Article: G5 schools soon must face reality

[gostangs]

Poco - are you trying to say that the only privates to compete while in P-5 conferences are TCU, Baylor and Stanford? That is not true at all. USC is always competitive, if not dominant. Northwestern and Duke have been competitive recently. When the right coach is in place Vandy does well.

ON average, the privates are as successful as the publics with the right resources.

SMU is an undiscovered USC. All we need is access to the party and we will take it from there. We should be lobbying ESPN. ESPN needs to expand the market for their product in a growing state. 5 P-5 schools in a state the size of Texas - with our future growth - is not enough. Hell there are 4 in North Carolina alone.

[PoconoPony]

Poco - are you trying to say that the only privates to compete while in P-5 conferences are TCU, Baylor and Stanford? That is not true at all. USC is always competitive, if not dominant. Northwestern and Duke have been competitive recently. When the right coach is in place Vandy does well.

ON average, the privates are as successful as the publics with the right resources.

SMU is an undiscovered USC. All we need is access to the party and we will take it from there. We should be lobbying ESPN. ESPN needs to expand the market for their product in a growing state. 5 P-5 schools in a state the size of Texas - with our future growth - is not enough. Hell there are 4 in North Carolina alhne.

You are correct that USC has an historical record of success. The other privates have been historically bottom feeders who only on occasion have a brief success then fall back to the bottom. Stanford has the most recent record of longer term success; however, I maintain that the privates have not maintained a track record of acceptable success. Hence, my concern that in the eyes of the P5 SMU is not a viable candidate for expansion. They want large state schools with large stadiums and a large alumni. That large alumni groups somewhat off sets the pro SMU argument that P5 wants the Dallas TV market which is actually more pro sports oriented and already saturated with P5 alumni.

[well travelled pony]

Yep, that is why USC can be a major player. They are private, but with a large student body. SMU has stayed way too small for way too long. That is what makes it tough.

Go Ponies!

[jpe747]

I have been impressed with moves some of the AAC schools have been making in sports. Some good coaching hires and upgrades in facilities. SMU being at the top of that list. Quite frankly I didn't think our 'big bucks' alumni would make such a good choice for SMU football coach. They went after the best and I think the proof is already apparent. NOW the team needs to start looking like winners and making TCU, Baylor, A&M, etc. games meaningful. A few wins against the big boys and the AAC could become relative to the discussion. It would also be nice to go deep into the bb tournament like the final four. Perhaps the AAC can replace the ACC.

[skurtn]

Poco - are you trying to say that the only privates to compete while in P-5 conferences are TCU, Baylor and Stanford? That is not true at all. USC is always competitive, if not dominant. Northwestern and Duke have been competitive recently. When the right coach is in place Vandy does well.

ON average, the privates are as successful as the publics with the right resources.

SMU is an undiscovered USC. All we need is access to the party and we will take it from there. We should be lobbying ESPN. ESPN needs to expand the market for their product in a growing state. 5 P-5 schools in a state the size of Texas - with our future growth - is not enough. Hell there are 4 in North Carolina alone.

Don't forget University of Miami; another private school that has quite a bit of success over the years.

[skurtn]

I think this would be handy. Here's a list of private schools in the "Power Conferences":

• Duke
• Miami
• Baylor
• TCU
• Wake Forest
• Notre Dame (they're not really in a conference per-say, but considered a power school)
• USC
• Stanford
• Syracuse
• Northwestern
• Vanderbilt
• Boston College

Any others?

[coloradoStang]

Yep, that is why USC can be a major player. They are private, but with a large student body. SMU has stayed way too small for way too long. That is what makes it tough.

Go Ponies!

agree...well we just basically doubled the housing capacity on campus...Maybe we slowly phase out sophomores on campus as we build the infrastructure to support a bigger size and then make it only freshmen on campus again.

[pwnyxpress]

.

[EastStang]

USC and UCLA don't have to compete with the NFL right now for football dollars. P5 programs similar to ours are Northwestern, Vanderbilt, Boston College and Miami. All are private schools in cities in NFL markets. The U and Vandy also have the same problem we do with competition from state school(s) which dominate the market. How did the U succeed? They cheated after we did and the DP was no longer on the table, but other than games against FSU, their attendance is not great. Vandy has games every week against large state schools who bring their own fans and hasn't been dumped by their conference mates. When you play Tennessee, Alabama, Auburn, LSU, etc. you're going to pack your stadium. The only card we have to play is that we're in Texas. If the ACC or the B1G or the PAC 12 wanted into Texas, then they would either have to persuade UT, TT, Baylor or TCU to break their Big XII contract or they would have to come calling on us or UH. So, if Nebraska or Wake Forest or USC wanted into Texas badly enough, they would push to add a Texas market school. The B1G with its own network and four million cable boxes in DFW and Houston at $12 each per year might make SMU and Houston a worthwhile gamble. If ACC football ratings sag, it might come looking for new markets in Texas. The Big XII has already raided their market by adding WVU which forced them to take Louisville instead of WVU. So, if they wanted payback, they could do it. Quite frankly if SMU were to join a conference I'd prefer the ACC with the U, Wake, Duke, BC, Syracuse, UVA and UNC in it with their academic rules already there. You could almost have a private division and a public division.

[PoconoPony]

I think this would be handy. Here's a list of private schools in the "Power Conferences":

• Duke
• Miami
• Baylor
• TCU
• Wake Forest
• Notre Dame (they're not really in a conference per-say, but considered a power school)
• USC
• Stanford
• Syracuse
• Northwestern
• Vanderbilt
• Boston College

Any others?

Syracuse is technically a private school; however, Syracuse is also the "contractor" for a number of state university programs. For example, if you want a forestry degree you can attend and get your degree from Syracuse; however, you pay a state university tuition as it is a contracted degree. Hence, Syracuse has a very large student enrollment many of whom are really public school students, paying public school tuitions taking courses that would not be normally offered at a private university.

[CalallenStang]

I think this would be handy. Here's a list of private schools in the "Power Conferences":

• Duke
• Miami
• Baylor
• TCU
• Wake Forest
• Notre Dame (they're not really in a conference per-say, but considered a power school)
• USC
• Stanford
• Syracuse
• Northwestern
• Vanderbilt
• Boston College

Any others?

Syracuse is technically a private school; however, Syracuse is also the "contractor" for a number of state university programs. For example, if you want a forestry degree you can attend and get your degree from Syracuse; however, you pay a state university tuition as it is a contracted degree. Hence, Syracuse has a very large student enrollment many of whom are really public school students, paying public school tuitions taking courses that would not be normally offered at a private university.

I know that is true of Cornell; did not think it was also true of Syracuse

Edit: this is very interesting http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statutory_college

The New York State College of Forestry was reestablished at Syracuse University (SU) in 1911, but was never technically a statutory college. Founded first as a department of Syracuse University, in 1913 the College was chartered as an independent state institution, called "The New York State College of Forestry at Syracuse University". In 1972, its name was changed to the State University of New York College of Environmental Science and Forestry (SUNY-ESF); it remains administratively separate from Syracuse University. ESF students have full access to SU libraries and recreational facilities. Students at the both institutions take courses at the other institution and can apply for admission to concurrent degree and joint certificate programs. ESF students take part in joint commencement exercises in May (and receive degrees with seals of both Syracuse University and SUNY ESF), and ESF students may participate in all SU student activities except intercollegiate sports.[5]

So, unlike at Cornell, they aren't technically Syracuse students, but for all intents and purposes, they are. And while Environmental Science and Forestry is the only state-funded program at Syracuse, it does have about 2,700 students