SEC Expansion Rumors

[Ponymon]

http://tinyurl.com/pxsrzbt

[East Coast Mustang]

OU wouldn't leave OSU behind. Also don't see UNC and Duke splitting up.

I think SEC eventually goes to 16 with NC State and Va. Tech

[East Coast Mustang]

SEC would much rather have Raleigh/Durham/Charlotte and Va. Beach/Richmond/DC markets than OKC

[dirtysouthpony]

OU wouldn't leave OSU behind. Also don't see UNC and Duke splitting up.

I think SEC eventually goes to 16 with NC State and Va. Tech

So would ACC backfill with Cincinatti and UConn?

[mrydel]

OU wouldn't leave OSU behind. Also don't see UNC and Duke splitting up.

Agree. Those would be as unlikely as Texas and Texas A&M splitting up.

[rodrod5]

the person that wrote that is a complete and total idiot

1. the SEC "expected" to make $35 million per team just off the SEC network.......hey idiot the SEC now only makes 22 million per team and that is for first tier rights, second tier rights, the SEC CCG, bowl games and all NCAA distributions

so how in the hell is third tier content that has been passed over by CBS and ESPN as first and second tier rights holders going to be worth $13 million more per team than the prime content that has always been sold to the highest bidders......just stupid what an idiot

and if womens basketball, bowling, volleyball and the like that will be mostly on the channel along with reruns of yesteryear had all that value it would have been monetized LONG ago

2. trying to say the GoR is worthless.......um the GoR is a GRANT OF RIGHTS for MEDIA RIGHTS......so yes in fact the Big 12 DOES own the media rights of the teams in the conference because those were granted in the GoR

what an idiot trying to say that the Big 12 and Fox (and ESPN idiot that is the FIRST TIER RIGHTS HOLDER for the Big 12) do not own the media rights when that is EXACTLY what the GoR is......granting media rights to the conference and then the conference sells them to ESPN AND FOX and then under a totally separate agreement the conference distributes money to conference members for being members

that is what makes the GoR different than an exit penalty contract.......THE EXIT PENALTY CONTRACT is the contract where the conference does not own the media rights and where the team owns the media rights and the court fight is not over if that team gets to take their media rights it is simply over what the penalty for leaving the conference is and if that penalty is reasonable to actual damages or if it is punitive

if it is punitive then it is unenforceable and it is up to the CONFERENCE to prove damages

while with the GoR it is up to the team that is leaving to prove damages for not retaining their media rights and once that team places a value of damages that opens it up for the conference to make that same claim of damages

and the team leaving cannot claim loss of compensation because the compensation comes from being a member NOT selling media rights

also it is 100% the opposite of what he is saying......if the team that is leaving is going to be paid by their new conference then they HAVE NO DAMAGES even if they leave their media rights until the expiration of the GoR......and again if they attempt to claim damages because their games will not be televised that allows the CONFERENCE they left to claim those same damages for not being able to show that content they were granted under the GoR

so that idiot has it completely backwards

3. The Big 12 specifically has media deals with ESPN and Fox......the idiot that posted that was too stupid to even know that ESPN is the first tier rights holder for the Big 12 not Fox or that Fox was not the exclusive rights holder

4. the Big 12 contracts call for the Big 12 to have 10 teams......so "Texas" (funny how idiots always want to only talk about Texas Texas Texas) and every other Big 12 team would not be getting money that was going to OU as a larger cut of the existing media deal because the deal would not be in effect unless the Big 12 went to 10 teams again

so that again makes the person that wrote that just a moron because they have no clue about the Big 12 media deals or how they are structured

5. if ESPN was to lure OU away from the Big 12 and then tried to claim that the Big 12 was not fulfilling their first tier TV deal with ESPN that would open ESPN up to all types of legal issues and to massive legal damages for interference with a contract that they are a party to and trying to void that contract illegally

ESPN knows this full well and that is why they would not be involved

6. it has been stated repeatedly that conferences have the ability to renegotiate contracts for adding teams, but that has only happened for the ACC in the form of about 1.2 million per team when ND joined and that was not even a REQUIREMENT that was actually just their rights holder wanting to actually get ND into the fold and make that deal work because it was an advantage to them and ND was the team with value that was not a party to any conference contract and the NBC contract only applies to ND home games

so ESPN was looking at getting ND "away games" as games that would be home games for ACC teams and that had value so ESPN coughed up well under half of what many anticipated (anticipated 3+ million per ACC team) in the form of 1.2 million per ACC team to get ESPN to come

the SEC has NEVER gotten additional money from CBS or even ESPN and a second tier rights holder for adding MU and A&M......there was simply no "look in" and no additional money given

the Big 10 was never given more money for adding NU in their first tier deals and they will not be given more money in their first tier deal for adding Rutgers and Maryland either

and while the Big 10 does have their first tier deal, some basketball deals, and their CCG contract all coming up at the same time which amounts to what would be "first tier" rights for most conferences they will not get any additional money for NU, RU, or MD until those deals come due and even then I bet that the increase in total dollars is well under what is anticipated and the increase per team with 3 new teams is even lower than anticipated

also when NU was added to the Big 10 as the share NU received from the BTN increased the actual per team payout to existing teams DECREASED so again the Big 10 is actually earning only slightly more per team because of the addition of NU based on the fact that the BTN is paying less per team and the fact that existing "first tier" deals for football and basketball are being split 12 ways not 11 as is the BTN.....BUT with the addition of a CCG they were able to come out slightly ahead.....but without the CCG deal the Big 10 earns less per team under the football and basketball first tier deals and the BTN pays less.....so without any boost from a new CCG with the addition of Rutgers and Maryland the Big 10 will earn less per team unless the wildly inflated numbers for the BTN entering Maryland and NY/NJ come through......and again with the addition of NU the BTN payout DROPPED per team

the Big 10 had a 10 year 1 billion dollar first tier football deal with ESPN so 100 million dollars per year expiring in 2016-17

they have a basketball deal with CBS for 6 years 72 million so 12 million per year ending in 2016-17

so 112 million per year / 11 = 10.18 million per year

112 / 12 = 9.33

the Big 10 was able to add a CCG in football with the addition of NU with Fox and it pays $145 million for 6 years ending in 2016-17 so 24.1 million per year

so 112 + 24.1 = 136.1 / 12 = 11.34 million per team

so with the addition of NU the per team payout went from 10.18 million to 11.34 million and that is only based on the fact that with 12 teams the Big 10 was able to add a CCG and sell it as a separate deal......and again the BTN payout has DECREASED about $700,000 per team as the additional share to NU increases so the Big 10 might actually be losing money with the addition of NU because the difference in money for football/basketball/CCG os only about $550,000 while the BTN decrease is more than that

and again with the addition of RU and MD there is no new CCG money there is only the hoped for and anticipated and wildly over inflated BTN new carriage fee money

so you have 112 + 24.1 + 93 (about what the BTN pays out per team @ 7.8 million per team)

so that is 19.1 million per team + NCAA and Bowl money and that gets you right to about the $25 million per year the Big 10 distributed per team

so now with RU and MD

112 + 24.1 + 93 / 14 = 16.37

19.1 - 16.37 = 2.73 less X 14 teams = 38.22 million per year

so for the Big 10 to break even in adding RU and MD they need the new carriage fees for adding RU and MD to add up to 38.22 million per year which would be over a 33% increase in what the BTN pays out now with all the major programs and states already in the Big 10 foot print

then you add in that RU and MD will probably not carry their weight in NCAA playoff money, bowls or other NCAA distributions and that eats into the approximately 7 million per year the Big 10 is getting for that per team

and it will continue like that until 2016-17 and I am of the opinion that when all of te first tier ESPN football content, the CBS basketball content and the Fox CCG content (the Big 10 CCG has been a major loser in terms of live attendance) is packaged together as a whole it will bring a lot less of an increase than anticipated simply because the Big 10 was able to sell those deals as pieces when sports content was rising in value dramatically and new networks were forming and looking for content and as pieces went onto the market they were over valued and now with sports content at a plateau and that content almost certainly being bid on as one package there will not be a massive increase in total value it will be much smaller than anticipated even if an overall per team boost of a slight amount

the person that wrote that BS about OU especially is simply an unmitigated and uninformed idiot.....even if OU did go to the SEC alone it would not be nearly as simple as spelled out nor would it be as lucrative and it would be a major legal battle that would be highly costly and if ESPN even did a single one of the things that idiot thinks they could or would do ESPN would probably lose billions in a court case for tortuous interference

[RGV Pony]

Longest post ever?

[Nacho]

pretty standard lawyer post.

[rodrod5]

pretty standard lawyer post.

I am not a lawyer

and I have always noticed that lawyers do not get involved in legal discussions outside of work and especially on the WWW

also lawyers realize that anything can be discussed and have any point or side taken and defended.....that is after all why lawyers exist and sometimes there is a winner and a loser and sometimes just lawyers win and the plaintiff and defendant lose

and they get enough of that at work and also giving legal advice without being actual retained legal counsel is highly risky

[ideal]

the person that wrote that is a complete and total idiot



I am of the opinion that when all of te first tier ESPN football content, the CBS basketball content and the Fox CCG content (the Big 10 CCG has been a major loser in terms of live attendance) is packaged together as a whole it will bring a lot less of an increase than anticipated simply because the Big 10 was able to sell those deals as pieces when sports content was rising in value dramatically and new networks were forming and looking for content and as pieces went onto the market they were over valued and now with sports content at a plateau and that content almost certainly being bid on as one package there will not be a massive increase in total value it will be much smaller than anticipated even if an overall per team boost of a slight amount

The AAC is a great idea, was thinking ahead, and is in position to negotiate a fantastic tv deal.
Perhaps they should have kept the Big East name for another year, and then deep-sixed it, but mistakes are made. This power play meme is not going to work, and many well-known programs would be better off affiliating with the AAC.

[Dukie]

OU wouldn't leave OSU behind. Also don't see UNC and Duke splitting up.

Agree. Those would be as unlikely as Texas and Texas A&M splitting up.

Much less likely than Texas and Texas A&M splitting up. There is no wedge between Duke and UNC that is remotely comparable to the Longhorn Network.

[EastStang]

The Big Ten deal added RU and UMD for one reason, TV's for the Big Ten network. By adding RU, the Big Ten is betting that NYC area cable is going to have to add the Big Ten network to its lineup. That what about $30 Million at a $1 per set? By adding Maryland, the Network is betting that they will add the entire Baltimore/WDC area cable systems which would add another $5 Million at a $1 per set. I suspect that the promise was that Rutgers and UMD would get the lion's share of those revenues, but I don't know if that's the case or not.

[B1GPonyFan]

Nothing says a college fan web site than tiresome, unsubstantiated expansion threads/posts.

[ponyinNC]

SMU2BCS

oh wait....

[sbsmith]

SMU2BCS

oh wait....

SMU2FCS if June gets his way.