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Should have been 16 teams from the drop... every other division of football has had a working model for decades.

Smumba2009 wrote:Should have been 16 teams from the drop... every other division of football has had a working model for decades.

The FCS (formerly Division I-AA) expanded their 16 team playoff to 24 teams with the top 8 teams getting a 1st round bye. Division I basketball is considering further expanding March Madness. No matter what changes are made, there will always be some programs arguing they should have been included in the field, should have been seeded higher, etc... I find it hard to believe conferences are going to willingly give up their championship games and the revenue they get from those so you have to be careful about how many games to schedule in what is a very physical game

Smumba2009 wrote:Should have been 16 teams from the drop... every other division of football has had a working model for decades.

I don’t know what “working model” means, but your implication that other NCAA tournaments are one size and stay that way is totally wrong. Every tournament I can think of, including the D1 MBB tournament, has grown repeatedly. FCS started with a 4-team playoff in the late 1970s, then 8, then 12, then 16, then 20, then finally (for now) 24 starting in 2013.

DallasDiehard wrote:https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/45393051/big-ten-sec-support-all-football-big-12-commish-says

All of this is about the SEC and BT maneuvering so that they control all CFB top tier post-season and thus also control virtually all that money . Guys like Yormark coo that the SEC and BT are acting largely alone now to agree on what they will tolerate from anyone else even surviving also have great responsibility because they hope that the pair will stop their destructions.

I am very glad that both ACC and Big XII are against 4-4-2 plus 1 Group of 5 team. The reason that SEC and BT want that group off 5 is that having that waters down the value of both ACC and Big XII. In democracy, the Rich always support the very poor because that weakened the power of the middle class to ever say no to the Rich. No Group of 5 league cqna ever be any type of threat to win anything at that level, but the ACC and even the Big XII could win a football National Championship an grow their TV audiences vis a vis SEC and BT. So Sec and BT want to work though all this making certain that the ACC gets hurt a good deal and perhaps they Big XII also get a loss of 2.

Again, their ultimate plan is to do to the ACC what they did to the Pac, forever reducing the ACC to non-Major conference status. At that point they will begin outlining their okay to have a Top Tier for football that is only SEC and BT. And at the sam time they will announce that they will also sponsor a basketball national tournament and they will allow other leagues to play in it. They do want to control all Top Tier basketball postseason money too.

Graceland Tar Heel wrote:

DallasDiehard wrote:https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/45393051/big-ten-sec-support-all-football-big-12-commish-says

All of this is about the SEC and BT maneuvering so that they control all CFB top tier post-season and thus also control virtually all that money . Guys like Yormark coo that the SEC and BT are acting largely alone now to agree on what they will tolerate from anyone else even surviving also have great responsibility because they hope that the pair will stop their destructions.

I am very glad that both ACC and Big XII are against 4-4-2 plus 1 Group of 5 team. The reason that SEC and BT want that group off 5 is that having that waters down the value of both ACC and Big XII. In democracy, the Rich always support the very poor because that weakened the power of the middle class to ever say no to the Rich. No Group of 5 league cqna ever be any type of threat to win anything at that level, but the ACC and even the Big XII could win a football National Championship an grow their TV audiences vis a vis SEC and BT. So Sec and BT want to work though all this making certain that the ACC gets hurt a good deal and perhaps they Big XII also get a loss of 2.

Again, their ultimate plan is to do to the ACC what they did to the Pac, forever reducing the ACC to non-Major conference status. At that point they will begin outlining their okay to have a Top Tier for football that is only SEC and BT. And at the sam time they will announce that they will also sponsor a basketball national tournament and they will allow other leagues to play in it. They do want to control all Top Tier basketball postseason money too.

While I would take issue with your example of "democracy" (Two wolves and a lamb voting on what is for lunch), your assertion is spot on. The Big 12 and the ACC provide nothing more than a nuisance to Greg Sankey and Tony Pettiti in their collective pursuit of cash and to dictate terms to others.

BTW, the alleged author (Franklin) of the quote about democracy is also credited with adding the following: "Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote". Any other non-member of the "two wolves" had best decide to play along until they are reduced to irrelevance, or organize a very separate path TOGETHER, as the Big10 and SEC have done. Don't rely on the charity of the wolves, you'll find none.

Getting to be tail wagging the dog. Kick the bums out, and let them start their own version of the NCAA, and playoffs.

How long until there are 32 or 64 teams playing in the playoff?

It will require guaranteed money for all players, just because of the physical beating young guys would be taking.

But TV dictates everything, and if more TV dollars can be had, you have to think that more playoff rounds are coming.

peruna81 wrote:

Graceland Tar Heel wrote:

DallasDiehard wrote:https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/45393051/big-ten-sec-support-all-football-big-12-commish-says

All of this is about the SEC and BT maneuvering so that they control all CFB top tier post-season and thus also control virtually all that money . Guys like Yormark coo that the SEC and BT are acting largely alone now to agree on what they will tolerate from anyone else even surviving also have great responsibility because they hope that the pair will stop their destructions.

I am very glad that both ACC and Big XII are against 4-4-2 plus 1 Group of 5 team. The reason that SEC and BT want that group off 5 is that having that waters down the value of both ACC and Big XII. In democracy, the Rich always support the very poor because that weakened the power of the middle class to ever say no to the Rich. No Group of 5 league cqna ever be any type of threat to win anything at that level, but the ACC and even the Big XII could win a football National Championship an grow their TV audiences vis a vis SEC and BT. So Sec and BT want to work though all this making certain that the ACC gets hurt a good deal and perhaps they Big XII also get a loss of 2.

Again, their ultimate plan is to do to the ACC what they did to the Pac, forever reducing the ACC to non-Major conference status. At that point they will begin outlining their okay to have a Top Tier for football that is only SEC and BT. And at the sam time they will announce that they will also sponsor a basketball national tournament and they will allow other leagues to play in it. They do want to control all Top Tier basketball postseason money too.

While I would take issue with your example of "democracy" (Two wolves and a lamb voting on what is for lunch), your assertion is spot on. The Big 12 and the ACC provide nothing more than a nuisance to Greg Sankey and Tony Pettiti in their collective pursuit of cash and to dictate terms to others.

BTW, the alleged author (Franklin) of the quote about democracy is also credited with adding the following: "Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote". Any other non-member of the "two wolves" had best decide to play along until they are reduced to irrelevance, or organize a very separate path TOGETHER, as the Big10 and SEC have done. Don't rely on the charity of the wolves, you'll find none.

I think it a given that SEC and BT are dead set to eventually pare down Top Tier CFB to well under 100 schools/teams. In fact, I think both would prefer to have only their 2 leagues, with each numbering between 20 and 24. I think the mist that they will accept will be 4 leagues with a total of maybe 80 schools/teams.

They look at things this way: the money in CFB comes from viewers, and their two leagues draw by far the most viewers. So that means they see it all as about their right to take in all the money they produce by drawing large audiences.

To make it very simple, let's say that TV will pay 30 million for the National Championship Game and also for each Semi Final. That is 90 million. And let's say that TV also will pay 15 million for each of 4 Quarter Finals (60 Million) and 5 million for each of 8 1st round games (40 million). 190 million dollars is a huge amount of money for a playoff. But if the SEC and BT must agree that at last 5 different leagues get direct payment from that by having at lest one team take that playoff, and the also give a small portion to each league in D1A (FBS), then each SEC and BT team will get less payout than it would if only the SEC and BT are on the CFB Top Tier.

Those two plans to have Top Tier football cut in numbers to between 72 and 78 would have taken care of half of what SEC and BT want (major culling of who has any shot to play toward that Top Tier playoff), but both SEC and BT are adamantly opposed to any plan that would take away their regular season TV deals that make them much richer than the ACC and Big 12. They don not want a 1 TV deal pay off for all teams in the Top Tier.

I think the best that can be gotten from them, short of a Federal ruling against them (not ever gonna happen) is to have a Top Tier of 4 leagues with a total of no more than 80 members, each league having its own regular season TV deal, and SEC and BT both getting more Auto bids than the other leagues. Say, they get 3 each, while ACC and Big 12 get 2 each. That would leave 6 At-Large bids.

As such a situation would mean that the two bottom leagues would be scrapping for any extra dollars to play catch top to SEC and Bam I assert that the ACC must be ready to take top value frommthe Big 12 and also to cut the no value ACC members.

Survival with an ability to compete is THE issue for us.

This is why is was important for Clemson and FSU to settle with the ACC. They have to exist in the league for the league to still be a power player against the SEC and Big10. As long as they stay put, there is still large TV draw, and threat to the power structure of the SEC/Big10. Notre Dame is the other threat, and as a quasi-member for football, also helps keep the ACC in play. Add in markets for Miami, Atlanta, Boston, and now Dallas, and I believe the ACC is in a much stronger position than the Big 12 for remaining a power conference.

BillgoCU wrote:This is why is was important for Clemson and FSU to settle with the ACC. They have to exist in the league for the league to still be a power player against the SEC and Big10. As long as they stay put, there is still large TV draw, and threat to the power structure of the SEC/Big10. Notre Dame is the other threat, and as a quasi-member for football, also helps keep the ACC in play. Add in markets for Miami, Atlanta, Boston, and now Dallas, and I believe the ACC is in a much stronger position than the Big 12 for remaining a power conference.

Boston is a very poor market for CFB. And the market that is there is not for or about or because of BC - it is about ND 1st, 2nd, and 3rd. And it still for CFB is a market very small compared to Chicago. NYC is barely any better for CFB, and Syracuse located some 250 miles from NYC, helps the ACC almost nothing in NYC because Rutgers is within the NYC TV market and the BT had a boatload of alums living in NYC.

That is one small way to see why the ACC must reconfigure to maximize its football value, which means dropping market dead weight and adding schools that have more than one of the following: state Flagship and/or Land Grant that has a meaningful football history; other large state schools that have a meaningful history; schools located in states and TV markets that produce a lot of football talent; schools located in states and TV markets with a deep history of widespread watching of CFB; schools with rich boosters proven to invest big time CFB for their school.

If the ACC does nothing, then by that 3036 date all should know by now, the SEC and BT will have made such rich offers to the 6-8 mist valuable ACC schools that the league will become either the next SWC (totally dead) or the next PAC (alive in name but dead forever as a Major conference).

And GREED rules both SEC and BT. Each would love having not to share a single penny of Top Tier playoff money with any but the other league (neither can destroy the other, so they must co-exist). So either the ACC acts to make itself stronger in terns of TV numbers football, or the ACC eventually gets gutted. The best Big 12 values can add to ACC value, making sure it remains powerful enough to stand againstcthe SEC and BT as an equal in every way but regular season TV money, but if the SEC and BT get even just 4 of the top ACC values, a merged ACC-Big 12 still cannot stand against the SEC and BT. And that is why neither SEC nor BT cares a tiny bit t to try to take anybody from there Big 12.

That is what all is at stake. Sentimentality will get the ACC killed, and al college athletics will take a major blow.

So our task is clear. To semi quote from Major League, "I guess we have to just win the whole @%$#ing thing." That keeps us marketable and will increase our Dallas following.