Thoughts on Kyle's struggles?

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[Cardinal Puff]

Let's be grateful that Padron has done well to limit the int's. Let's also admit that it takes a while to get in synch with a different set of receivers. The only mechanical issue I see is sometimes when he is throwing with his weight on the back of his feet, those are the passes just seem to sail over the receiver. Padron passing while moving forward has been on the money-just could do a little better in seeing the best available receiver.

[rich59]

Oh well, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.

I watched Padron closely on TV Saturday and he does not seem to be stepping into his throws. I don't have the film but it seems like he was doing much better at that in the game against Nevada.

[cutter]

rich59,
just getting my chuckles.
I, too, cringe a bit whenever I hear some announcer call a shuffle pass. but, I hold my breath for a few minutes and it all seems better.
is it Friday, yet?

[couch 'em]

Someone really should bring back the single wing in college football. Seems like a little bit of modernization of it would do well for schools that lack enough specialized talent. Kind of like what Paul Johnson/service academies have done with the option attacks.

[rich59]

Not a problem, Cutter. Enjoy the dialogue and Friday will be here before we know it.

Actually, the formation the Pros are using where they snap it back directly to a tailback resembles the single wing. Some of the teams doing that also have used an unbalanced line. They call it the Wildcat.

I played at a high school where our coach was from TCU and had played for Dutch Meyer. Our base offense was the split T but we also ran some single wing and double wing and spread with both ends(my position) split. As a freshman I played at a college where we ran strictly orthodox split T and our playbook was a fraction of the size of of the playbook in high school. The college one was about five plays to the left and the same five plays right and a few play passes. We had to play both offense and defense and our defense was the base 5-4 Oklahoma with a variation to be used if a pass play was expected. It was hard to get confused.

There is not much new in football as far as formations and tactics are concerned. The players are sure different though.

[skyscraper]

This is the only thread all week that hasn't made me want to repeatedly bang my head against the wall.
Appreciate the thoughtful opinions and insight on KP, and I hope he continues to better himself against TCU!

[ponyboy]

The stat that sticks out for me on Kyle is that he's tied for #16 in sacks in the nation. He's getting a ton of pressure right now and I don't believe the OL is primarily responsible for it. I believe a good measure of that is that his receivers are not getting open. Call it the Emmanuel Sanders effect.

He is, by the way, tied for #6 in touchdowns.

[ponyboy]

And the Shawnbrey McNeal effect, now that I think about it.

[smurzer]

It has looked like he is trying to go through ALL his reads and holding onto the ball too long (hence the high sack number). Just dont remember him holding the ball that long last year.

Could he be passing on the early open man looking for other options downfield and trying to get through all the reads or are his receivers truly just not getting open? I keep hearing JJ say in his interviews that "kyle will see he missed some open guys when he reviews the film". Seems to me, especially in this game on Fri against a more potent pass rush, he just needs to get the ball out and let the receivers do some work after the catch.

Just wanted to get some thoughts from those who have been at the games... Receivers not getting open or Padron feeling he has to see every option on the field before he throws (as opposed to just throwing to the first open guy)?

[rich59]

I don't want to seem like a know it all and act critical of someone who seems to be as fine a young man as Padron but it is my belief that he was really down on himself for the Oskies he threw against TT and he now is trying to be extra careful, is guiding the ball rather than winging it. Kind of like trying to guide a driver when hitting a tight fairway. I believe that that syndrome, if it can be called that, is natural and will just take some time and success to get over. This Friday is probably not going to be real helpful for getting over it.

[Stallion]

I think he is doing just about the same things he was doing last year but doesn't have Emanuel Sanders and Shawnbrey McNeil and had never seen a defense near as good as Texas Tech. If you go back and check the stats from last year Sanders was getting about 7 catches and 125 yards per game from Sanders-nobody has taken up the slack. He held the ball too long last year-he was near the bottom in sacks in the nation last year for the number of games he played. He can throw a low tragectory bomb like he did in the Hawaii Bowl and last week to Robinson-but doesn't not have a what you would call a strong College arm right now. I think he will be fine, doesn't make a lot of mistakes and will be the best post-DP QB but some of you guys refuse to acknowlege that he wasn't polished last year either. He struggled in at least 3 games last year like he has this year against weak competition. He ran the actual Run and Shoot in one game last year when he had 4 weeks to prepare for Nevada. I'm sure June is correct that it takes awhile to learn this offense and really am not too overly concerned with his progress.

[Dutch]

I think he is doing just about the same things he was doing last year but doesn't have Emanuel Sanders and Shawnbrey McNeil and had never seen a defense near as good as Texas Tech. If you go back and check the stats from last year Sanders was getting about 7 catches and 125 yards per game from Sanders-nobody has taken up the slack. He held the ball too long last year-he was near the bottom in sacks in the nation last year for the number of games he played. He can throw a low tragectory bomb like he did in the Hawaii Bowl and last week to Robinson-but doesn't not have a what you would call a strong College arm right now. I think he will be fine, doesn't make a lot of mistakes and will be the best post-DP QB but some of you guys refuse to acknowlege that he wasn't polished last year either. He struggled in at least 3 games last year like he has this year against weak competition. He ran the actual Run and Shoot in one game last year when he had 4 weeks to prepare for Nevada. I'm sure June is correct that it takes awhile to learn this offense and really am not too overly concerned with his progress.

pretty spot on. i just hope he doesn't get his bell rung or confidence shaken too badly this weekend. i want to see him during conf. play.

[SMU89]

Once again, it is shovel pass, not shuffle pass. It is usually an underhanded pass behind the line of scrimmage kind of like scooping a shovelfull of dirt and throwing it. Hence shovel pass. Long ago, before the option became popular, most teams had a play where a back flared behind the line of scrimmage and the QB or one of the other backs if the single wing was being used, "shoveled" the ball to him. Many announcers on TV call it a shuffle pass but they are uninformed.

When the option play in the Split T came in, since the QB was going down the line with the ball before pitching, the distace was short and he kind of "bean bagged" it. Sometimes the shovel pass is used today on a quick pitch out of the T formation.

Padron was shuffling his feet at the time he was shoveling the ball......it was to close to tell.

so, if I got this right.......it was really the shuffling shovel pass?

Or the bean bag shuffle shovel pass