Oct. 21, 1989 -- 21 years after the despicable act

[George S. Patton]

If memory serves correct, running up the score on opponents was pretty much the MO for the Jenkins-Pardee coached Cougars. It was pretty low class on UH part.

Define running it up. Is 55-9 running it up? What is the boundary point? Patton said when a number starts with 8 or more. UH had 2 games under Pardee with 80+ points. All other games were under 70 points. So I guess Patton would say UH ran it up in 2 games under Pardee.

Do you think 66-15 vs UT was running it up and classless?

Maybe Ware had to feel good about something after the previous week at Kyle Field when Aaron Wallace knocked his [deleted] so hard to the turf, his helmet came off and Wallace picked it up, showed it to the fans and they went nuts.

Was that running it up by A&M's defense?

[NTXCoog]

I really want suggestions from SMU fans what UH was supposed to do.

Real simple. Not call timeout near the end of the first half already up several touchdowns to throw the ball deep into the endzone. You were already ahead by wide margin and could have run simple sweep play, or just 7 yard out.

That is what made Coach Gregg so mad at end of half when he went after Houston coaches. Only time that first year back he lost it. Also referenced by Glanville when he gave our team game ball later on.

Also why Jenkins and Pardee were called out by national media, primarily for trying to pad Ware's stats. Don't know how old you are but big discussion on Heisman/Ware issue because of the piling on to make Ware's stats and was he legit. We all know what a great QB he turned out to be.

You're going to complain that UH was running it up in the 1st half when up by 38 knowing Ware wasn't going to take another snap?

You obviously didn't see more than maybe 1 UH game that entire year if you think Ware's stats were padded for Heisman voting. In many games, Ware did not play more than a half that year. Ware did not take all of the snaps in most games. If they wanted to put up stats, they could have. Ware threw for 4699 yards total. Klingler threw for 865. If they wanted to pad stats, wouldn't they get Ware up to 5000 yards?

They ran the frigging run and shoot. Were the Houston Oilers trying to pad Warren Moon's stats when he passed for 4600+ yards per year so he could be NFL Offensive Player of the Year (which he won)?

So that's your solution? UH shouldn't have called a timeout in the 1st half. Anything else?

[NTXCoog]

If memory serves correct, running up the score on opponents was pretty much the MO for the Jenkins-Pardee coached Cougars. It was pretty low class on UH part.

Define running it up. Is 55-9 running it up? What is the boundary point? Patton said when a number starts with 8 or more. UH had 2 games under Pardee with 80+ points. All other games were under 70 points. So I guess Patton would say UH ran it up in 2 games under Pardee.

Do you think 66-15 vs UT was running it up and classless?

Maybe Ware had to feel good about something after the previous week at Kyle Field when Aaron Wallace knocked his [deleted] so hard to the turf, his helmet came off and Wallace picked it up, showed it to the fans and they went nuts.

Was that running it up by A&M's defense?

It was unsportsmanlike conduct that wasn't called. But you don't hear me whining about it 20 years later.

And I find it funny that you're living vicariously through the 1989 Aggies. I have never wanted to live vicariously through any Aggy.

[NTXCoog]

And I notice no one has answered any of my questions in an attempt to understand how they game got out of control.

[George S. Patton]

Sir, we weren't good enough to beat anyone the SWC. You all beat us. We didn't have much material. And some of your dumba$$ fans are in the Astrodump high fiving each other because it was soooo cool what you guys were doing.

You were playing us.

If I'm living through Aggy, so be it. I loved it that afternoon you brought your kick butt offense into Kyle Field and got SHUT DOWN. Interesting though how you are still claiming it should have been an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty. Hmmmm.

I love it.

[George S. Patton]

Quickly, please remind me which team was on probation that year?

A reminder that when we play you guys next year, this discussion will re-surface. You will be reminded over and over and over and over again.

[Pony in SA]

You're going to complain that UH was running it up in the 1st half when up by 38 knowing Ware wasn't going to take another snap?

You obviously didn't see more than maybe 1 UH game that entire year if you think Ware's stats were padded for Heisman voting. In many games, Ware did not play more than a half that year. Ware did not take all of the snaps in most games. If they wanted to put up stats, they could have. Ware threw for 4699 yards total. Klingler threw for 865. If they wanted to pad stats, wouldn't they get Ware up to 5000 yards?

They ran the frigging run and shoot. Were the Houston Oilers trying to pad Warren Moon's stats when he passed for 4600+ yards per year so he could be NFL Offensive Player of the Year (which he won)?

So that's your solution? UH shouldn't have called a timeout in the 1st half. Anything else?[/quote]

Not complaining about the scores as was pointed out before scores happen. But calling timeout with less than a minute left in the 1st half up already up 4 or 5 TDs to then throw bombs in the end zone is what everyone thought was unsportsmanlike. Other objective people across the country thought it was uncalled for, and that they were just padding stats. I don't know if padding stats or not but I think the run and shoot has another play option rather than bombs to the end zone. Just think they could have called a draw play or run different pass play. Are you saying their only play was post patterns to the end zone ??

By the way, the Houston fans near us also did not like the play calling. Many apologized to the group we were with and also said were worried about injuries, etc. and didn't know why coaches didnt' just go to half time.

[Pony in SA]

I really want suggestions from SMU fans what UH was supposed to do.

Real simple. Not call timeout near the end of the first half already up several touchdowns to throw the ball deep into the endzone. You were already ahead by wide margin and could have run simple sweep play, or just 7 yard out.

That is what made Coach Gregg so mad at end of half when he went after Houston coaches. Only time that first year back he lost it. Also referenced by Glanville when he gave our team game ball later on.

Also why Jenkins and Pardee were called out by national media, primarily for trying to pad Ware's stats. Don't know how old you are but big discussion on Heisman/Ware issue because of the piling on to make Ware's stats and was he legit. We all know what a great QB he turned out to be.

You're going to complain that UH was running it up in the 1st half when up by 38 knowing Ware wasn't going to take another snap?

You obviously didn't see more than maybe 1 UH game that entire year if you think Ware's stats were padded for Heisman voting. In many games, Ware did not play more than a half that year. Ware did not take all of the snaps in most games. If they wanted to put up stats, they could have. Ware threw for 4699 yards total. Klingler threw for 865. If they wanted to pad stats, wouldn't they get Ware up to 5000 yards?

They ran the frigging run and shoot. Were the Houston Oilers trying to pad Warren Moon's stats when he passed for 4600+ yards per year so he could be NFL Offensive Player of the Year (which he won)?

So that's your solution? UH shouldn't have called a timeout in the 1st half. Anything else?

Not complaining about the scores as was pointed out before scores happen. But calling timeout with less than a minute left in the 1st half up already up 4 or 5 TDs to then throw bombs in the end zone is what everyone thought was unsportsmanlike. Other objective people across the country thought it was uncalled for, and that they were just padding stats. I don't know if padding stats or not but I think the run and shoot has another play option rather than bombs to the end zone. Just think they could have called a draw play or run different pass play. Are you saying their only play was post patterns to the end zone ??

By the way, the Houston fans near us also did not like the play calling. Many apologized to the group we were with and also said were worried about injuries, etc. and didn't know why coaches didnt' just go to half time.

[tristatecoog]

Sir, we weren't good enough to beat anyone the SWC. You all beat us. We didn't have much material. And some of your dumba$$ fans are in the Astrodump high fiving each other because it was soooo cool what you guys were doing.

You were playing us.

If I'm living through Aggy, so be it. I loved it that afternoon you brought your kick butt offense into Kyle Field and got SHUT DOWN. Interesting though how you are still claiming it should have been an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty. Hmmmm.

I love it.

I believe Aggy won 17-13 at Kyle Field and we beat them in the Dome in 1990. I was at the Kyle game. It was embarrassing to see Wallace do that but it was also kind of cool, in a gladiator way. Too bad we couldn't come back to win that one. Maybe that's why whipping up on the little kid down the street the next weekend was so sweet.

If SMU can do the same to UH tomorrow, more power to you. It'll still be classless but it's football. We'll call out the wambulance to take the team back to Houston.

[NTXCoog]

If I'm living through Aggy, so be it. I loved it that afternoon you brought your kick butt offense into Kyle Field and got SHUT DOWN. Interesting though how you are still claiming it should have been an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty. Hmmmm.

You asked about the play. I said it should have been a penalty. But you don't hear me 20 years later saying, Never forget that Aggy player who held up Ware's helmet. We owe them revenge for that despicable act. Blah blah blah. We didn't even say that the next year.

[Alaric]

I didn't like the score either but I place more blame on our administration shackling SMU with unreasonable academic restrictions that created a stage for this kind of nightmare scenario that lasted for 20 years of what was effectively JV football. The 66-3 Baylor game, about the same time, where they didn't attempt a pass against us, was at least as humiliating.

[peruna81]

And I notice no one has answered any of my questions in an attempt to understand how they game got out of control.

Most of us cannot name the three deep chart from an opponent 21 years ago...I can't even remember what I had for dinner 20 minutes ago...

Feel free to share with us your point, but failure by SMU fans here to address a roster accurately baffles me re. the actions of UH that night.

[NTXCoog]

And I notice no one has answered any of my questions in an attempt to understand how they game got out of control.

Most of us cannot name the three deep chart from an opponent 21 years ago...I can't even remember what I had for dinner 20 minutes ago...

Feel free to share with us your point, but failure by SMU fans here to address a roster accurately baffles me re. the actions of UH that night.

UH played every player on the roster. UH had no 3rd string QB so there were no bench QBs to put in. The 2nd string RB was future NFL Pro Bowler Kimble Anders. There was no 3rd string RB. Why was Spoon running the ball instead of the backup? Because the 2nd string RB played WR most of the game. Why was he playing WR most of the game? Because UH had FIVE WRs injured either going into the game or injured in the first quarter.

I've read a ton of articles about this game, both positive and negative. Many of the complaints about UH was that the starting WRs including All-American Manny Hazard were still catching balls late in the game or that Spoon was still running the ball. UH didn't have any extra WRs or RBs to put in the game.

UH played 3 walk ons and 1 player who was just cleared to practice with the team the week before. UH considered playing the equipment manager at WR since he played that position in high school. But it was decided that would be an NCAA violation for too many scholarships because he was receiving other financial aid.

UH did not blitz SMU a single time that game. Imagine that. A passing team where the defense doesn't blitz once. A conscious decision by the UH coaches to hold UH back. Much of the 1st string defense didn't even play all of the 2nd quarter, much less the 2nd half.

I love people who say UH should have run the ball more in the 2nd half. Keep in mind that Spoon had more yards per carry than UH had yards per pass attempt. Spoon rushed for more than 200 yards, but some people say that he should run the ball more. If he had carried the ball more and gained 300 yards and 4 TDs, would that have been more sportsmanlike?

As I said, Anders played WR most of the game although he did run the ball late. I haven't been able to find how many yards he rushed, but his last run on the last drive was for 21 yards. Doesn't sound like that would have slowed down the offensive onslaught.

And UH's Run and Shoot wasn't designed for 40 carries anyways. Teams like OU, aTm, Notre Dame can run the ball over and over in that type of blowout. Put 2 or 3 TEs in per play. Put 2 or 3 RBs in per play. Then run the ball. The UH run and shoot had no TEs. No fullback to block. So running the ball against a stacked defense is asking for a UH RB injury, something unacceptable with only 2 RBs on the roster. Look at the Oilers. They couldn't run the ball to run out the clock in a playoff game. One of the Run and Shoot's weaknesses is the ability to run out the clock at the end of games.

Which brings me to the most controversial part of my points, Forrest Gregg's defensive play calling in the 4th quarter, especially on the long 4th quarter TD pass. SMU stacked 7 and even 8 players in the box. Everyone who watched the R&S during those days knew exactly what that means for the offense. 6 or less in the box is a running play. 7 or more is a pass. It's an automatic call. And yet Gregg continued to stack the line. I guess UH with 5 lineman and an RB was supposed to run the ball 5 on 7. Again, that's asking for an injury. If Gregg wanted UH to run the ball, he should have called a defense that would result in a UH run. Instead he forced the issue, and UH took what the SMU defense gave them. If SMU drops 5 or 6 back, UH runs every play. Maybe they gain 8 or even 13 yards per run, but the clock runs, there are few long plays, and the score stays down. But that's not what Gregg did.

And finally, the ending of the game. UH ends with the ball on the SMU 17 yard line. Unlike what Greg the Hammer Williams with his drug addled brain recalled, UH was not desperately trying to score at the end. UH takes a knee inside SMU's 20. Heck, even a UH running play might result in a TD. After all, Anders ran the ball 21 yards to get inside SMU's 20, but it is a knee instead. Limiting UH to 14 points in the 4th quarter, their lowest quarter in the game.

The score got out of hand. I don't think any of the UH coaches wanted it to happen especially Pardee, one of Gregg's friends. But the perfect storm caused it to get out of hand, not the intention of the coaches.

I know this isn't going to change any SMU fan's mind, but at least know the whole story instead of looking at the total score and a couple of plays.

[PonyLove]

Well that makes all the difference in the world.

[peruna81]

Interesting that Gregg commented to a Dallas news outlet (WFAA, IIRC) that this put a burr in the saddle regarding a friendship he had enjoyed with Pardee ...this was a follow-up to the return to Houston in 1991, I believe.

Wonder if that ever got fixed...

NTXCoog, it is obvious that the game ( as you stated) intrigues you enough to try to study both pro and con views...not the norm for just any 'ol regular season SWC game 21 years ago...and the very reason that this SMU fan remembers it with such enmity. It was not the norm for a SWC game at that time. It pains to reason the justification you cite, and in particular the idea that SMU's packing 7 or 8 in the box invited a pass.

You have watched enough football, and have seen enough contests where one team is grossly overmatched to no doubt know the difference between victory and mockery... as was the case that day. No idealism here, or requests for 'PC' style football, where everyone walks away feeling like a winner...the game that day branded UH (fairly or not) as bullies in many folks eyes.

I still count it a dark mark against Houston, and the coaches who were part and parcel to it.

I wish you well tomorrow.