Baylor Band Tactics Legal?

[SMU Football Blog]

Does anybody have band stats? The number of members from 1985; 1995; 2005? Those would be the years I am most interested in. Pre-DP; the year before Copeland was hired; and today.

[WorldStang]

Why doesn't our band join the school of music making it easier for kids to play in the band?

Here is a shocker for you. Anybody that plays an instrument as SMU can join the Mustang Band. As I posted earlier, it is primarily a volunteer organization.

In all actuality, people from the music school can join the Mustang Band, but the professors in the music school discourage their participation. That's what I said, the music school DISCOURAGES music majors from playing in the marching band. So putting the Mustang Band in the music school would completely distroy this organization. It was tried 10 years ago. The music school did not want the band and the band did not want the music school. End of story.

This is extremely unusual isn't it? Am I wrong to think that most schools encourage and/or come together with the school band? What is it with our school!? Someone just needs to hit the reset button on so many things at SMU.

[MustangSally]

Meadows sees itself as a 'conservatory-type' music school geared towards classical training, with very focused curriculum and individual support. You don't come to SMU and decide to be a music major, you audition a year in advance for one of the few spots on your instrument. Most music schools have big marching bands because they focus on the music education aspect of their school. Thus, kids that want to be band directors usually join the marching band, it's like a lab for learning how to direct it later in their career. Meadows has music education as a major but it's not the focus of the program at all. Who would pay 35k a year to train for a job that will pay 25k? Their whole goal is to produce professional musicians. I think 2 years ago at graduation, I looked through the list of graduates and counted TWO instrumental music ed. majors. In addition, the band already has several members that are music ed majors.

Would joining Meadows get a few people to join band? Doubtful, since they already have the choice to join it now and they already get an ensemble class credit for it. If it was part of Meadows they'd probably require the music ed majors to do it, and as I pointed out there's not many of them to begin with, and many of them are already in the band.

I'll bet if SMU wasn't so bad at football, joining band wouldn't be that bad an idea. The winless season led to a ton of people being completely fed up with it. Think about this: at SMU I perfromed at probably 40 football games, and 150 bball games, yet I never saw a single conference champ or postseason game. That can make you rethink why you joined the organization.

[MustangSally]

Blog, I'll try and get you some numbers.

WorldStang - my point is not to hammer you into accepting that the band enjoys being small. The band alumni, directors, members would love it to be DOUBLE its current size, there are just so many factors that keep the band limited in its options.

[MizterTea]

Baylor has a band ?!

[RGV Pony]

This thread is DEFINITELY football related. Crappy football team=tiny band. 200-400 member marching band=big time football.

What is it the other private schools like BYU, Notre Dame, Baylor, and TCU do to get more than 60 members? Anyone?

[Peruna_Ate_My_Rolex]

This thread is DEFINITELY football related. Crappy football team=tiny band. 200-400 member marching band=big time football.

What is it the other private schools like BYU, Notre Dame, Baylor, and TCU do to get more than 60 members? Anyone?

Again, it goes back to the fact that those schools require their music majors to be in marching band. For most of the students that are in those groups have to be there. Not necessarily because they want to but because they have to...basically, a captive audience. Since The Mustang Band is NOT made of people who have to be there just to fill some credit to graduate, they don't have the size of the bands from those universities.

Anyway, You don't need 200+ people to be a good band. If the Mustang Band had enough funds to get at least 90 people on the field, then it would be just as good as anything out there because you would have 90 kids that would want to be there...not because they have to be there.
Besides, the band in the Pre-DP era did not have more than 96 people on the field.

[RGV Pony]

Well, how much funding are you talking? 16k/yr for an add'l 40 guys? Don't think that's possible. 32k/yr? No wealthy band programs alums out there to endow the thing?

[Deep Purple]

Great picture, Peruna AMR. That grass seed stunt still has to rank as one of the greatest rivalry pranks of all time.

[BarbaraAnn]

I just loved band way too much. I have no idea what can be done. At this point, most people that give money will be redirected to the Mustang Band Partnership. This organization is focusing on the growth of the band through scholarships, and is also taking part in the effort for the new bandhall.

I just hope it will turn around.

[Htown Bear]

What is it the other private schools like BYU, Notre Dame, Baylor, and TCU do to get more than 60 members? Anyone?

As the above poster mentioned you have to have an agreeement where Music majors are required to spend at least a few years in the Marching Band.

The 2nd part is agressive recruiting. In todays day and age with the cost of private education rising you have to be agressive in getting the size of your band up.

I don't know if they still do, but Baylor used to host the state marching competition, and their band always played an exhibition show at the end of the contest. They were very agressive in recruiting prospective students. Its gotten to the point where in the last few years, A&M has sent representatives of the CORPS to also try and recruit prospective band members.

If SMU is serious about fielding a marching band with more than 60 people, it would probably be a good idea to go to the State Marching Contest and have a booth set up that talks about the virtues of SMU, the music school, and the benefit of being in the marching band.

3rd. You have to have the backing of the administration and the athletic department.
The Baylor Athletic department gives the Marching Band around 10k every year for travel, lodging and food. The Administration gives around 25k so the cost for regular undergrads won't be that high. That also goes toward things such has Banquets, uniforms, instrument upkeep.

Without that financial backing a private school like Baylor would have to charge people to be in the band, and they wouldn't have more than about 150.

[MrMustang1965]

SMU's administration is doing everything possible to lower two of its most visible programs that I've known and loved over the years: the football program & the Mustang Band. It sickens me.

[MustangSally]

HTown Bear,
You make some good points, especially about hosting band competitions and exhibiting. Since SMU marches a very old style (squads of 4, high step, symmetrical formations "moffitt" style), the previous director wanted to steer clear of showing that off. He thought it scared people away from wanting to be in the band at SMU. Whether he was right or not, the band didn't march outside of home games and some away games.

It might be smart to at least set up a booth at a competition and sell "what we are". If the modern, DCI-style marching is too different from the SMU style, then I think the band might even benefit from doing an exhibition or hosting a "showband" style competition. Almost all DISD bands march high step, 4 man squads, etc., so they'd think the SMU band was at least interesting because of the similar marching style.

2 Years ago, they brought back "Band Day" where high school bands come and play on the field and in the stands with the SMU band. They used to do this for years, but stopped for whatever reason. This is a great recruiting tool. In '03, I think we had 6 or 7 bands come, and last year it doubled to 12 or 13, and all the kids loved it. The problem is, you aren't going to convince a 400 person, state-finals level band (Duncanville, Allen) to come play with the SMU band for a game. They're too busy competing, it'd be a joke for them. So the bands we did get were split about half DISD and half 2A and 3A bands from nearby like Royse City, etc. Even the Bryan Adams Cougar Band was there (they dress and march like the SMU band, but green stripes instead of red). If they can continue to grow the band day, that's a great way to get local kids to see the band in action, not just in a field show, but also in the stands, doing the cheers and all the other fun stuff.

Keep in mind the SMU band is probably at its smallest this year, with about 60, but the freshmen class was way bigger than last few years, so the band will definitely start growing. An 80 or 90 person band sounds like a whimpy goal, but that's 30-50% bigger than the current setup and would add alot to the overall look and volume.

[mrydel]

I would like to get back to the original question. Is it illegal for the Baylor Band to do what they did? I in no way want this to be any kind of excuse for losing the game but would like to know the answer. At first I thought the rule must be no playing while the team was huddling which of course would not pertain to us since we go no huddle. But I did actually believe that neither band could play from placement of the ball until the ball was snapped. I thought I remembered this because I personally thought it a bad rule. Next, if it can occur until the team complains, then this was a significant error on our part by not pointing it out to the officials. The noise on the south end of the stadium from the Baylor band was very loud while play calling was being done. Not only would it have helped the offense, but it would have quieted the Baylors fans somewhat. Just curious as to whether or not anyone knows the actual rule on this. It could come into play again sometime. Thanks.

[michiganstang]

[quote="MustangSally"]Meadows sees itself as a 'conservatory-type' music school geared towards classical training, with very focused curriculum and individual support. You don't come to SMU and decide to be a music major, you audition a year in advance for one of the few spots on your instrument.

As a former Meadow's student (BM '99, MM '01) I will say that is not so much a case of Mustang Band membership being discouraged as of band itself not even showing up on the radar. The program for instrumental majors is completely orchestral in nature, even the Wind Ensemble plays not "traditional" band music but (mainly) contemporary music for winds, augmented by the occasional Mozart, etc. (except at graduation). I don't think the lack of marching band support is unique for music schools of the 'conservatory' type at private schools - I have many musician friends who attended Northwestern, for example, and none of them were in the marching band there. (The Mustang Band isn't all that is affected by this -both the University Band and the Jazz Band seemed to be mostly non-music majors while I was at SMU - just a function of what the department focused on).

Not that pony spirit isn't strong in Meadows! My friends and I never missed a football game and rarely missed a basketball game. I recall one particular BB game where some of us came right from an orchestra concert in our tuxs!