Roster Analysis - What Morris has to work with

[NewAgeMustange]

Honest question here: Let's say next fall 10 guys say the team isn't for them anymore. Could 10 full tuition paying students that weren't "recruited" walk on? How does the system work?

[Digetydog]

Honest question here: Let's say next fall 10 guys say the team isn't for them anymore. Could 10 full tuition paying students that weren't "recruited" walk on? How does the system work?

My understanding is they can.

[blackoutpony]

Once Gilbert got injured, how many games did we win? Zero. How many points per game did we score? Almost Zero.

He clearly sucked.

So he got hurt and we replaced him with a scrub that played like a scrub, put Gilbert in the HOF ASAP.

June would have been fired at the end of last year without Gilbert. Montana State would've won by 3 touchdowns at least. He's not an NFL QB because he's not accurate enough, but in HAL MUMMES offense, he put up video game numbers, albeit against mostly subpar competition.

[sbsmith]

June would have been fired at the end of last year without Gilbert. Montana State would've won by 3 touchdowns at least. He's not an NFL QB because he's not accurate enough, but in HAL MUMMES offense, he put up video game numbers, albeit against mostly subpar competition.

Believe me I realize how bad we would have been last year without him (1-11) but like you said he did his best work against subpar competition. The guy was an outstanding citizen and representative of this university but I don't feel the need to embellish his accomplishments.

[ChadFanFromSC]

Honest question here: Let's say next fall 10 guys say the team isn't for them anymore. Could 10 full tuition paying students that weren't "recruited" walk on? How does the system work?

Most people are familiar with the 85 scholarship limit. There is also a 105 player limit for the total team practice squad. So 85 scholarships with 20 walk-ons basically.

The "recruited" walk-on is a bit odd. Basically, if you had a National Letter of Intent or an official visit, you are a "recruited" walk-on. As a recruited walk-on you do not count as a scholarship until you play or get athletic money. Even if you get zero athletic money, if you play in a game you count against the 85 if you were designated a "recruited" walk-on.

If you just show up off the street and dominate as a non-recruited walk-on paying his own way, then you count against the 105 but not 85.

Clemson's Daniel Rodriguez is a walk-on who made the 105.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/page/veterans121106/daniel-rodriguez-army-veteran-serves-inspiration-clemson-tigers-teammates-college-football

[JasonB]

Since I was called out, I wanted to extend what blackout posted before... When I look at the quality of the players in the class, I think it is important not only to get a perspective from one recruiting service, but from multiple.

Generally, at our level:

Good recruits: players who are 3 star from all 3 services (ESPN a 70 rating is a 3 star), OR get 3 stars from 2 services and a couple of BCS offers, OR they get 3 stars from only one and a bunch of offers.

Okay recruits: 3 stars from 2 of the services, no BCS offers, but some other offers OR 3 stars from 1 of the services a BCS offer and a few other non-BCS offers.

Iffy recruits: 3 stars from 1 service and a couple of offers. Or 2 stars across the board but a decent number of offers.

DIR: 2 stars across the board, few offers.

CB:
- Law would have qualified as a good recruit, Rhodes would have been Iffy although ESPN thought he would be a "good non-BCS player".
- JR: Good to Okay - 3 stars from 2 services, 2 BCS, 2 other offers
- Horace - Iffy - 3 star rivals, close on ESPN, no offers
- Montes - Iffy - 3 star ESPN, 1 non-BCS offer
- Washington and Montgomery are DIR

S:
- Justice and Randolph - Good - 3 stars across the board
- Greenbaur and Wyatt - Okay - 3 stars from two services
- D Rich - Iffy - 1 3 star, but ESPN loved him once he would add strength.
- Crosby - DIR

DE:
- Minor, Wood, Cameron Smith are all Good
- Nabusoshi - Okay - 3 stars from Scout and ESPN
- Epply and Pursley are both iffy - only rated high by ESPN
- Barnes, Pruitt, Conley, Gentry are all DIR

DT:
- Reed is Iffy - only ESPN rated him high
- Hollie is DIR

LB:
- Lincoln Richard was a good recruit, but transferred
- Yenga - Good
- Bordano, Ngalo, and Longoria - Okay - 3 stars from two services, no offers
- Carroll, Seals, Mitchell, Rhone - Iffy - 3 stars on ESPN and no offers
- Horton, anglin, Tui - DIR

OL:
- Myers was a really good recruit - 3 stars across the board, 5 BCS and 7 non-BCS offers
- Weeks - good - no offers, but 3 stars across the board
- Fister, McCarthy, Chamugua, Holloway, Lasecki, Brown, Hyder, Richards - iffy - 1 3 star rating and limited offers
- Barns and Natour - DIR

QB:
- Davis was really good
- Burcham was good - 3 star rivals, 4 ESPN, although limited offers because of injury.
- Colbert - good - 3 star across the board, ESPN called him Russell Wilson
- Kassel and Severt - Iffy - 1 3 star rating and limited offers. ESPN loved Severt

RB:
- Gresham - Great
- Nlemchi and Line - both good, 3 stars across the board
- Durrall - DIR

WR:
- Gaines, Sutton - very good - 3 star across teh board and multiple BCS offers
- Lagasse - good - 3 stars across the board, a few offers
- Walker - between OK and good - 3 stars from 2 services and some BCS offers
- Lancaster - Okay - 3 stars from 2 services not a lot of offers
- Joseph, Ingram - Iffy - 3 stars from one service
- Halverson and Deion - DIR


I know I will get hammered on this because I don't follow the masses, but it is important to remember that the last three classes PB had, we had a TON of players who were 2 star across the board, that the services hadn't even heard of until they showed up on signing day. Having a lot of players in the "Iffy" category instead of DIR is not anywhere near where any of us want to be, but it is actually a step up from when PB was around.

[Puckhead48E]

Holy sh*tballs people!!! Footbaldouche and SB and Diggety and the rest, lay off it. The weekend data dump was a bit excessive, but it does prove the point that we are currently working with broken toys. Every sperm is sacred, which also means every kid on this team is loved by their parents...even if they weren't loved by Northeast Southwestern PolyTechnical Institute of Manicured Mimes and offered a scholarship. We have a team filled with kids who were not wanted by anyone else. Is this good? Yes, if you are John Hughes making a movie based in the 80's. No otherwise. Is this a horrible thing that guarantees redefining excessive failure? No, because there are others who are making due with similar broken toy collections. How do they do it? Coaching. Well, we now seem to have improved just a slight bit past excessively in that area, so we get to see. I would hazard a guess that we muster at least 4 wins next season. Am I crazy? Maybe, but not as crazy as whoever thinks Morris will be able to make 15-20 3-4 star commits appear between now and next spring. Let's all take a breather and enjoy this. Our sucky roster will slowly get less sucky, and our remaining sucky players will get less sucky as well because they are in a better program with higher standards and are playing against a higher standard. Heck, some of those "crappy" 0/1 star guys might end up being late bloomers who produce.

And footballdad, seriously, please stop being such a [deleted]. No one harbors any personal animus against your kid. He could be the worst player, and no one would really care if he was able to improve and make an impact (albeit a positive one if possible!). All of us who are dads wish the best for our kids and defend them to the hilt, no matter the merits or actual validity of the perceived or other insult. I appreciate your relay of the atmosphere when Morris met the team. Valuable insight...keep it coming. Best of luck to your guy (I assume not a SR). I bet he is looking at this as an amazing opportunity and sure he will do everything to make the most of it.

[Rebel10]

Since I was called out, I wanted to extend what blackout posted before... When I look at the quality of the players in the class, I think it is important not only to get a perspective from one recruiting service, but from multiple.

Generally, at our level:

Good recruits: players who are 3 star from all 3 services (ESPN a 70 rating is a 3 star), OR get 3 stars from 2 services and a couple of BCS offers, OR they get 3 stars from only one and a bunch of offers.

Okay recruits: 3 stars from 2 of the services, no BCS offers, but some other offers OR 3 stars from 1 of the services a BCS offer and a few other non-BCS offers.

Iffy recruits: 3 stars from 1 service and a couple of offers. Or 2 stars across the board but a decent number of offers.

DIR: 2 stars across the board, few offers.

CB:
- Law would have qualified as a good recruit, Rhodes would have been Iffy although ESPN thought he would be a "good non-BCS player".
- JR: Good to Okay - 3 stars from 2 services, 2 BCS, 2 other offers
- Horace - Iffy - 3 star rivals, close on ESPN, no offers
- Montes - Iffy - 3 star ESPN, 1 non-BCS offer
- Washington and Montgomery are DIR

S:
- Justice and Randolph - Good - 3 stars across the board
- Greenbaur and Wyatt - Okay - 3 stars from two services
- D Rich - Iffy - 1 3 star, but ESPN loved him once he would add strength.
- Crosby - DIR

DE:
- Minor, Wood, Cameron Smith are all Good
- Nabusoshi - Okay - 3 stars from Scout and ESPN
- Epply and Pursley are both iffy - only rated high by ESPN
- Barnes, Pruitt, Conley, Gentry are all DIR

DT:
- Reed is Iffy - only ESPN rated him high
- Hollie is DIR

LB:
- Lincoln Richard was a good recruit, but transferred
- Yenga - Good
- Bordano, Ngalo, and Longoria - Okay - 3 stars from two services, no offers
- Carroll, Seals, Mitchell, Rhone - Iffy - 3 stars on ESPN and no offers
- Horton, anglin, Tui - DIR

OL:
- Myers was a really good recruit - 3 stars across the board, 5 BCS and 7 non-BCS offers
- Weeks - good - no offers, but 3 stars across the board
- Fister, McCarthy, Chamugua, Holloway, Lasecki, Brown, Hyder, Richards - iffy - 1 3 star rating and limited offers
- Barns and Natour - DIR

QB:
- Davis was really good
- Burcham was good - 3 star rivals, 4 ESPN, although limited offers because of injury.
- Colbert - good - 3 star across the board, ESPN called him Russell Wilson
- Kassel and Severt - Iffy - 1 3 star rating and limited offers. ESPN loved Severt

RB:
- Gresham - Great
- Nlemchi and Line - both good, 3 stars across the board
- Durrall - DIR

WR:
- Gaines, Sutton - very good - 3 star across teh board and multiple BCS offers
- Lagasse - good - 3 stars across the board, a few offers
- Walker - between OK and good - 3 stars from 2 services and some BCS offers
- Lancaster - Okay - 3 stars from 2 services not a lot of offers
- Joseph, Ingram - Iffy - 3 stars from one service
- Halverson and Deion - DIR


I know I will get hammered on this because I don't follow the masses, but it is important to remember that the last three classes PB had, we had a TON of players who were 2 star across the board, that the services hadn't even heard of until they showed up on signing day. Having a lot of players in the "Iffy" category instead of DIR is not anywhere near where any of us want to be, but it is actually a step up from when PB was around.

You have been called out before with your love affair with the ESPN site. It has been shown that they are probably the worst of the 4. I don't care if they havr four stars, offers are the telling thing and not offers from NW St. Also according to you June recruited very well and according to your suck up practice report info the team was suppose to good. According to you our front 7 was suppose to be the best. You were the biggest JJ suck up on the board and still are to some degree in constantly trying to defend his sub par recruiting. Pitiful that we just now ubder Chad Morris starting getting Randy Rogers recruiting report again. Why don't you go join join June at whatever place he goes to.

One comment that comes up game after game in our own conference is that our team looks slow, undersized, and unathletic. You are an idiot if you think that is not on recruiting. Many saw this coming a mile away but you didn't.

Our recruited was bad and our record indicates so.

[Digetydog]

You have been called out before with your love affair with the ESPN site. It has been shown that they are probably the worst of the 4. I don't care if they havr four stars, offers are the telling thing and not offers from NW St. Also according to you June recruited very well and according to your suck up practice report info the team was suppose to good. According to you our front 7 was suppose to be the best. You were the biggest JJ suck up on the board and still are to some degree in constantly trying to defend his sub par recruiting. Pitiful that we just now ubder Chad Morris starting getting Randy Rogers recruiting report again. Why don't you go join join June at whatever place he goes to.

One comment that comes up game after game in our own conference is that our team looks slow, undersized, and unathletic. You are an idiot if you think that is not on recruiting. Many saw this coming a mile away but you didn't.

Our recruited was bad and our record indicates so.

On that we agree.

[sbsmith]

I know I will get hammered on this because I don't follow the masses

You only get hammered when you're wrong.

[Johnny Utah]

Question: will any of the injured players be requesting a medical redshirt? How many? Do we even want those players?....Or is this just a straight up house cleaning regardless of talent to avoid any further growing of the negative culture June Jones left....

[JasonB]

You have been called out before with your love affair with the ESPN site. It has been shown that they are probably the worst of the 4. I don't care if they havr four stars, offers are the telling thing and not offers from NW St. Also according to you June recruited very well and according to your suck up practice report info the team was suppose to good. According to you our front 7 was suppose to be the best. You were the biggest JJ suck up on the board and still are to some degree in constantly trying to defend his sub par recruiting. Pitiful that we just now ubder Chad Morris starting getting Randy Rogers recruiting report again. Why don't you go join join June at whatever place he goes to.

One comment that comes up game after game in our own conference is that our team looks slow, undersized, and unathletic. You are an idiot if you think that is not on recruiting. Many saw this coming a mile away but you didn't.

Our recruited was bad and our record indicates so.

On that we agree.

1) I don't have a love affair with the ESPN site. I am simply including it in the analysis.
2) I haven't seen anything "proven" that ESPN is the worst, and I am certainly not arguing it is the best. Just providing a point of information.
3) I suspect that June did have a love affair with ESPN, as they tended to rate his recruits higher. If there was any service he subscribed to, that was probably it.
4) I NEVER said that June was doing a great job recruiting. NEVER. That is an OUTRIGHT LIE. All I have said in the past is that he is relying on his staff to assess players independent of insights provided by recruiting services and that it is his bed he will lie in. I wasn't judging him ahead of the game, because I just don't see the point. I judge people on results.
5) I had us at 5 wins this year. Some had us with more, others with less. I was a little lower on the win count than most of the media. The majority of people on this board, not just me, thought the front 7 would be decent this year because of the transfers and Yenga/Sanders and the returning DL. Pretty much everyone thought that. In fact, I was the one saying not to count on the Rice transfer for much because we play a different system.
6) Where in the post above do I say that the recruits on a whole are good? I don't. ALL I am pointing out is that we are in a better place now than when PB was here. It is pretty much impossible not to be. Please go look at the Rivals rankings for PBs last seasons as a point of comparison. I am not saying we had good classes. I'm just saying we didn't finish in last place like those did.
7) Why don't YOU go back to wherever you came from. At least I don't have a different school's mascot in my screen name on this site. I only have one true allegiance. Your whole state sucks, but don't take that out on me.
My practice reports weren't suck up reports. None of the sites, Rivals, Scout, Pony fans, came out and said the team was going to be horrible this year. When you evaluate practices, it is in a contained environment. You base things off of the "knowns". For example, if you saw an OL handle a Margus Hunt bull rush and keep up with Margus athletically, you would say, wow, that OL might have something. People aren't running around practice with a 99 score from Madden hovering above their heads. Some players stand out, and others don't. When you see a guy standout, you have to evaluate against who they are playing in order to determine if they are just standouts at a 2A level or if they can do it at 5A. Going into this season, we had a bunch of "knowns" on the DL. So, when our OL isn't getting blown up in practice by the DL, you think, wow, the OL might be okay. It isn't until you see them against a different team that you find out the DL has significantly regressed, and so the practice assessments are way off.

Other times, holy cow, I make mistakes. The secondary makes tons of plays every practice I have watched. In the past it wasn't like that. So you think, wow, the secondary is going to be much better. The speed is there, the athleticism is there. But then you put them in a game, and you find out two things. 1) the other team has better receivers than we do. 2) the guys aren't playing at the same level than they do in practice.

Sometimes people are actually human and get some things wrong. It doesn't make them someone's relative. And it doesn't make them a suck up. It just makes them human.

Back off, and stop being such a jerk. There is no reason to go around like a 10 year old bringing up old posts months later to pull an I told you so. Look around and notice that nobody does that to you, regardless of a lot of the stupid stuff you spit out. Maybe running around rubbing people the wrong way isn't the best way to go through life.

[blackoutpony]

Severt is literally a clone of Gilbert. Nearly identical size and similar athletic ability. Morris, being very, very familiar with Gilbert and his skills, should be able to make a quick evaluation of Severt to determine whether or not he warrants reps in his scheme.

Severt had exactly zero offers except SMU out of high school.

The question was whether Severt was a runner or not? Had nothing to do with stars or offers. 100% confident Morris will be able to make a quick & accurate evaluation of Severt, especially with his history with Gilbert. With his high school connections, he'll probably go one step further and call Severt's high school coach to get feedback and assess his leadership skills and mental makeup.

I think Severt at least makes the top group of 3 or 4 who can run the Morris scheme if called upon. Unfortunately there are 3 or 4 others on the roster who have absolutely no chance, so it'll be interesting to see how Morris handles it.

Bump

[footballdad]

Glad you took the time to find this. Everything I said looks like it was spot on.

The comparison to Gilbert came directly from players within the program, and there is probably still some highlights out there to confirm the same yourself.

Also said I was confident Morris would make a good evaluation, aided by his Austin Westlake days.

Finally I said 3 or 4 QB's had no chance, and I think 3 are no longer on the roster. Also Severt would at least be in the top group of 3 or 4. Looks like he's probably buried at 4 with Krstich, behind Davis, Colbert & Hicks.

Morris made his evaluation and he obviously prefers a more mobile QB at this point (Davis & Colbert). Hicks was his first QB recruit, and he's young, so he's giving him a shot at 3. Severt & Krstich will hold the clipboard and graduate, good for them.

[malonish]

They get a good education with minimal danger. Good for them.