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Two important points after reading the NCAA report in full

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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby EastStang » Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:44 am

I think you have a substantive due process issue. The bylaws state that punishments for violations must be reasonable and reasonable is not a defined term. If UNC with say 1500 violations (3100 included regular students), and they get the same penalty as we got with one violation, that would be evidence that their penalties are arbitrary and capricious which is usually the standard for these types of cases. Add in OU, Maurice Clarett, PSU, the U, Alabama vs. Jacksonville, UNLV, UCF, SMU and Fresno State and you see the picture, its all seat of the pants kind of stuff. And it creates a competitive advantage and an economic advantage for the P5 conferences. If SMU is out, then their spot in the tournament (should they like they are supposed to) would likely go to a P5 conference school, thus helping say, the Big XII and hurting the American.
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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby Topper » Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:51 am

SMUstangs22 wrote:
Stallion wrote:I said we should appeal

I just don't think we have a lawsuit with a chance in hell-although there might be some type of limited injunctive relief sought once all administrative appeals are exhausted if the NCAA for some reason didn't follow its own Bylaws or procedural rules. That would have limited application probably sending it back to the NCAA to abide by those Bylaws/procedures


Was it within their bylaws to consider past transgressions as far back in history as they chose to go?


We should file suit in state court in Dallas and then give the NCAA all kinds of procedural fits. Depose them and make them explain how past transgressions from decades ago have any bearing on this incident and make them explain why the P5 schools seem to be immune from their nonsensical, arbitrary penalties. The legal issues may be on their side, I don't know, but everyone is entitled to their day in court and I think that we would embarrass them and place these nasty bullies on the defensive and force them to settle.
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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby smusportspage » Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:04 am

EastStang wrote:I think you have a substantive due process issue. The bylaws state that punishments for violations must be reasonable and reasonable is not a defined term. If UNC with say 1500 violations (3100 included regular students), and they get the same penalty as we got with one violation, that would be evidence that their penalties are arbitrary and capricious which is usually the standard for these types of cases. Add in OU, Maurice Clarett, PSU, the U, Alabama vs. Jacksonville, UNLV, UCF, SMU and Fresno State and you see the picture, its all seat of the pants kind of stuff. And it creates a competitive advantage and an economic advantage for the P5 conferences. If SMU is out, then their spot in the tournament (should they like they are supposed to) would likely go to a P5 conference school, thus helping say, the Big XII and hurting the American.


Bingo. It is in the NCAA's best interest economically to have one more P5 team in the tournament. P5's are their cash cows. Seems to me that right there shows a bias. Of course they are going to impose a post season ban on a non P5 school that self reported one isolated violation. What do they have to lose. Certainly no accountability. No one holds the NCAA accountable. Certainly not the P5 schools when it comes to these situations. :twisted:
Last edited by smusportspage on Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby SMUstangs22 » Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:06 am

I read somewhere the NCAA should only consider major infranctions within the last 5 years. Can anyone verify this? If so thats a leg to stand on.
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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby smusportspage » Thu Oct 01, 2015 1:36 pm

I have another point....the report itself is very poorly written....so there. Just sayin'. :wink:
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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby EastStang » Thu Oct 01, 2015 2:40 pm

SMUstangs22 wrote:I read somewhere the NCAA should only consider major infranctions within the last 5 years. Can anyone verify this? If so thats a leg to stand on.

It is the NCAA constitution somewhere around Article 19.
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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby Pony64 » Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:19 pm

Topper wrote:
SMUstangs22 wrote:
Stallion wrote:I said we should appeal

I just don't think we have a lawsuit with a chance in hell-although there might be some type of limited injunctive relief sought once all administrative appeals are exhausted if the NCAA for some reason didn't follow its own Bylaws or procedural rules. That would have limited application probably sending it back to the NCAA to abide by those Bylaws/procedures


Was it within their bylaws to consider past transgressions as far back in history as they chose to go?


We should file suit in state court in Dallas and then give the NCAA all kinds of procedural fits. Depose them and make them explain how past transgressions from decades ago have any bearing on this incident and make them explain why the P5 schools seem to be immune from their nonsensical, arbitrary penalties. The legal issues may be on their side, I don't know, but everyone is entitled to their day in court and I think that we would embarrass them and place these nasty bullies on the defensive and force them to settle.


I agree.
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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby SMUstangs22 » Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:37 pm

EastStang wrote:
SMUstangs22 wrote:I read somewhere the NCAA should only consider major infranctions within the last 5 years. Can anyone verify this? If so thats a leg to stand on.

It is the NCAA constitution somewhere around Article 19.


If so then shouldnt this be a major part of the appeal?
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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby Stallion » Thu Oct 01, 2015 6:06 pm

I think that works in the nature of a statute of limitations so that the primary violations must be within that period but prior probations can be considered as an aggravating factor in punishing the school. The NCAA handles hundreds of violations every year-not just Division 1A. I doubt they would make such a fundamental error. Same as criminal law-there is a statute of limitations for assault but that doesn't mean you can't introduce evidence of prior criminal history of the defendant in the punishment phase outside that period. There is a federal 10 year rule with regard to contesting the credibility of a witness but SMU is not a witness
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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby Mustangsabu » Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:16 pm

The writing is terrible.


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Re: Two important points after reading the NCAA report in fu

Postby Rebel10 » Thu Oct 01, 2015 8:19 pm

SMUstangs22 wrote:I read somewhere the NCAA should only consider major infranctions within the last 5 years. Can anyone verify this? If so thats a leg to stand on.

I believe that is in regards to being eligible for the death penalty. After punishment for a violation has been issued out they can't commit another with a 5 year window or they would be eligible for the DP. So now if the basketball or golf team commits another violation within the next 5 years they would be eligible for the death penalty.
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