Sorry Boys...it's never going to happen

[Dwan]

I don't think we have admissions issues, I think we have administrative issues. I think everybody on this board would love to see SMU become a BCS buster and win a BCS bowl. To eventually be a top 10 program that competes in a BCS conference for BCS bowls and national titles. But is that what RGT's goal is? It's not. Ask him. He will tell you that he values high graduation rates and running a clean program. He is satisfied with 8 win seasons in a second tier conference. We look at TCU and say, see, they did it, so can we. He looks at that and sees pot busts for players and players getting DUI's in the national media. He does not want the negatives that unfortunately are associated with top 10 football programs.

Oddly enough, we might just have success in basketball. But the scary thing is that it was an accident that we ended up with Larry Brown. It's not like our administration said, hey, lets get serious about basketball

[PoconoPony]

Maybe we do have admissions issues. Maybe we should recruit smarter players who are non-special admission kids capable of running sophisticated systems instead of a games filled with miss-reads, penalties, failure to recognize keys....etc. Seems like Baylor, Duke, Northwestern, Stanford, Notre Name and Vanderbilt have done very well recently with more capable kids. Then again, these programs all have excellent young and aggressive coaches who recruit.

[Statler]

I will not reveal my sources .

Trust me (or not) - admissions is not the issue (unless the individual had a criminal record)

[East Coast Mustang]

The premise of this thread is stupid. If Duke can do it playing in a conference with FSU, Virginia Tech, Clemson, and Miami, then we can do it in the [deleted] AAC. You just need a coach who is committed to recruiting and selling the program in the community. I thought JJ was the answer until the Tulane game last year.

[Stallion]

This is turning into an Urban Myth

[couch 'em]

I don't think we have admissions issues, I think we have administrative issues. I think everybody on this board would love to see SMU become a BCS buster and win a BCS bowl. To eventually be a top 10 program that competes in a BCS conference for BCS bowls and national titles. But is that what RGT's goal is? It's not. Ask him. He will tell you that he values high graduation rates and running a clean program. He is satisfied with 8 win seasons in a second tier conference. We look at TCU and say, see, they did it, so can we. He looks at that and sees pot busts for players and players getting DUI's in the national media. He does not want the negatives that unfortunately are associated with top 10 football programs.

Oddly enough, we might just have success in basketball. But the scary thing is that it was an accident that we ended up with Larry Brown. It's not like our administration said, hey, lets get serious about basketball

If RGT is OK with 8 wins in a second tier conference then he hasn't been the problem because we are no where near that level. So your argument is invalid.

I agree that we don't seem to have top 10 level admin support be we are so far from needing that if is irrelevant

[Stallion]

We seem to have a huge Basketball support staff-I seriously doubt SMU would refuse an infusion in the Football staff but it costs money and we are only getting 15,000 to games. We'll have the athletic program our alumni can afford

[feelthehorsepower]

The premise of this thread is stupid. If Duke can do it playing in a conference with FSU, Virginia Tech, Clemson, and Miami, then we can do it in the [deleted] AAC. You just need a coach who is committed to recruiting and selling the program in the community. I thought JJ was the answer until the Tulane game last year.

The American Athletic Conference next year will be Conference USA all over again. We should already be past this level during June's 6th year!

[SMU 86]

Rice is having a very successful season.

[PerunaPunch]

With regards to admissions and institutional issues...

Even though changes have been in the work for awhile, this year's recruiting class is the first where I'd say we were on basically equal footing with other schools, in that I believe are able to admit just about any qualifying student-athlete a coach might want to offer.

As for institutional issues, curriculum demands continue to increase. There's an even greater emphasis on writing and core classes, which could (for example) be more difficult for students who want to study math, engineering, sciences, arts and those who don't have a solid foundation in English (such as foreign students). On top of that, several majors now have prerequisites (such as GPA) before you can declare. Seems like that could cause a logjam and could prevent the necessary progress toward a degree as required for eligibility.

So before our issue was admitting student-athletes. Going forward, the challenge will be the increased academic pressure and keeping kids eligible.

[couch 'em]

1. What do you base your "first class on equal footing" statement on?

2. Even in my early 2000s era it was obvious that athletes who lacked the academic potential of the student body just had to show up, at least try, and go to the LEC and have someone do all your work for you. To fail you had to blatantly not try, or be obviously academically capable but try to skirt by as if you weren't.

[MG_Eagle]

Interesting thread. Certainly a topic discussed by NT fans in the past. SMU can win but first thing is first...what are the realistic goals and expectations? The first thought is always to compare your school to what Boise, TCU, Utah etc have done but I consider them to be exceptions to the rule. SMU has come a long way. I'm clearly not close to the program as you are but can the administration be blamed a whole lot when the HFC is being paid 2 million a season? Some of it is luck as well. When Dan McCarney was first rumored and started surfacing it was completely out of left field and I'm pretty sure many NT fans were not excited but he's turned out to be a solid hire so far. Sometimes it's that non sexy hire with no pizzazz whatsoever that can turn out to be positive for a program.

[Stallion]

With regards to admissions and institutional issues...

Even though changes have been in the work for awhile, this year's recruiting class is the first where I'd say we were on basically equal footing with other schools, in that I believe are able to admit just about any qualifying student-athlete a coach might want to offer.

As for institutional issues, curriculum demands continue to increase. There's an even greater emphasis on writing and core classes, which could (for example) be more difficult for students who want to study math, engineering, sciences, arts and those who don't have a solid foundation in English (such as foreign students). On top of that, several majors now have prerequisites (such as GPA) before you can declare. Seems like that could cause a logjam and could prevent the necessary progress toward a degree as required for eligibility.

So before our issue was admitting student-athletes. Going forward, the challenge will be the increased academic pressure and keeping kids eligible.

You don't know jack about this subject. Sorry you just don't know what you are talking about. We have evidence of exactly how many recruits were Category C in June Jones first two years. In June Jones first full recruiting class we had 17 Category C recruits in one damn class. 15 were admitted. The other 2 were conditionally admitted under minimal requirements that are not unreasonable or unfair. I have shown you clear evidence of this FACT about 10 times You are just about the only one still shuffling this [deleted]. Everybody else in the SMU community has been set straight.

Further, the alleged curriculum issues are subterfuge because in fact SMU has not had an unusual number of academic failures in comparison to other Texas schools and certainly less than TCU in the last 3 years. There has, in fact, not been any significant competitive disadvantage.

Also, all NCAA schools are in the process of adjusting to new NCAA admission standards for JUCOs and freshman that are the most restrictive in the history of College athletics including significantly higher freshman and JUCO sliding scale and mandatory freshman academic redshirt for a huge percentage of freshman recruits. None of your issues are even going to be relevant in 2 years.

If a recruit has an SAT/ACT equivalent to the traditional 700 minimum(re-centered to 820) and a corresponding GPA on the sliding scale and you don't have a criminal record you can be admitted to SMU. The evidence over 6 years is overwhelming. I'm basing this opinion based upon admission/qualification issues involving conservatively 50 recruits in Football and Basketball since June Jones first class. Again if I'm wrong name 1 single player who was not admitted to SMU in football or basketball that has ever started a single game at the Division 1A level. You have never responded to this question. Nobody has ever responded to this question. Your argument is factually baseless.

SMU is on an even playing field with most every NCAA program with minimal, reasonable admission standards-perfectly reasonable at a school like SMU to exercise some discretion for players scoring seriously low on the bottomless SAT/ACT sliding scale because the majority of the small sliver of kids that can't get into SMU can not graduate from SMU.

[gostangs]

I love stallion for just this one topic. Because the doom and gloom forever crowd and the June is the best we could ever get crowd all hang their that hat on this. It used to be admissions issues, and now it is continuing toward a degree issues.

Does SMU have challenges in this area - yes. More than others? No.

[PerunaPunch]

Couch 'em!
The LEC is for everyone. Student-athletes have additional resources on the 3rd floor, which works in conjunction with the LEC. This is a fairly new development, but is necessary IMHO as the gap between some student-athletes we are now allowed to admit and tougher curriculum requirements widens.

Stallion,
I know this is going to push you over the ledge. I really am not trying to argumentative or a jerk. But I do think the university and the staff deserves some defense, because they are unable to defend themselves. Here's what I'd like you to consider... Sometimes when a student-athlete tells Rivals that they've made another choice, or they've decide to move back home or they've lost their passion for the game, the truth is that they were an academic casualty. Put yourself in the kid's shoes. You're back home, embarrassed, not sure what your next move is, and some punk reporter calls you and asks why you haven't been at practice. What are you going to tell them?

Beyond that, I don't want to be baited into divulging information that shouldn't be. One of these days, I'm sure we'll have a nice long conversation about it. But I can promise you, you'll be buying the first round.