2006 Texas Safety Arrested For Home Invasion Robbery

[SC Pony]

I hope that Jstang is a lawyer because virtually no one else could continue this argument with a straight face (no gay bashing intended).

I think most of us see the clear difference between alcohol fueled athletes fighting in bars (or at a party) and premeditated burglary with deadly weapons. I also think that most of us would not classify someone as a thug merely due to an arrest of any sort. Websters defines a thug as a "rough, brutal hoodlum, gangster, robber" a definition which fits the UT boys a bid better than our boys.

It is the sheer number of incidents and the seriousness of the incidents at UT that is astonishing (8 players or former players in 10 arrests over 15 months).

By the way, it is not a hate crime to assault a homosexual, it is a hate crime to do it [u]because[/u] the person is a homosexual. I am confident that Willis would argue that the hit was due to the harassment, not the sexual orientation of the person assaulted and therefor, not a hate crime.

[SC Pony]

Sorry Jstang, I saw that you gave up the argument on another thread after I posted mine.

[jtstang]

There is no doubt that UT's problem is prolific, and I won't defend UT players any more, if that is what I was doing before (and I don't think it was). But despite what some people have tried to imply, I have never said SMU's "thug" problem was as bad as UT's. What people don't seem to grasp is that we are talking about 17 and 18 year old kids. There are going to be problem guys everywhere, including SMU. People on this board just don't like to admit it. And yes, I do think that guys who fight with cops and guys who beat up guys because they are gay (and I think that is why he did it--if the guy wasn't gay, he's probably not stalking another guy), are problem guys. Now I will give them the benefit of the doubt, that they have learned from their past problems, something which nobody on this thread would ever give a guy who got in trouble at UT. I just think we all ought to accept the fact that some kids who are "thugs" are also great athletes, and learn to let them help us get better on the field.

[perunapower]

There is no doubt that UT's problem is prolific, and I won't defend UT players any more, if that is what I was doing before (and I don't think it was). But despite what some people have tried to imply, I have never said SMU's "thug" problem was as bad as UT's. What people don't seem to grasp is that we are talking about 17 and 18 year old kids. There are going to be problem guys everywhere, including SMU. People on this board just don't like to admit it. And yes, I do think that guys who fight with cops and guys who beat up guys because they are gay (and I think that is why he did it--if the guy wasn't gay, he's probably not stalking another guy), are problem guys. Now I will give them the benefit of the doubt, that they have learned from their past problems, something which nobody on this thread would ever give a guy who got in trouble at UT. I just think we all ought to accept the fact that some kids who are "thugs" are also great athletes, and learn to let them help us get better on the field.

I agree with most of what you say except one thing. I don't think Justin beat up his stalker because he is gay. I think the fact that he is gay lead to the reason he got beat up (his being gay lead to his infatuation with Justin which lead to stalking which made Justin understandably uncomfortable which led him to lash out his frustration on the guy), but wasn't the reason he got beat up. That's just the conclusion I draw from the story that was told. He didn't commit a hate crime (and I think that term is thrown around far too easily in these politically correct days); he beat up a guy who was frustrating him that happened to be gay.

As for the rest of your argument, you're right we shouldn't hold this double standard when looking at UT's problems and looking at our own. But we should help our athletes mature to learn not to make stupid decisions. Is it fool-proof? Of course not. I may get a lot of crap for saying this, but I would rather have mature, responsible athletes that are mediocre than have great athletes who are problems off the field. That being said, there are athletes who don't get into trouble that are great athletes and we need to recruit those and get to a level of respectability on the field that we haven't had in many years.

[Insane_Pony_Posse]

"Is that because you can't make your own decisions?"

Uh?

Quite the contrary, obviously the Dallas Morning News is reporting the same reality that I have made comments on, that there is a serious criminal behavior pattern taking place relating to the Texas Longhorn football program. Obviously what is happening down in Austin as far as scope of criminal behavior is not the norm and thus is seeing headlines across the news media.

"I want to know if YOU think SMU has any thugs, based on certain publicly acknowledged conduct."
I do not see any court convictions, plea bargains, jail sentencing, or fines paid that would indicate proof of such, but if you can provide any credible sources of SMU football player convictions, plea bargains, fines, or jail sentences I would be more than happy to view them and compare them with the Texas players well documented criminal behavior.

However for the sake of argument, even if SMU had a thug event, where are the multiple serious thug events that keep arising from Austin where Texas Longhorn football players are being arrested with pounds of weed, arrested with illegal weapons, arrested breaking into vehicles, arrested for pointing guns at people, arrested for home/apt invasions, ect....ect?

Here you go again trying to compare "apples to oranges".

Go on pretending that there is an even remote correlation between UT thuggery and SMU thuggery......reality shows it's not even in the same universe.

I won't hold my breath until you find a front Sports Page article in the Dallas Morning News like this one documenting crime sprees by multiple SMU Football players.

"I don't have to ask you what the Morning News thinks, I can read it."

That has not been at all clear from reading your comments.

[Treadway21]

Considering JTstamg's love affair with the Dallas Morning News and his trust of their editorial decisions on college sports coverage, you'd think think he would take everything they say as gospel, but maybe that only applies to the non-coverage of SMU.

[jtstang]

SMU thuggery......

Finally you acknowledge it exists. Ahh, common ground at last.

And I know it's much more rampant at UT, I admitted as much in another thread. Try to win gracefully once in a while.

Oh, and just for the record, I am not aware that any of the incidents in the last couple of months at UT resulted in "convictions, plea bargains, jail sentencing, or fines paid that would indicate proof of such" and if that is the standard you are using then none of these UT guys can be considered thugs at this time anyway. I suspect you'll want to reconsider your definition to better support your argument. But please feel free to "provide any credible sources of [UT] football player convictions, plea bargains, fines, or jail sentences" in connection with these recent incidents which will support your idea of "well documented criminal behavior." You have a good premise that the thuggery at UT is out of control, but you really need to watch the way you charcterize and define thuggery as you seem to be letting these most recent guys slide off easy.

[jtstang]

Considering JTstamg's love affair with the Dallas Morning News and his trust of their editorial decisions on college sports coverage, you'd think think he would take everything they say as gospel, but maybe that only applies to the non-coverage of SMU.

Supply and demand, sunshine, supply and demand. I'll be happy to revive the SMU coverage thread to demonstrate that there is SMU coverage in the morning news practically daily, which is more than warranted by the record..

Besides, you get all the coverage you can possibly need on ponyfans, why be bitter?

[Insane_Pony_Posse]

re: "for the record, I am not aware that any of the incidents in the last couple of months at UT resulted in "convictions, plea bargains, jail sentencing, or fines paid that would indicate proof of such"

Well duh.....these latest UT thug incidents are happening at such a rapid pace that of course they have not made their way through the courts and penal system yet.

BTW....can you provide any current volume of arrests and/or pending cases against SMU players like is currently happening with the UT thugs?

re:"if that is the standard you are using then none of these UT guys can be considered thugs at this time anyway. I suspect you'll want to reconsider your definition to better support your argument"


It is one of the standards, along with volume and scope of charges, volume and scope of arrests, and reports from credible sources. Of course there are recent fines/sentences/pleas also.

But again....can you provide any information like the stories shown below?


Texas RB Benson gets past 8-day jail sentence
By Jim Vertuno, The Associated Press
8/6/04

AUSTIN — Texas running back Cedric Benson completed the terms of his eight-day jail sentence Saturday without spending any time behind bars. Benson was sentenced to jail Friday after pleading no contest to misdemeanor criminal trespassing during the 2003 season. But due to jail crowding, he was able to avoid jail time by earning four days credit for good behavior, two days time served when he was arrested and two days for checking in Friday and Saturday, Travis County sheriff's department spokesman Roger Wade said.

"We don't have beds available," Wade said.

Wade said Benson checked in at the Travis County Correctional Complex in Del Valle on Saturday morning and was released a short time later after paying his $1,000 fine. Benson also was ordered to pay restitution of about $500.

The 21-year Midland native was arrested and charged in October, when police said he kicked down the door of an Austin apartment in a failed attempt to recover a plasma television he had reported stolen.

Benson is expected to report to campus Monday with his teammates and participate in the first preseason practice Tuesday

The charge was a Class A misdemeanor punishable by up to a year in jail. Travis County Judge Elizabeth Earle also ordered Benson to pay a fine and restitution for the apartment's damaged door and court costs, said Benson's attorney, Brian Carney.

"He's not being given any preferential treatment," Wade said.

Benson finished his jail term well before the season opener Sept. 4 against North Texas. He served a one-game suspension after his arrest last season.

"I understand that I made a mistake and I'm taking responsibility for my actions in accepting my punishment," Benson said in a statement released by the school.

Carney said Benson accepted the jail time rather than drag out his case — and potential publicity — through a long probation period during the coming season.

Prosecutors offered Benson a conviction with probation for a year with community service, anger management counseling and similar fines.

"I had some options in how it was handled, but I think what I accepted will have the least effect on my teammates, the coaches and everyone at UT. I didn't want this to drag on through the season," Benson said. "Even though it's more difficult on me by taking care of it now, it's in the best interest of my team in the long run."

Coach Mack Brown said Benson's plea brings "closure to an issue we dealt with last fall with Cedric. I know he's glad to have this behind him so he can move on."

A likely Heisman Trophy contender this season, Benson has been one of the most prolific ball carriers in Texas history with 3,706 yards rushing and 45 touchdowns.

"All he wants to do is get this behind him and go play football and have a great senior year," Carney said.

"This is an unusually harsh course that was taken for a misdemeanor offense like this," Carney said. "I don't think it would have taken that course if he didn't play football."

Benson was originally accused of entering the apartment with three other men but Carney said no one else has been charged in the case.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/football/big12/2004-08-06-texas-benson_x.htm


Taylor sentenced to two months in jail, 350 hours of community service
By Suzanne Halliburton | Thursday, November 16, 2006, 04:56 PM

Former Texas running back Ramonce Taylor was sentenced Thursday to 60 days in Bell County Jail and 350 hours of community service as part of a plea deal he agreed to two months ago for state felony drug possession charges.

Taylor also received five years of deferred probation and was fined $1,000. He was given the option of serving the jail time on weekends, so long as finishes the sentence by March 11 and maintains his status as a full-time student.

Taylor was arrested May 14 near Little River in Bell County. Taylor had called police to report that someone had broken a window on his truck while he and his friends were attending a graduation party. Deputies searched Taylor’s car and found a backpack of marijuana.

Taylor’s charge was a state jail felony for possession of fewer than five pounds of marijuana but more than four ounces. The maximum penalty was six months in jail and a fine of up to $10,000.

He’s also subject to random drug screenings and was placed in a specialized substance abuse program for one year.

Taylor was suspended from the Longhorn football team last January because of academic reasons. He transferred to Texas College in Tyler for the fall, but was not eligible to play football.

http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/austin/longhorns/entries/2006/11/16/taylor_sentenced_to_two_months_in_jail_350_hours_of_community_service.html

[PK]

...and the beat goes on.

[jtstang]

re: "for the record, I am not aware that any of the incidents in the last couple of months at UT resulted in "convictions, plea bargains, jail sentencing, or fines paid that would indicate proof of such"

Well duh.....these latest UT thug incidents are happening at such a rapid pace that of course they have not made their way through the courts and penal system yet.

Hey, it's your definition, not mine. If you don't like it, change it or think of a new word to describe the guys involved in the latest incidents. Pre-thugs, perhaps?

And please recall, you already have my concession on this issue, so why not quit while you're ahead.

And, yes, I'd still loved to have had Benson in a mustang uniform....

[CA Mustang]

Melton, Kindle to miss first three games of season for DWI charges

AUSTIN -- Texas coach Mack Brown on Sunday announced that two players charged with DWI over the summer will miss the first three games of the 2007 season.

Defensive end Henry Melton and linebacker Sergio Kindle were charged in separate incidents this summer. They also will be held out of the first couple of days of practice and must perform community service for the team, Brown said.

"I think we've got to send a message and kids have to learn," Brown said.

The Longhorns reported Sunday for training camp for the upcoming season.

Kindle, a sophomore, was expected to compete for significant playing time this season. Melton, a converted running back, had moved to defensive end full time in the spring.

Kindle and Melton will miss games against Arkansas St., TCU and Central Florida.

Kindle and Melton are among four Texas football players who have faced criminal charges over the summer.

A third player, freshman linebacker Dre Jones, was suspended last week after being charged with aggravated robbery.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=2962285

[smu diamond m]

Kindle and Melton will miss games against Arkansas St., TCU and Central Florida.

WHAT EVER WILL TEXAS DO

[perunapower]

Lose to TCU to make our victory in Ft. Worth all the much sweeter.

[Insane_Pony_Posse]

re: "you already have my concession on this issue, so why not quit while you're ahead"

BEAT TECH!