SMU’s June Jones ranked behind Larry Coker and Dan McCarney

[JasonB]

Yes, Hawaii got destroyed by Georgia. But most people still remember the fact that they went undefeated before that and that June lead the crew. And they still think of him as a good coach because of it. I realize it was an illusion because of the schedule, but that isn't what the average Joe remembers, and perception is reality.

And our homefield record in conference play the last several years is outstanding, so don't knock our homefield advantage too much .

Just like our massive basketball win total is at least partially due to our weak non-conference schedule. Are people going to remember that? No, they are going to remember a great record, a good team, and a trip to the finals of the NIT. If we get the crap knocked out of us in a difficult non-conference schedule early, who knows if we are able to do as well in conference.

Again, I am not saying this is where we should be in Year 6. I am just saying that June or no June, when we build the program, we are going to get to ten wins by having a weak non-conference schedule. And double digit wins is when you get noticed on the recruiting front.

In 2010 we were 7-5 in the regular season, 6-2 in conference. We made the conference championship games. Nobody remembers that. If we played a crappy non-conference schedule and get three more wins, we would have been 10 - 2, and everyone would have remembered. Lose the conference championship and a bowl, and 10-4 is still memorable. Instead, we had a 7-7 season and the nation gives a giant "meh".

Kansas State is the supreme example. Crap program forever. In 90, they go 5-6, massive improvement. 2-5 in conference, but scheduled Western Illinois, New Mexico State, Northern Illinios, and New Mexico non-conference. They played awful non-conference schedules every single year, so that they could establish a winning program. They still do it, but nobody really cares because it made them a winning program.

[gostangs]

But they recruit their butts off. That is the difference, and what the June lovers have no answer for. He is a HORRIBLE recruiter and that is no good - unsustainable so he must go now.

[Lebanese4Life]

gostangs - it's funny how there actually still are "June lovers" given the horrible shape of the program.

[Bergermeister]

June... He is a HORRIBLE recruiter

Really? First I've heard of this.

[sbsmith]

Yes, Hawaii got destroyed by Georgia. But most people still remember the fact that they went undefeated before that and that June lead the crew. And they still think of him as a good coach because of it. I realize it was an illusion because of the schedule, but that isn't what the average Joe remembers, and perception is reality.

And our homefield record in conference play the last several years is outstanding, so don't knock our homefield advantage too much .

Just like our massive basketball win total is at least partially due to our weak non-conference schedule. Are people going to remember that? No, they are going to remember a great record, a good team, and a trip to the finals of the NIT. If we get the crap knocked out of us in a difficult non-conference schedule early, who knows if we are able to do as well in conference.

Again, I am not saying this is where we should be in Year 6. I am just saying that June or no June, when we build the program, we are going to get to ten wins by having a weak non-conference schedule. And double digit wins is when you get noticed on the recruiting front.

In 2010 we were 7-5 in the regular season, 6-2 in conference. We made the conference championship games. Nobody remembers that. If we played a crappy non-conference schedule and get three more wins, we would have been 10 - 2, and everyone would have remembered. Lose the conference championship and a bowl, and 10-4 is still memorable. Instead, we had a 7-7 season and the nation gives a giant "meh".

Kansas State is the supreme example. Crap program forever. In 90, they go 5-6, massive improvement. 2-5 in conference, but scheduled Western Illinois, New Mexico State, Northern Illinios, and New Mexico non-conference. They played awful non-conference schedules every single year, so that they could establish a winning program. They still do it, but nobody really cares because it made them a winning program.

Most people remember that Hawaii got destroyed by Georgia and their perception of that team is that they were overrated and didn't belong in the game to begin with (the game validated the criticisms a lot of people had regarding Hawaii). Our homefield advantage is nothing like Hawaii's (disproportionately favorable amount of home games in a coveted island destination thousands of miles away from most mainland locations).

People are going to remember that our weak OOC schedule kept us out of the NCAA Tournament, that's precisely why LB is taking steps to fix it. For all you know a tough OOC schedule could have helped us do much better in conference play, at the very least it would have taken some ammunition away from the committee.

You get noticed on the recruiting front by making recruiting a priority (see SMU Basketball). The program won't get built unless that happens first. No amount of fake wins is going to make up for being a non-entity on the recruiting trail.

Your 10-4 would have only been memorable to SMU fans since we wouldn't have had any signature wins nor would we have been ranked in the final polls. So either way we would have received a giant "meh".

Kansas State played in a power conference with a bunch of longtime rivals, they could schedule OOC junk and still have plenty of relevant games on the schedule. BTW the JUCOs made them a winning program. They're the supreme example for another P5 program, not for SMU.

[Big12Mustang]

Yes, Hawaii got destroyed by Georgia. But most people still remember the fact that they went undefeated before that and that June lead the crew. And they still think of him as a good coach because of it. I realize it was an illusion because of the schedule, but that isn't what the average Joe remembers, and perception is reality.

And our homefield record in conference play the last several years is outstanding, so don't knock our homefield advantage too much .

Just like our massive basketball win total is at least partially due to our weak non-conference schedule. Are people going to remember that? No, they are going to remember a great record, a good team, and a trip to the finals of the NIT. If we get the crap knocked out of us in a difficult non-conference schedule early, who knows if we are able to do as well in conference.

Again, I am not saying this is where we should be in Year 6. I am just saying that June or no June, when we build the program, we are going to get to ten wins by having a weak non-conference schedule. And double digit wins is when you get noticed on the recruiting front.

In 2010 we were 7-5 in the regular season, 6-2 in conference. We made the conference championship games. Nobody remembers that. If we played a crappy non-conference schedule and get three more wins, we would have been 10 - 2, and everyone would have remembered. Lose the conference championship and a bowl, and 10-4 is still memorable. Instead, we had a 7-7 season and the nation gives a giant "meh".

Kansas State is the supreme example. Crap program forever. In 90, they go 5-6, massive improvement. 2-5 in conference, but scheduled Western Illinois, New Mexico State, Northern Illinios, and New Mexico non-conference. They played awful non-conference schedules every single year, so that they could establish a winning program. They still do it, but nobody really cares because it made them a winning program.

Most people remember that Hawaii got destroyed by Georgia and their perception of that team is that they were overrated and didn't belong in the game to begin with (the game validated the criticisms a lot of people had regarding Hawaii). Our homefield advantage is nothing like Hawaii's (disproportionately favorable amount of home games in a coveted island destination thousands of miles away from most mainland locations).

People are going to remember that our weak OOC schedule kept us out of the NCAA Tournament, that's precisely why LB is taking steps to fix it. For all you know a tough OOC schedule could have helped us do much better in conference play, at the very least it would have taken some ammunition away from the committee.

You get noticed on the recruiting front by making recruiting a priority (see SMU Basketball). The program won't get built unless that happens first. No amount of fake wins is going to make up for being a non-entity on the recruiting trail.

Your 10-4 would have only been memorable to SMU fans since we wouldn't have had any signature wins nor would we have been ranked in the final polls. So either way we would have received a giant "meh".

Kansas State played in a power conference with a bunch of longtime rivals, they could schedule OOC junk and still have plenty of relevant games on the schedule. BTW the JUCOs made them a winning program. They're the supreme example for another P5 program, not for SMU.

How do you suggest we build up our recruiting?

Everyone keeps bringing up basketball...but don't forget this is what SMU basketball is:

1) State of the art IPF (Crum Center)
2) Brand new state of the art stadium (MoodY)
3) Larry Brown
4) You only need to recruit/transfer 2 or 3 guys to change your entire team into a contender (see Mudiay, Nic, Markus etc.)

Basketball also has an advantage football doesn't have: UT, A&M, TCU, BU, Texas Tech could care less about basketball...therefore it is easier to bring in 5 stars into basketball than Football.

Granted, LB and his staff hit the trail hard and communicate that well. June doesn't do that. Let's look at solutions since we are stuck with June for 3 years (1 year minimum probably)

[Grant Carter]

gostangs - it's funny how there actually still are "June lovers" given the horrible shape of the program.

How many do you think there are posting on here? People act like the site is overrun by them, but that does not seem to be the case to me.

[sbsmith]

How do you suggest we build up our recruiting?

Everyone keeps bringing up basketball...but don't forget this is what SMU basketball is:

1) State of the art IPF (Crum Center)
2) Brand new state of the art stadium (MoodY)
3) Larry Brown
4) You only need to recruit/transfer 2 or 3 guys to change your entire team into a contender (see Mudiay, Nic, Markus etc.)

Basketball also has an advantage football doesn't have: UT, A&M, TCU, BU, Texas Tech could care less about basketball...therefore it is easier to bring in 5 stars into basketball than Football.

Granted, LB and his staff hit the trail hard and communicate that well. June doesn't do that. Let's look at solutions since we are stuck with June for 3 years (1 year minimum probably)

Any solution has to begin with getting rid of June since he's our biggest obstacle to relevance. Once that happens then we need to focus on finding a replacement that can recruit DFW. Preferably an up and comer with good contacts in the region and experience in a P5 recruiting operation. This guy needs to understand the importance of recruiting this region and his staff should reflect those beliefs. Remember that no amount of new facilities can make up for a staff that can't recruit.

[ponyboy]

gostangs - it's funny how there actually still are "June lovers" given the horrible shape of the program.

How many do you think there are posting on here? People act like the site is overrun by them, but that does not seem to be the case to me.

I assume I'm one of Lebanese's "June lovers." I don't think that's fair. I wanted him gone at the end of last season. I find his recruiting atrocious. But I can still appreciate what he's done here. He certainly met my expectations in six seasons.

[ponyboy]

please get off June's lap.

bottom line is we are an average team at best with him at the helm. the sooner he's out the quicker the program will progress

And you please put down the pitchfork and torch.
There's a happy medium here somewhere.

Agreed.

[Treadway21]

Don't you really need to be studying for your finals

Shouldn't you be outside telling imaginary teenagers to stay off your lawn?

Now that is a funny response.

[Lebanese4Life]

gostangs - it's funny how there actually still are "June lovers" given the horrible shape of the program.

How many do you think there are posting on here? People act like the site is overrun by them, but that does not seem to be the case to me.

it's not about the amount of June supporters on here, it's about how passionately pro-June the June supporters are on here. It's quite ridiculous and does not make any sense to me.

[Lebanese4Life]

gostangs - it's funny how there actually still are "June lovers" given the horrible shape of the program.

How many do you think there are posting on here? People act like the site is overrun by them, but that does not seem to be the case to me.

I assume I'm one of Lebanese's "June lovers." I don't think that's fair. I wanted him gone at the end of last season. I find his recruiting atrocious. But I can still appreciate what he's done here. He certainly met my expectations in six seasons.

Yep you guessed it PB. I can appreciate what June has done for us also. He made us somewhat relevant by getting us to some low-tier bowl games, but to be honest there was only one way to go when he took over.. up. The last 2-3 years (post ASU fiasco) we have been on the decline and we've essentially just been wasting time. And based on the recent recruiting classes, June has stopped putting forth the effort. Given the amount of money he is paid, that is just plain unacceptable. I'm glad that you wanted him gone at the end of last season, but he should've been gone after the ASU debacle.

[Lebanese4Life]

please get off June's lap.

bottom line is we are an average team at best with him at the helm. the sooner he's out the quicker the program will progress

And you please put down the pitchfork and torch.
There's a happy medium here somewhere.

Agreed.

I won't put down the pitchfork and torch until June is canned. In fact, everyone should be joining the mob so that the administration gets the message. I'm sorry but I'm an avid fan of the Mustangs and I won't support a head coach who "half-asses" it. As has been explained countless times on here, recruiting is the most important thing in college football, and June has completely failed in that regard.

[ponyboy]

...to be honest there was only one way to go when he took over.. up

Then why couldn't anybody do it in the two decades before him? They didn't take us up, they took us sideways through the gutter. It's really ok to give JJ credit.

I'm curious. How long have you been paying attention to SMU football? No disrespect. Just a question.