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I think you have a substantive due process issue. The bylaws state that punishments for violations must be reasonable and reasonable is not a defined term. If UNC with say 1500 violations (3100 included regular students), and they get the same penalty as we got with one violation, that would be evidence that their penalties are arbitrary and capricious which is usually the standard for these types of cases. Add in OU, Maurice Clarett, PSU, the U, Alabama vs. Jacksonville, UNLV, UCF, SMU and Fresno State and you see the picture, its all seat of the pants kind of stuff. And it creates a competitive advantage and an economic advantage for the P5 conferences. If SMU is out, then their spot in the tournament (should they like they are supposed to) would likely go to a P5 conference school, thus helping say, the Big XII and hurting the American.

SMUstangs22 wrote:

Stallion wrote:I said we should appeal

I just don't think we have a lawsuit with a chance in hell-although there might be some type of limited injunctive relief sought once all administrative appeals are exhausted if the NCAA for some reason didn't follow its own Bylaws or procedural rules. That would have limited application probably sending it back to the NCAA to abide by those Bylaws/procedures

Was it within their bylaws to consider past transgressions as far back in history as they chose to go?

We should file suit in state court in Dallas and then give the NCAA all kinds of procedural fits. Depose them and make them explain how past transgressions from decades ago have any bearing on this incident and make them explain why the P5 schools seem to be immune from their nonsensical, arbitrary penalties. The legal issues may be on their side, I don't know, but everyone is entitled to their day in court and I think that we would embarrass them and place these nasty bullies on the defensive and force them to settle.

EastStang wrote:I think you have a substantive due process issue. The bylaws state that punishments for violations must be reasonable and reasonable is not a defined term. If UNC with say 1500 violations (3100 included regular students), and they get the same penalty as we got with one violation, that would be evidence that their penalties are arbitrary and capricious which is usually the standard for these types of cases. Add in OU, Maurice Clarett, PSU, the U, Alabama vs. Jacksonville, UNLV, UCF, SMU and Fresno State and you see the picture, its all seat of the pants kind of stuff. And it creates a competitive advantage and an economic advantage for the P5 conferences. If SMU is out, then their spot in the tournament (should they like they are supposed to) would likely go to a P5 conference school, thus helping say, the Big XII and hurting the American.

Bingo. It is in the NCAA's best interest economically to have one more P5 team in the tournament. P5's are their cash cows. Seems to me that right there shows a bias. Of course they are going to impose a post season ban on a non P5 school that self reported one isolated violation. What do they have to lose. Certainly no accountability. No one holds the NCAA accountable. Certainly not the P5 schools when it comes to these situations.

I read somewhere the NCAA should only consider major infranctions within the last 5 years. Can anyone verify this? If so thats a leg to stand on.

I have another point....the report itself is very poorly written....so there. Just sayin'.

SMUstangs22 wrote:I read somewhere the NCAA should only consider major infranctions within the last 5 years. Can anyone verify this? If so thats a leg to stand on.

It is the NCAA constitution somewhere around Article 19.

Topper wrote:

SMUstangs22 wrote:

Stallion wrote:I said we should appeal

I just don't think we have a lawsuit with a chance in hell-although there might be some type of limited injunctive relief sought once all administrative appeals are exhausted if the NCAA for some reason didn't follow its own Bylaws or procedural rules. That would have limited application probably sending it back to the NCAA to abide by those Bylaws/procedures

Was it within their bylaws to consider past transgressions as far back in history as they chose to go?

We should file suit in state court in Dallas and then give the NCAA all kinds of procedural fits. Depose them and make them explain how past transgressions from decades ago have any bearing on this incident and make them explain why the P5 schools seem to be immune from their nonsensical, arbitrary penalties. The legal issues may be on their side, I don't know, but everyone is entitled to their day in court and I think that we would embarrass them and place these nasty bullies on the defensive and force them to settle.

I agree.

EastStang wrote:

SMUstangs22 wrote:I read somewhere the NCAA should only consider major infranctions within the last 5 years. Can anyone verify this? If so thats a leg to stand on.

It is the NCAA constitution somewhere around Article 19.

If so then shouldnt this be a major part of the appeal?

I think that works in the nature of a statute of limitations so that the primary violations must be within that period but prior probations can be considered as an aggravating factor in punishing the school. The NCAA handles hundreds of violations every year-not just Division 1A. I doubt they would make such a fundamental error. Same as criminal law-there is a statute of limitations for assault but that doesn't mean you can't introduce evidence of prior criminal history of the defendant in the punishment phase outside that period. There is a federal 10 year rule with regard to contesting the credibility of a witness but SMU is not a witness

The writing is terrible.


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SMUstangs22 wrote:I read somewhere the NCAA should only consider major infranctions within the last 5 years. Can anyone verify this? If so thats a leg to stand on.

I believe that is in regards to being eligible for the death penalty. After punishment for a violation has been issued out they can't commit another with a 5 year window or they would be eligible for the DP. So now if the basketball or golf team commits another violation within the next 5 years they would be eligible for the death penalty.