marketing/event company in Dallas. The job is great, get to travel a lot and meet all kinds of people.

Stanglover,
You doing anything tonight for the SMU basketball game? I know you hate b-ball, but we are playing a really good Tennessee team. Maybe watch the game, grill, gin and tonica??? What you think?
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Guest » Thu Dec 07, 2000 6:38 pm

Hotel California is of no relation to me. He is a friend.


I am thinking about going to Ben's Half Yard House. I talked to C.S. about it and I am going to talk to BPORK about it today at the premier club. It should be fun, y'all should come
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Bballer » Fri Dec 08, 2000 5:07 am

I think that stanglover is most likely correct about some cheating in the weight room. TCU is very strong. I also believe the talk about lack of comittment in our weight room and the understaffing problem.

It is nice to have some information from people who have experienced college football and all the things we complain about. Sometimes we get carried away and think this stuff is easy. I have a lot of respect for you guys.

Also, I am reading a lot of lingo between some of you. Did you all make up the o-line at one point? If so, what years am I looking at? I want to recognize the "fat guys" that lived in the trenches, you all did not get enough credit and still don't.

------------------
Ponies to the NCAA Tourney in 2000!
Ponies to the NCAA Tourney in 2002!
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Guest » Fri Dec 08, 2000 1:01 pm

Bballer,

Stanglover and myself came to SMU in 1995. We redshirted that year and played the next four, graduating last May. Needless to say, we know the ins and outs of this program pretty well.
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby PerunaPunch » Fri Dec 08, 2000 1:05 pm

Couple of thoughts:

Regarding the the alledged conversation between coach Fran and the TCU strength coach. Even if an athlete is cheating on form, that's good for what? 20-25 lbs. on the bench, maybe double that for squat -- tops?

Could the majority of our guys bench 375 and squat 450 strict form? Doubt it. So my point is, raising the bar (or stacking on the plates as it were) to that degree, AND ENFORCING IT, ensure that strength won't be a team weakness.

I've heard about the attitude problem from a couple of people now. Pride is a tough characteristic to get a grasp on. At what point does a guy say, "I won't allow us to lose!" I saw it vs. Kansas (I thought) when McCown spewed all over the field, sat out a play, then came back in. I saw it from the defense (I thought) against TCU until near the end of the first half, until the dam finally broke. Somebody's got to step up and instill some pride. But enforcing some measures, like strength and weight requirements help ensure at least some level of performance is achieved.

Final point... This lack of a training table. Didn't seem to be much of an issue in the 80s when we ate in McIlveney, but I'll concede that any advantage is an advantage...

What about ponyfans.com starting a grass roots effot to get a training table established?? They just put a commercial kitchen in the Sig Ep house at a cost of (I believe) 150K. Couldn't we do a remodel of Letterman Hall or somewhere to provide the same facilities? Surely, between all of us, we have the resources to: 1) put in a little seed money 2) raise awareness among alumni 3) have the contacts to voice our opinion with the AD and university officials.

How about it? The Ponyfans.com sports nutrition center.
"Anyone who had followed June Jones, who knew how he built his program and what he thought of SMU's program should have known this was really a silly waste of time. Can we now get on with hiring a Head Coach...?" -- Stallion, December 25, 2007 11:38 pm
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Guest » Fri Dec 08, 2000 1:30 pm

PerunaPunch, very good post and I especially like the last idea. On the lack of training table in the 80's and still being an excellent program, well lets be honest in the 90's the quality of players is not quite the same as the 80's. Those guys back then were specimens. And trust me, there are plenty of other ways to cheat in the weight room and even inflate numbers when your job is on the line. Maybe they do this and maybe they don't. But, once again lets be honest everybody benching over 400 pounds including receivers and DB's and all the o-line benching over 500 lbs, anybody who has any experience lifting and I'm not talking about just athletes knows this is ridiculous. Those guys in Ft. Worth are good and big and strong, but believe me I've played against every single one of them and their not superhumans. I smell a rat.

Long live the fat kids!!!
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Re: We need linemen!

Postby Hotel California » Fri Dec 08, 2000 3:00 pm

Benching 400 lbs in an accomplishment, it is not easy to do. Benching over 500lbs a rare event, and I would indeed find it hard to believe that the entire TCU offensive line can bench over 500 lbs. Exspecially when I look at a program like Texas, which is supposed to have one of the best strength and conditioning programs in the country, and they only have a very select few that can do that. And the ones that do are all-american type players such as Casey Hampton. I believe in what you said Stanglover.
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