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About 5 minutes into that game, I became aware of how well Tulane was tackling. They hit hard, and often had multiple players rolling on the shellack. They played more physical than that Big10 bound program.

mustangxc wrote:

ponyboy wrote:TCU is the very blueprint for how to do it right post-SWC. They get a grade of 100. We get a 50 so far. If we get into a P5 conference soon, we rise to an 70. Rice gets a 20.

Rice is about to be in the same conference as us, has played in 6 Bowl games, won 2 conference championships in football, and played in 2 NIT's. In that same span SMU has played in 7 Bowl games, won 0 conference championships in football, and played in 4 NIT's and 2 NCAA tournaments. Rice also won a national championship in baseball along with multiple college world series appearances. I'd say they are about even with us without the hype.

I mean that’s fair. One thing we do have that they don’t is a very strong rumor we may be back in the big-boys’ club soon.

We cut the ribbon at FORD in 2000 and upgraded Moody in 2013...Hart showed up in ‘12 with Larry being hired right after that...June was around almost 5 years b4 Hart and was probably already po’d....Armstrong opened in ‘20 as this was all the duplicitous Dykes wanted (cough cough)...still grappling with the whole we haven’t done anything, and the gargantuan power of Turner deal. It’S deeper and wider, folks.

GHammond wrote:We cut the ribbon at FORD in 2000 and upgraded Moody in 2013...Hart showed up in ‘12 with Larry being hired right after that...June was around almost 5 years b4 Hart and was probably already po’d....Armstrong opened in ‘20 as this was all the duplicitous Dykes wanted (cough cough)...still grappling with the whole we haven’t done anything, and the gargantuan power of Turner deal. It’S deeper and wider, folks.

Regarding facilities, you could say same about a lot of schools. I mean, UNT has a better IPF than us (bigger field, adjoined outdoor fields, running track, etc).

I don't think there is a thing in this thread I disagree with.

I have been cheering on SMU for more than 30 years now, 30 of that as an alum. Much of that time has been pretty painful and many of my close friends that are fellow alums pay little attention to our teams and wonder why I do.

That said, I will say that I think we have closed the gap significantly between us and those that compete at a high level on the national stage. Clearly we haven't closed it all the way or we would be in a P5 conference, we'd be viewed as a destination job for many coaches, we'd feel legitimately in the running for winning in a big, big way, and my alumni friends would be following the team with vigor. But, the following are the ways I feel we've closed the gap. Not saying we shouldn't want more, we 100% should. And not saying we shouldn't expect more, we 100% should.

- When we lose coaches, they are going to good gigs. For many years after the DP we were only losing coaches because they could win nothing here and then didn't get a great gig elsewhere. Now they are demonstrating winning is possible again at SMU and then getting good P5 jobs.
- We are winning some big-time recruits...we never even sniffed a scent of a player like Preston Stone for most of the 30 years before he committed.
- The transfer portal has been a net-add for our program, and we're winning some strong players through that. Sure, we're getting guys like Camar from programs that already have many others like him. But, we're beating out mid-level P5 schools for guys like Camar.
- Our practice facilities are categorically "in the ballpark" of major programs. For instance, we now have an IPF -and more dedicated football facilities, with more on the way. We once didn't even have an IPF when others had one for decades. (totally get that our stadium is probably a full order of magnitude below many P5 stadiums in terms of amenities)
- We're regularly in bowl games. 1989-2008 (first 20 years post DP), none.
- And, this is a big one, to me. Now when we transition between coaches we're not on the heels of a winless season and then requiring a multi-year rebuild. ...see transition from Dykes to Lashee where we were bowling in Yr 1.
- And, like the one above, the improvement of our recruiting and talent on our roster is such that when we lose a key player we're not starting from scratch. ...see Shane Buechele - to - Mordecai - to - Stone.

Again, agree we're not where we ultimately would like to get to. I'm not a plant from the current school administration, posting "sunshine" in their defense....I agree with the general sentiment that the school appears to have lacked a vision and consistent commitment regarding athletics for much of the past 30 years. But, I feel like there is hope. Three others from our conference getting invited to the B12 and not us, was a gut bunch. Hoping the school is being as aggressive as possible in seeking membership to a P5 conference.

ponyboy wrote:

mustangxc wrote:

ponyboy wrote:TCU is the very blueprint for how to do it right post-SWC. They get a grade of 100. We get a 50 so far. If we get into a P5 conference soon, we rise to an 70. Rice gets a 20.

Rice is about to be in the same conference as us, has played in 6 Bowl games, won 2 conference championships in football, and played in 2 NIT's. In that same span SMU has played in 7 Bowl games, won 0 conference championships in football, and played in 4 NIT's and 2 NCAA tournaments. Rice also won a national championship in baseball along with multiple college world series appearances. I'd say they are about even with us without the hype.

I mean that’s fair. One thing we do have that they don’t is a very strong rumor we may be back in the big-boys’ club soon.

Hence the hype. SMU is all show and no go. We talk a big game but have very few trophies to show for it.

DC-Pony wrote:I don't think there is a thing in this thread I disagree with.

I have been cheering on SMU for more than 30 years now, 30 of that as an alum. Much of that time has been pretty painful and many of my close friends that are fellow alums pay little attention to our teams and wonder why I do.

That said, I will say that I think we have closed the gap significantly between us and those that compete at a high level on the national stage. Clearly we haven't closed it all the way or we would be in a P5 conference, we'd be viewed as a destination job for many coaches, we'd feel legitimately in the running for winning in a big, big way, and my alumni friends would be following the team with vigor. But, the following are the ways I feel we've closed the gap. Not saying we shouldn't want more, we 100% should. And not saying we shouldn't expect more, we 100% should.

- When we lose coaches, they are going to good gigs. For many years after the DP we were only losing coaches because they could win nothing here and then didn't get a great gig elsewhere. Now they are demonstrating winning is possible again at SMU and then getting good P5 jobs.
- We are winning some big-time recruits...we never even sniffed a scent of a player like Preston Stone for most of the 30 years before he committed.
- The transfer portal has been a net-add for our program, and we're winning some strong players through that. Sure, we're getting guys like Camar from programs that already have many others like him. But, we're beating out mid-level P5 schools for guys like Camar.
- Our practice facilities are categorically "in the ballpark" of major programs. For instance, we now have an IPF -and more dedicated football facilities, with more on the way. We once didn't even have an IPF when others had one for decades. (totally get that our stadium is probably a full order of magnitude below many P5 stadiums in terms of amenities)
- We're regularly in bowl games. 1989-2008 (first 20 years post DP), none.
- And, this is a big one, to me. Now when we transition between coaches we're not on the heels of a winless season and then requiring a multi-year rebuild. ...see transition from Dykes to Lashee where we were bowling in Yr 1.
- And, like the one above, the improvement of our recruiting and talent on our roster is such that when we lose a key player we're not starting from scratch. ...see Shane Buechele - to - Mordecai - to - Stone.

Again, agree we're not where we ultimately would like to get to. I'm not a plant from the current school administration, posting "sunshine" in their defense....I agree with the general sentiment that the school appears to have lacked a vision and consistent commitment regarding athletics for much of the past 30 years. But, I feel like there is hope. Three others from our conference getting invited to the B12 and not us, was a gut bunch. Hoping the school is being as aggressive as possible in seeking membership to a P5 conference.

We've moved from bottom 10 status to mediocre. We need to move from mediocre to great if not elite at some point.

JasonB wrote:

gostangs wrote:

Terry Webster wrote:Last year Tulane went 2-10 and people were calling for the coach to be fired.

The difference is in many cases one player - not all this administrative hand wringing that all the old ladies like to constantly moan about. Tulane has an élite running back that has won almost every game for them. Put that guy on our team and we win all but maybe UCF.

He is awesome, but I disagree. They had a great Offensive and Defensive line that allowed them to play with the big boys. It let their LBs make plays on defense and let the RB go all over the place on offense. The RB has been there for 4 years, but this year he had a to notch line and a healthy QB.

Exactly...Spears had holes to run through. Bam Bam was successful, because he could make his own openings. We have to get better in the trenches, on both sides of the ball.

Go back and look at the Pont Express years and study the O & D lines.

We had so much depth the other team was worn out in the second half. We just kept bringing in people and put the hurt on the other team.

Continue to give your donations to hart and turner but use new money to give to the visionary that is running the NIL. Pick one and get involved in the future success of SMU.

I think the solution is something like having a former football player in a position of great power (not necessarily an SMU player) with full support of the president.

RGT has basically been our AD for the past 20 some years.

In another "glass is half full" look, below are our composite recruiting national rankings by 247 dating back to 2011 (they are a composite of HS recruits and transfers).

Year - Nat'l Rank
2023 - 48 (this still could move up or down)
2022 - 49
2021 - 46
2020 - 64
2019 - 61
2018 - 87
2017 - 80
2016 - 75
2015 - 80
2014 - 80
2013 - 72
2012 - 70
2011 - 68

At the moment our composite ranking for 2023 puts us ahead of about a dozen P5 schools.

I recognize most on this board wouldn't argue that the glass is at least half full, AND that we are striving to fill the damn glass all the way.

Know there is a lot of football talk here. But it goes well beyond football.

You can't overlook what our leadership did to the SMU Basketball program and Moody Madness. It is criminal.

Speaking of coaches being coveted by other programs after they leave SMU - who was the last SMU Basketball coach -men or woman's to have success as a head coach post SMU?

Not Larry, not Jank, not Dement, not Tubbs, not Doh, not Shumate, not Rhonda, Not Mays

You have to go back to Dave Bliss - who left in the 80s prior to the DP

Also - What is happening in all of the Olympic Sports that were once the crown jewels of SMU? How many Olympians? How many National champions in swimming lately? Track and Field? These programs may need the Pac 10 more than anything to have any chance of returning to top program status.

College Football News put our football ranking at 64 at season's end which is about right. UH was 65. BYU 58.

PonyTime wrote:Know there is a lot of football talk here. But it goes well beyond football.

You can't overlook what our leadership did to the SMU Basketball program and Moody Madness. It is criminal.

Speaking of coaches being coveted by other programs after they leave SMU - who was the last SMU Basketball coach -men or woman's to have success as a head coach post SMU?

Not Larry, not Jank, not Dement, not Tubbs, not Doh, not Shumate, not Rhonda, Not Mays

You have to go back to Dave Bliss - who left in the 80s prior to the DP

Also - What is happening in all of the Olympic Sports that were once the crown jewels of SMU? How many Olympians? How many National champions in swimming lately? Track and Field? These programs may need the Pac 10 more than anything to have any chance of returning to top program status.

All GREAT points. And, speaks to the lack of coherent vision and lack of consistent commitment. Some fits and starts of commitment (some even very significant), but followed by gaps.

Can anyone see what they gave Lashlee?

https://www.espn.com/college-football/i ... -coaches#D