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Re: Plano Campus

Postby dr. rick » Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:38 pm

I have wanted to not reply to this thread, as there i think it is amusing with a lot of bad information here. so, let me respond to a couple of points (i don't have the energy or time to do a complete counter-point):
- tenure-track faculty can not get promoted without teaching MBA, PMBA, EMBA classes. So, yes, every one wants these credentials. It also makes the professor more attractive to other schools.
- most schools that have a satellite campus (see, e.g., Arizona) have a dedicated faculty to the satellite. why? when i teach a class, i like to be there an hour before class - and at Plano the classes start at 6:30 pm for the working students. So, i have to go through rush hour... and the classes are only appealing to faculty that live in Plano or surrounding areas.
- with the hiring of the new provost position for continuing education, SMU can fix a lot of problems where different departments are competing against each other. For instance, both cox and meadows offered continuing education certificate in marketing.
- SMU has out priced themselves in the market. We have a better brand. Think of it this way. Suppose you prefer Coke, but it is priced at $20. However, Pepsi is priced at $5. Which one do you chose? the administration is aware of the problem and making painful adjustments.
- we do not have a problem with undergraduates, as our acceptance rate has stayed under 50% (a key metric by the way).
- Given Plano is so close to AT Kearny....
- I won't comment on strategy suggestions, as they are opinions, and i don't troll.
- i agree that the use of the campus has been poor.
- Or pricing of certificate programs is actually below market.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby Greenwich Pony » Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:05 pm

Thank you for posting Dr Rick. Your response makes a lot of sense, especially with the dearth of information from the administration yet again.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby Greenwich Pony » Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:14 pm

Oh, someone above pointed out that UTD is 200 spots behind us in one of the rankings and that we should not be worried. The problem is three-fold: 1) UTD may not be as good, but they have a clear goal and they have the reputation of being aggressive and the up-and-coming school in Dallas amongst the media, not us. We are seen as stagnant or treading water by some, and the school that does less with more by most. 2) Their business and engineering programs are fast approaching us in the rear view mirror, if not neck-and-neck in a very short period of time. 3) We should academically "own" Dallas- we should be Dallas' academic face for research and donors. If we sit back on our laurels, we will get passed by.

I'm not trying to troll or pick any fights. I love SMU and I think we should be challenging Rice for Texas supremacy, or at least making Tulane sweat. I believe we should be Dallas' answer to Northwestern but I see no coherent plan to really achieve that. None of that is happening. In fact I don't see a great deal of planning or basic corporate competence and a lot of opacity and it is getting frustrating.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby dr. rick » Fri Mar 02, 2018 4:46 pm

i am feeling a little feisty today... lol.) UTD is not our problem. There are many major cities with multiple programs (Chicago: Northwestern & U Chicago, LA: USC & UCLA, SF: Stanford and Berkeley, NY: NYU and Columbia, ...) - my apologies for any universities that are not named. The question is how do these powerhouses co-exist? IMHO, they have a value proposition. That is, why would I attend UCLA vs. USC? Until SMU figures this out, we will have problems.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby midwestpony » Sat Mar 03, 2018 12:28 am

dr rick? What would you say SMU's value proposition is these days.As a stenior on the way out I struggle with that. I've had a great experience (maybe a bit more expensive than it should have been), Had tons of leadership opportunities, and am walking into a great job, but I feel just about anyone can offer that these days. I would love to hear your perspective.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby dr. rick » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:08 am

okay, you are asking me to venture into opinion... IMHO, our tag line of "world changers are shaped here" does not make sense and does not inspire students to come here. look at our strengths: students coming out of Lyle make as much as students coming out of Berkeley, Medows is ranked in the top 5 in the world, some undergraduates make 6 figures coming out of Cox, the average MBA salary is in 6 figures, president scholars go to Stanford and Harvard Law, our graduates are CEO's and white house employees, ... No, not every university can replicate these achievements. Look at collins center donors. in a nutshell, i think our value proposition is the network of successful graduates. I have two children that graduated from SMU (one in English, one in finance), and both are successful. i have no idea how well SMU markets to our graduates, but we have a very strong network.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby deucetz » Sat Mar 03, 2018 11:58 am

I think the only way to right the ship in terms of value proposition is outspend on scholarships and faculty in key areas while trying to aggressively reduce overhead. The way some alums want us to spend on our football program to be P5, SMU needs to spend on students and faculty. I think to ideally do this, SMU would need to reduce the student size. Obviously recruit all the companies in the area to help fund our goals, to help supplement alumni donations.

SMU, Baylor and TCU are the same in most people’s eyes and a step below UT and A&am in terms of academic perception by many. Rice outspent people early on and got a rep that stuck.

I don’t think any of this will happen with the bloated board and the stagnant administration that can only build the physical plant of the university.
Last edited by deucetz on Sun Mar 04, 2018 10:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby midwestpony » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:47 pm

Thank you dr. rick I agree with most everything you said in regards to successful students and the network. Surprised we keep shoving the world changers thing seems like a cheesy gimmick. Also, not a fan of it being on every piece of marketing material and the website.

Also deucetz I agree more focus on students is a good idea. If you look at the perceptions yes the prestige thing is true - people thing those are better institutions (ut and a&m). If you check out our student profile though for admitted students its crazy that we have some of the best students coming to SMU. Hopefully the perception would shift, just not sure how (other than cutting the costs and increasing scholarships/faculty salaries).
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby Charleston Pony » Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:31 am

"World changers" >>> "There's no such thing as a lesser person" but I agree our marketing leaves something to be desired
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby tristatecoog » Thu Mar 08, 2018 12:42 pm

I recruited UT and SMU BBAs for a large Metroplex company. Both are pretty equal but you have more numbers at UT. TCU and A&M seem about the same. TCU has some gems but a good bit of coal. Same with A&M but you have to wade through a lot of applicants.

Proposition is UT type education with smaller classes and more attention. SMU has been trying to offer more scholarships to make the cost for top scholars comparable to that of UT. Also, SMU only has about 2,500 undergrads from Texas while UT has about 36K.

I'm hoping that SMU's graduation rate catches up and improves the ranking.

People like midwestpony and Dr Rick's kids are the proof that SMU grads are very successful. That's certainly not as true at Big State U or at lesser rated private Us.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby 1017 Mustang » Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:06 pm

Yeah SMU's unique value add seems to be compound:

Size

Small class sizes--I believe the 1 to 11 ratio still stands
"Intimate" student body--it's easy to know most people in your class
Nationally renowned Liberal Arts and Business Alumni/Professors who are welcoming to networking--go to any major city on the east coast or west coast and there are numerous SMU alumni in every class thriving in competitive and desirable jobs. We should advertise these people more often in prospective student materials instead of our fountains and football.

Texas

We are an international gateway to the state of Texas--most of our students aren't from here but upon graduation have a key to getting your foot in the door pretty much anywhere in the state. That has value if it's marketed well enough to target markets in big cities across the US. It happens now--but just through word of mouth.

Opportunities

Expand our research and technical/engineering footprint--we can only move into the top tier institutions when we start making medical, engineering, chemical and science breakthroughs as a university. These are the breakthroughs that drive our economy long term and if SMU starts becoming known as the place that drives this growth it will take our national and international prestige to the next level. The cool thing about this piece is that it can be facilitated through the grad school too--even though it would require some culture changes for the university.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby gostangs » Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:15 pm

1017 Mustang wrote:Yeah SMU's unique value add seems to be compound:

Size

Small class sizes--I believe the 1 to 11 ratio still stands
"Intimate" student body--it's easy to know most people in your class
Nationally renowned Liberal Arts and Business Alumni/Professors who are welcoming to networking--go to any major city on the east coast or west coast and there are numerous SMU alumni in every class thriving in competitive and desirable jobs. We should advertise these people more often in prospective student materials instead of our fountains and football.

Texas

We are an international gateway to the state of Texas--most of our students aren't from here but upon graduation have a key to getting your foot in the door pretty much anywhere in the state. That has value if it's marketed well enough to target markets in big cities across the US. It happens now--but just through word of mouth.

Opportunities

Expand our research and technical/engineering footprint--we can only move into the top tier institutions when we start making medical, engineering, chemical and science breakthroughs as a university. These are the breakthroughs that drive our economy long term and if SMU starts becoming known as the place that drives this growth it will take our national and international prestige to the next level. The cool thing about this piece is that it can be facilitated through the grad school too--even though it would require some culture changes for the university.


I cant agree with you enough. Think about the basic school structure of SMU:
Law School - average in ranking, in a field that is flat to shrinking. Not great prospects for improvement and not sure many would care if it did.
Liberal Arts - Pretty strong, but with the exception of economics and the sciences, not fields that are growing and are in fact shrinking. Why pay 200k plus to be a history major?
Perkins Theology - Flat to shrinking "industry" Having a top 5 school here would not really do much for the university and certainly would not be worth it. Not even sure we should keep this as a school any longer if we can get away with it.
Simmons Education - Emerging as a great school and there is demand for education - but obviously the math is tough. 200k for undergrad degree for jobs that pay 40k tops is a rough equation.
Meadows school of the arts - nationally known in certain key portions but could use more improvement across the board. A historical strength for SMU though.
Lyle Engineering - Getting some good traction but a long way to go to get really relevant nationally. It is absolutely critical this becomes a strength - and fast
Cox Business - The Bell cow. Half our undergrads come to SMU to get in this school, and only a third are successful in doing that. Undergrad student quality is the best in the state for business (Rice would be better if they had undergrad business). MBA has some work to do - top 50 needs to be top 20 in the worst way. We should PILE money in to scholarships here and fast or we will lose our brand for the entire university.

So the biggest issue is SMU only gets meaningful support from the alums in 2.5 of our 7 schools. Cox, Lyle and half of Dedman Liberal arts. Dedman law gives pretty well but only to the law school. The others graduate and never look back. We need to expand the givers and give them more resources (Lyle and Cox) - and possibly make the medical portion of Dedman Liberal arts its own school with many more resources.

In addition - SMU has stayed the same size in attempts to climb in quality for a VERY long time. We need to be more relevant for lots of reasons - which means grow over 5 years to 8k undergrad students. We can do it and maintain or improve quality by forgetting new buildings and raising a ton for new scholarships or for research initiatives.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby RGV Pony » Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:34 pm

gostangs wrote:
1017 Mustang wrote:Yeah SMU's unique value add seems to be compound:

Size

Small class sizes--I believe the 1 to 11 ratio still stands
"Intimate" student body--it's easy to know most people in your class
Nationally renowned Liberal Arts and Business Alumni/Professors who are welcoming to networking--go to any major city on the east coast or west coast and there are numerous SMU alumni in every class thriving in competitive and desirable jobs. We should advertise these people more often in prospective student materials instead of our fountains and football.

Texas

We are an international gateway to the state of Texas--most of our students aren't from here but upon graduation have a key to getting your foot in the door pretty much anywhere in the state. That has value if it's marketed well enough to target markets in big cities across the US. It happens now--but just through word of mouth.

Opportunities

Expand our research and technical/engineering footprint--we can only move into the top tier institutions when we start making medical, engineering, chemical and science breakthroughs as a university. These are the breakthroughs that drive our economy long term and if SMU starts becoming known as the place that drives this growth it will take our national and international prestige to the next level. The cool thing about this piece is that it can be facilitated through the grad school too--even though it would require some culture changes for the university.


I cant agree with you enough. Think about the basic school structure of SMU:
Law School - average in ranking, in a field that is flat to shrinking. Not great prospects for improvement and not sure many would care if it did.
Liberal Arts - Pretty strong, but with the exception of economics and the sciences, not fields that are growing and are in fact shrinking. Why pay 200k plus to be a history major?
Perkins Theology - Flat to shrinking "industry" Having a top 5 school here would not really do much for the university and certainly would not be worth it. Not even sure we should keep this as a school any longer if we can get away with it.
Simmons Education - Emerging as a great school and there is demand for education - but obviously the math is tough. 200k for undergrad degree for jobs that pay 40k tops is a rough equation.
Meadows school of the arts - nationally known in certain key portions but could use more improvement across the board. A historical strength for SMU though.
Lyle Engineering - Getting some good traction but a long way to go to get really relevant nationally. It is absolutely critical this becomes a strength - and fast
Cox Business - The Bell cow. Half our undergrads come to SMU to get in this school, and only a third are successful in doing that. Undergrad student quality is the best in the state for business (Rice would be better if they had undergrad business). MBA has some work to do - top 50 needs to be top 20 in the worst way. We should PILE money in to scholarships here and fast or we will lose our brand for the entire university.

So the biggest issue is SMU only gets meaningful support from the alums in 2.5 of our 7 schools. Cox, Lyle and half of Dedman Liberal arts. Dedman law gives pretty well but only to the law school. The others graduate and never look back. We need to expand the givers and give them more resources (Lyle and Cox) - and possibly make the medical portion of Dedman Liberal arts its own school with many more resources.

In addition - SMU has stayed the same size in attempts to climb in quality for a VERY long time. We need to be more relevant for lots of reasons - which means grow over 5 years to 8k undergrad students. We can do it and maintain or improve quality by forgetting new buildings and raising a ton for new scholarships or for research initiatives.
Great example of your point as brought up by another poster can be seen in the "Mustangs give back" campaign. Athletics, Cox, Lyle, Band had the most $ quickest.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby tristatecoog » Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:40 pm

https://poetsandquantsforundergrads.com ... rograms/2/

Why is McCombs a Top 10 undergrad b-school vs. Cox with better stats?
According to the linked rankings, would Boston U, Boston College, Emory, etc. also be schools that should expand their b-schools?

Like Notre Dame, with an awesome b-school, can't you be good in all areas?

Seems too much like Babson at some point.

I'm in business and it's interesting how worked up people can be about getting into an undergrad b-school. People really want a guarantee so they'll go to a second 50 school (like IU, OU, TCU) for their guaranteed b-school admission vs. going to the top 60 school for a great education.
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Re: Plano Campus

Postby AfricanMustang » Mon Mar 12, 2018 1:53 pm

The new facility will house the University’s Linda and Mitch Hart eCenter, which includes SMU Guildhall, the world’s top-ranked graduate game design program. The building will be located on SMU’s main campus at the corner of McFarlin Boulevard and Airline Road.

“Thanks to the Harts’ generosity, we are one step closer to creating a world-class center for research and innovation on our campus,” said R. Gerald Turner, president of SMU. “We are excited about the synergies we’ll derive from bringing advanced computer programs together under one roof.”

In 2000, the Harts made a generous gift to establish the Hart eCenter, currently located at SMU-in-Plano, as well as to endow the eCenter’s directorship.

https://www.smu.edu/News/2018/hart-gift-12march2018
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