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18-12 regular season...

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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby SMU_Alum11 » Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:03 am

So_Cal given that every ESPN announcer has lobbied for Tank on 1 injury and scholarship reductions keeping him from going on the road and recruiting some good recruits. I think Rick and Miller will give him another year to “right the ship”. They probably have deluded themselves into thinking: well we easily got LB and got us nationally recognized in 2 years so what’s the harm. That’s my cynical state right now with everyone who has a say and no premium account.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby redpony » Fri Feb 01, 2019 8:44 am

if tankovich is not gone at the end of the season then they may as well do a de-seat. take out all but 1000 seats out of Moody as the rest will be empty and only the fanatical 900-1000 will be going to games.
so sad to see a program get trashed by poor coaching and recruiting. But then again, we are SMU and we do what we do.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby PonyKai » Fri Feb 01, 2019 10:42 am

redpony wrote:if tankovich is not gone at the end of the season then they may as well do a de-seat. take out all but 1000 seats out of Moody as the rest will be empty and only the fanatical 900-1000 will be going to games.
so sad to see a program get trashed by poor coaching and recruiting. But then again, we are SMU and we do what we do.


I like the name "Tankovich." Might steal that one. But I take issue with your last sentence. As much as very informed people would have liked to fire Jank at the end of last season (because you could see the irreversible slide towards awfulness), that's really, really, really aggressive--and I think a lot of candidates would pick up on that. So you're stuck with him, through, let's say at a minimum, December 2018. You've got a stronger basis to fire him then, but, are you really disadvantaging yourself by not giving him until the end of the year to hang himself? It undercuts the "sanctions/injuries/sickness" excuses, exposes his poor coaching, makes clear his dreadful recruiting, and lets him whine for another 2 months. I don't think you miss on any candidates waiting an extra 90 days--we'll have plenty of interest, just need to not muck up the hire.

Now, if Jank comes back next year--that really hurts the "we actually want to win" narrative. But even then, maybe the AD is ready to fire him but the guy who pays for it...isn't? Not exactly "we do what we do." Are they going to bake sale their way to the $6-8 million necessary for everything staff related?
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby redpony » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:19 am

PKai- IMO tankovich needs to be gone immediately after the last game this year.
My last sentence refers to how the school has handled things in the past. e.g. JJ trying his best to leave and then stuffing it to us. Too many times the school is complacent and not aggressive enough in their decisions, especially when it comes to 'lawyering up' and not fighting to protect the school.
Yes, we might lose but soon the national corrupt ath. assoc. would learn that we are going to fight them just like most of the schools have and maybe get off of our backs when it comes to picking on a school.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby Charleston Pony » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:43 am

SoCal_Pony wrote:So SMU is now 12-8 (4-4 in conference) with 10 games remaining, including 6 vs the elite of this conference, Cincy and UCF (2 games each), Coogs and Temple and 4 vs mid-tier teams such as ourselves in USF (2 games), UConn & Wichita St.

I’m saying we pull an upset vs 1 on the elite 4 opponents and go 2-2 vs the mid-tier teams, leaving us 15-15 overall and 7-11 in conference.

That would make our likely tourney opponent either Wichita St, UConn or USF. I’ll be generous tonight and say we win our first tourney game before reality sets in during the 2nd round.

That’s 16-16 overall with no postseason invite.

Assuming this is how our season plays out, how quickly does tank get the axe and at what point in time does one get nervous that tank might actually keep his job.


I think your 16-16 scenario is probably the best we could do this year and I really expect a losing season at this point, whether it comes from that 15-15 regular season finish and a 1st round loss in AAC Tourney or that we go 6-10 in conference play.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby PonyKai » Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:03 pm

redpony wrote:PKai- IMO tankovich needs to be gone immediately after the last game this year.
My last sentence refers to how the school has handled things in the past. e.g. JJ trying his best to leave and then stuffing it to us.


So June definitely should have been told to "retire" after his 5-7 season before the plunge into the abyss. I have heard that, at least part of the problem was, our boosters (or at least some of them) loved the guy. Couldn't see past the golfing, the Hawaii condo trips, and the cool stories that he's driving off the cliff. Maybe that's not an issue if the boosters could see the truth instead of what they wanted to see?

Of course then it's the really gray area of what and how an AD should do to properly educate the boosters--but the trouble is we obviously don't get a $43M check from the AAC every year to bankroll most of a coaching staff.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby JasonB » Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:29 pm

PonyKai wrote:
redpony wrote:PKai- IMO tankovich needs to be gone immediately after the last game this year.
My last sentence refers to how the school has handled things in the past. e.g. JJ trying his best to leave and then stuffing it to us.


So June definitely should have been told to "retire" after his 5-7 season before the plunge into the abyss. I have heard that, at least part of the problem was, our boosters (or at least some of them) loved the guy. Couldn't see past the golfing, the Hawaii condo trips, and the cool stories that he's driving off the cliff. Maybe that's not an issue if the boosters could see the truth instead of what they wanted to see?

Of course then it's the really gray area of what and how an AD should do to properly educate the boosters--but the trouble is we obviously don't get a $43M check from the AAC every year to bankroll most of a coaching staff.


Two different situations. June was 5-7 after our first run of bowl games in 25 years. If SMU had fired JJ at that point, they would have been laughed at and it would have been a challenge to pull in good candidates for the job. The external perception would have been horrible. The conspiracy theories about boosters not wanting to pull the plug aren't true. There were certainly voices in the room pushing for a move, but reality set in and decided to wait one year.

Jank already had his excuse season, last year. Plenty of pressure on him coming into this season. Last season he had no restrictions on recruiting, and only got one player who is contributing plus two developmental pieces. Which normally might be fine with a typical roster except Douglas was a bust, Ray is still injured, and we were thin to begin with. Everyone can see the team thinning, and everyone knows what is in the pipeline to come in next season. On top of that, basketball people can see how poorly we are coached, especially on the defensive end.

The only reason Jank survives this season ifs if no boosters step up to pay the buyout. Period.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby redpony » Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:29 pm

PonyKai wrote:
Of course then it's the really gray area of what and how an AD should do to properly educate the boosters--but the trouble is we obviously don't get a $43M check from the AAC every year to bankroll most of a coaching staff.


Some time ago some of us advocated setting up an 'athletic endowment' to fund most of our sports. IIRC Stanford and Vandy have an endowment system.. Hence they are less reliant on 'big dollar' boosters to donate each year. Of course RGT might have a problem with that since it would not include new fountains.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby redpony » Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:36 pm

JasonB wrote:
The only reason Jank survives this season ifs if no boosters step up to pay the buyout. Period.


JB- do you really believe that David Miller et al would let this program slip deeper into the abyss?
If so then what you will see next year is an empty Moody and the finger can be pointed at them.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby skyscraper » Fri Feb 01, 2019 1:21 pm

I would be nervous if he finishes the year at .500.
I think a losing record makes it easier to get rid of him.
Ultimately, it's up to Miller. Bball is a booster club of one.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby PonyKai » Fri Feb 01, 2019 2:39 pm

JasonB wrote:
PonyKai wrote:
redpony wrote:PKai- IMO tankovich needs to be gone immediately after the last game this year.
My last sentence refers to how the school has handled things in the past. e.g. JJ trying his best to leave and then stuffing it to us.


So June definitely should have been told to "retire" after his 5-7 season before the plunge into the abyss. I have heard that, at least part of the problem was, our boosters (or at least some of them) loved the guy. Couldn't see past the golfing, the Hawaii condo trips, and the cool stories that he's driving off the cliff. Maybe that's not an issue if the boosters could see the truth instead of what they wanted to see?

Of course then it's the really gray area of what and how an AD should do to properly educate the boosters--but the trouble is we obviously don't get a $43M check from the AAC every year to bankroll most of a coaching staff.


Two different situations. June was 5-7 after our first run of bowl games in 25 years. If SMU had fired JJ at that point, they would have been laughed at and it would have been a challenge to pull in good candidates for the job. The external perception would have been horrible. The conspiracy theories about boosters not wanting to pull the plug aren't true. There were certainly voices in the room pushing for a move, but reality set in and decided to wait one year.


Hence my deployment of the term "retire." I think after that season a well-educated AD and boosters could have approached June, explained that they knew he (i) had been mailing it in for two years, (ii) was essentially collecting pay without working, (iii) remind him they knew he was recruiting for ASU on SMU's dime, and (iv) that he could either leave now, voluntarily, or tarnish his rep and get fired after the coming disaster. Now, does he leave? Is that an unorthodox and somewhat risky proposition? Probably. And June probably says bite me. I'm making $2M a year. I may also be guilty of engaging in fanciful wishcasting as to how the world should work that's completely divorced with how good businesses are run.

But I think they're fairly comparable. The uneducated follower sees June took us to 4 bowl games after a 25 year drought. The uneducated follower sees Jank led us to, what, our winning-est season ever and a rare NCAA appearance? I think you have a great argument that, record wise, Jank's "5-7" season was last year. This is shaping up to be much worse. Next year is the "1-11" disaster. But in terms of seeing the decay in the program and obvious grounds for immediate termination, they're roughly comparable, in my view to the well-educated fan.

At least June didn't whine and complain about the same thing over and over again. Even the "lights" excuse was a one-time deal (and SMU even put new lights in).
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby sadderbudweiser » Fri Feb 01, 2019 5:20 pm

We are heading into the “mission impossible “ section of the schedule. We are about to get creamed and it will get even worse as the season wears on and takes its toll on a six man rotation. You can already see signs of Feron’s freshman fade. Chaggy and McMurray have some good and some REALLY bad days. Do we stay injury free or does William D become a starter? I’m telling you.... we done here.

We just shot a c@nt hair below 50% against a poor team..... and lost. Our defense sucks.

The path will be clear in Six weeks.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby JasonB » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:46 pm

redpony wrote:
JasonB wrote:
The only reason Jank survives this season ifs if no boosters step up to pay the buyout. Period.


JB- do you really believe that David Miller et al would let this program slip deeper into the abyss?
If so then what you will see next year is an empty Moody and the finger can be pointed at them.


No, I think Jank is gone. I'm just saying that if for some reason he isn't gone, it won't be because nobody sees the light. It will be because they can't find a donor for the buyout.

And I do believe that June was approached to see if he wanted to retire. He said no. But he knew the gig was up and was part of the reason he stepped down after one game.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby Charleston Pony » Sat Feb 02, 2019 11:38 pm

After an impressive effort at Wichita and Cincinnati this week, our guys come home and will have to beat both USF and UCF this week to have any hope of that 18-12 regular season and realistically, our guys will have to win both these games to have any hope of going 8-10 in AAC play and 16-14 overall in the regular season to guarantee a winning record. I don't see it happening but after the way they played this week, who knows. Sure hope we see decent crowds at Moody because these guys are playing their guts out.
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Re: 18-12 regular season...

Postby sadderbudweiser » Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:03 am

Charleston Pony wrote:After an impressive effort at Wichita and Cincinnati this week, our guys come home and will have to beat both USF and UCF this week to have any hope of that 18-12 regular season and realistically, our guys will have to win both these games to have any hope of going 8-10 in AAC play and 16-14 overall in the regular season to guarantee a winning record. I don't see it happening but after the way they played this week, who knows. Sure hope we see decent crowds at Moody because these guys are playing their guts out.



Once, just once, it would be nice to hear the person responsible say....

“Those last two losses are on me. I could have recruited better. Then we’d have some depth and not tire and make dumb mistakes down the strech. And, I could manage the closing minutes of games better too. Maybe I could draw up a play or something.”
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