Big East movement

[EastStang]

The only thing that would make this a pure double entendre thread would be if Dukie and Duke Blue Blood were to post on this thread. Actually TCU and Houston would add value to the Big East football brand for two reasons. (1) The Big East stinks. (2) They add entry into the Texas recruiting market for BE football with exposure in two major TV markets. Many years ago, I thought that if SMU could get its act together, that it would be a BE target and people laughed at that. Its not so funny now. But I do agree with one thing. TCU's choice in conferences does not bode well for them in the long term. They leave for greener pastures only to find toxic waste bubbling up after they get there. The BE has a lot of issues which could lead to a huge decimation of the conference if the Big Ten decides to make a move further east to NJ, Pitt, WV, or Syracuse. Then the BE will become what CUSA was, UH, TCU, LU, CU, ECU, USF, and three other schools, perhaps UCF, Marshall and UAB. Now they're in WAC 2 and then they'll be in CUSA 2. I hope the powers that be in Houston and TCU have enough sense to make sure that if teams leave, they pay in blood. But when you're offered the keys to the penthouse, how do you turn them down?

[NavyCrimson]

Well said.

[Dukie]

The only thing that would make this a pure double entendre thread would be if Dukie and Duke Blue Blood were to post on this thread. Actually TCU and Houston would add value to the Big East football brand for two reasons. (1) The Big East stinks. (2) They add entry into the Texas recruiting market for BE football with exposure in two major TV markets. Many years ago, I thought that if SMU could get its act together, that it would be a BE target and people laughed at that. Its not so funny now. But I do agree with one thing. TCU's choice in conferences does not bode well for them in the long term. They leave for greener pastures only to find toxic waste bubbling up after they get there. The BE has a lot of issues which could lead to a huge decimation of the conference if the Big Ten decides to make a move further east to NJ, Pitt, WV, or Syracuse. Then the BE will become what CUSA was, UH, TCU, LU, CU, ECU, USF, and three other schools, perhaps UCF, Marshall and UAB. Now they're in WAC 2 and then they'll be in CUSA 2. I hope the powers that be in Houston and TCU have enough sense to make sure that if teams leave, they pay in blood. But when you're offered the keys to the penthouse, how do you turn them down?

East, you and I have more in common (Go Tribe!) than DBB and I do, but anyway ... one thing I can't figure out about all these Big East football invites is how the heck they will make basketball work? They're already at WAC 1995 numbers for basketball, so does it become a 20-team league? How well do you think Georgetown will like having to travel to Fort Worth and getting fewer trips to Storrs and Syracuse?

On the other hand, I disagree with the criticism of TCU's moves. It was crushing to SMU when TCU went to CUSA and left us in the WAC (anyone else remember the original ESPN headline that said both schools were going, and then it got pulled and replaced with a "TCU only" article?). I do think it's funny that they got back in bed with the Airport Five and now seem to be getting screwed yet again. But SMU would and should have made all the moves TCU has, if they had been available to SMU.

[PonyTime]

But SMU would and should have made all the moves TCU has, if they had been available to SMU.

I cannot disagree more. Had SMU made these moves, we would not have gone to the Hawaii Bowl last year and we would all be waiting for the big Mo that we are now experiencing.

I am glad that we are not in a conference where we are at the mercy of a bunch of Utah schools.

[NavyCrimson]

Pony Time: "I am glad that we are not in a conference where we are at the mercy of a bunch of Utah schools."

You can bet they're saying the same for the "Texas" schools, as well. We've heard that comment regarding the little 12-north for the past 10+ years, hadn't we? The Utah schools are winners, can we blame them?

[RednBlue11]

i think that many of us have much higher opinions of out university than many people outside of SMU do w/ regards to our athletic program.

that isnt wrong, but perhaps narrow

[HB Pony Dad]

I'm sure the Big East is salivating to play Basketball in Fort Worth!

[RednBlue11]

I'm sure the Big East is salivating to play Basketball in Fort Worth!

[EastStang]

I still think this is going to be a football only invite. If they add Villanova for football, then you're looking at 17 teams for basketball, which ain't gonna happen. And the basketball schools are not going to want to split the pie with TCU. Remember in the BE basketball brings in as much as football if not more.

[Big Hoss]

Nothing against TCU, UH, ECU, etc., but it is a statement about how far the Big East is behind the other BCS conferences that these schools would be considered as "adding value." I'm a great admirer of TCU's program, but I can't imagine any of the other BCS conferences looking at TCU and thinking that they would add any value whatsoever with respect to the factors driving realigment (money and TV). If there is another big shakeup and certain BCS conferences start expanding beyond 12 teams into super-conferences, I don't see the Big East being invited to the dance.

Agreed. The ACC might become the ugly stepsister in a world with 4 super-conferences, replacing the Big East's role in the current 6. I think they are probably considered the stronger conference since they already have Va Tech, Clemson, Fla State, Miami, Ga Tech, etc., which are all relatively decent football schools. Granted, how many of those might get pilfered when the SEC expands is unknown, but you have to think that some of them aren't at the top of the SEC's list.

[West Coast Johnny]

I hope TCU goes Big East.

The last few times a "stellar" conference came calling and they jumped ship it worked out great for them . . .

Upon Moving to WAC:
Who wouldn't want to be in a conference with BYU and Utah?

Upon Moving to CUSA:
Who wouldn't want to be in a conference with Louisville and Cincinnati?

Upon Moving to MWC:
Who wouldn't want to be in a conference with BYU, and Utah?

Now:
Who wouldn't want to be in a conference with Louisville and Cincinnati?

As a TCU fan, its annoying when your conference falls apart around you, but we shrug it off honestly. We've changed conferences more than anyone and seem to land on our feet each time. Our self-esteem isn't tied to a conference like Baylor's is. Baylor's entire sense of self-worth is tied to its conference affiliation. The fact is that conference affiliation can be depressing when you're dealing with the Whorn's dictatorship. Baylor would be so much happier in C-USA than they are now, but they can't see the forrest because trees are in the way. The downside to being in a geographically distant conference is that we have no local rivalries for conference games. I can't wait for Texas to go independent which will force a reorganization in the state's football conferences, and I see SMU, TCU, Baylor with a few Big 12 N., C-USA, and MWC schools thrown in comprising a nice regional conference without the bullies.

[RednBlue11]

I hope TCU goes Big East.

The last few times a "stellar" conference came calling and they jumped ship it worked out great for them . . .

Upon Moving to WAC:
Who wouldn't want to be in a conference with BYU and Utah?

Upon Moving to CUSA:
Who wouldn't want to be in a conference with Louisville and Cincinnati?

Upon Moving to MWC:
Who wouldn't want to be in a conference with BYU, and Utah?

Now:
Who wouldn't want to be in a conference with Louisville and Cincinnati?

As a TCU fan, its annoying when your conference falls apart around you, but we shrug it off honestly. We've changed conferences more than anyone and seem to land on our feet each time. Our self-esteem isn't tied to a conference like Baylor's is. Baylor's entire sense of self-worth is tied to its conference affiliation. The fact is that conference affiliation can be depressing when you're dealing with the Whorn's dictatorship. Baylor would be so much happier in C-USA than they are now, but they can't see the forrest because trees are in the way. The downside to being in a geographically distant conference is that we have no local rivalries for conference games. I can't wait for Texas to go independent which will force a reorganization in the state's football conferences, and I see SMU, TCU, Baylor with a few Big 12 N., C-USA, and MWC schools thrown in comprising a nice regional conference without the bullies.

the funny thing is that their "worth" is going to be pretty intangible from now on....only the top couple schools left in the B12 are getting any TV money

[Dukie]

But SMU would and should have made all the moves TCU has, if they had been available to SMU.

I cannot disagree more. Had SMU made these moves, we would not have gone to the Hawaii Bowl last year and we would all be waiting for the big Mo that we are now experiencing.

I am glad that we are not in a conference where we are at the mercy of a bunch of Utah schools.

So you're telling me that you'd take the remaining WAC schools in 2000 over CUSA 2000, and you'd take CUSA 2005 over MWC 2005? That's not rational, and it doesn't reflect what SMU desperately (and IMO, correctly) wanted at the time those realignments took place.

The Hawaii Bowl was great but is irrelevant to this discussion of conferences. You can't have known what would happen in the 2009 bowl season when trying to assess conference choices in 2000 (or in 2005), nor do you even know today what counterfactual "alternate universe" bowl(s) SMU could have gotten to if the conferences had shaken out differently.

[ponyboy]

Actually, I do know that. But I'm not tellin'.

[PonyTime]

The Hawaii Bowl was great but is irrelevant to this discussion of conferences. You can't have known what would happen in the 2009 bowl season when trying to assess conference choices in 2000 (or in 2005), nor do you even know today what counterfactual "alternate universe" bowl(s) SMU could have gotten to if the conferences had shaken out differently.

In my opinion SMU needed to get beat down, left out and stomped upon in order to get to where they are now. Had these things not happened - the SMU administration would not have changed their ways at all and we would still be sitting at the bottom of whatever conference we would be associated with in whatever alternate universe you choose with Phil Bennett as our HC and the AK Pye model running the show.