Like it or not, this season died with the UAPB loss

[PoconoPony]

I'm not one to defend people for an "I give up" attitude and basically that's what I read into the General's statement...that this season died with the A-PB loss. I would assume the General now officially falls into JT's "no expectations" group for the remainder of this season...but as long as he continues following the season with enough interest and actually attends a game or two, he's way ahead of the majority of SMU fans that quit on the program long ago.

Let's face it...none of us who are still following this program marked that game against A-PB on our calendars and proclaimed it a "must win" for our tournament chances. Nobody in their right mind expects this team to reach the post season. I think the popular "lofty" pre-season goal (or should I say hope?) was this bunch could maybe go .500 ?

Doh's substitution pattern has everyone frustrated, but the fact that he is shuffling 11 guys in and out tells me he is just trying to figure out what he's got. I would expect things to settle down as we get into conference play...but I've been wrong before. This season is about tying to figure out how many of these 1st and 2nd year players might be able to help this team become truly competitive in the next couple of years. I'm just hoping for year over year improvement from this year forward...because the program has just about been torn to the ground in this latest rebuilding project.

I share your sentiments. Never-the-less, if my memory serves me correctly the reason Doh was run out of UNC was the perception/reality that he was insufficient as a game coach. Doh recruits gave Roy Williams his first UNC national championship so his ability to recruit and the level of talent brought in was not an issue at UNC. The problems/criticisms surrounding Doh involved his questionable game decisions, substitution patterns and failure to adapt his style of game to the strengths and creativity of his kids. Obviously, we do not have the talent of his UNC teams; however, we may be experiencing many of the coaching issues that knowledgeable UNC officials and fans found to be unacceptable resulting in his dismissal.

[True Colors]

Doherty lost his job at North Carolina for two reasons. He lost a lot of games and he p!ssed off a bunch of people.

TC

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matt_Doherty

Doherty's first season was largely a success as the Heels shot to the #1 ranking in the polls in the middle of the Atlantic Coast Conference schedule. Fans and players alike seemed energized by his boisterous and in-your-face coaching style, which seemed refreshing when compared to the notoriously low-key Smith and Guthridge. (In fact, Doherty received a standing ovation when he was hit with a technical foul in the team's first game of the season.)[2] However, a string of unexpected losses in the latter part of the year set the Tar Heels reeling and even though they finished with an impressive 26-7 record, they made an early exit out of the NCAA Tournament with a second-round upset loss to Penn State. Doherty was named as national coach of the year by the Associated Press.

The 2001-02 season would not be nearly as enjoyable for Doherty and the Tar Heels as the loss of the previous year's seniors, combined with a roster full of untested freshmen, proved disastrous. The Tar Heels finished the season with a record of 8–20, finishing with a losing record for the first time since 1962 (Dean Smith's first year as coach). They missed postseason play entirely for the first time since the 1965–66 season (including a record 26 straight NCAA Tournament appearances). The 20 losses were easily the most a Tar Heel team has ever suffered. They also finished 4–12 in the ACC--only the Tar Heels' second losing record in ACC play ever. The 12 losses were six more than the Tar Heels had ever suffered in a single season of ACC play, and placed them in a tie for 7th place--the program's first finish below fourth place ever. The season also saw the end of UNC's run of 31 straight 20-win seasons and 35 straight seasons of finishing third or higher in the ACC.

In 2002–2003 the Tar Heels rebounded but still fell short of what North Carolina fans had come to expect, finishing 19-16 and earning a berth in the NIT. The team started extremely well, winning the preseason NIT with decisive victories over Kansas and Stanford, but an early, season-ending injury to center May left the team with almost no presence inside. Throughout the year many players (particularly Sean May) and other program insiders had publicly voiced their displeasure with Doherty, and fans began to call for Doherty's firing.[3]

According to Blue Blood[4] by Art Chansky (a longtime historian on the UNC program), Doherty was told on March 31 that he would not be allowed to return due to an irreparable rift with his players. Given the option of resigning or being fired, he resigned the next day.

According to Chansky, the seeds for Doherty's downfall were planted by decisions made soon after being named as coach. He announced that he would bring his entire staff from Notre Dame, leaving assistant coaches Phil Ford, Pat Sullivan and Dave Hanners out of jobs. He also forced out several longtime secretaries in the basketball office. In his first address to the team, he stated that he felt they hadn't done enough--something which jarred a group that had managed to make a Cinderella run to the Final Four in the previous season. The day after the resignation, Inside Carolina's Thad Williamson reported that UNC officials were very concerned about the lack of a respectful environment in the program. In part because of this, three scholarship players had transferred--an unusually high number for any college basketball program, especially one of UNC's stature. Several more were threatening to leave if Doherty had been allowed to stay on. Doherty had reportedly been given a year to make things more harmonious if he wanted to keep his job.[5] According to Chansky, apparently this didn't happen, as only two players supported Doherty's return for the 2003–04 season.

[EastStang]

I love all this gloom and doom. The problem is as always, where is the greener grass? We have a National Coach of the Year coach with a Dean Smith pedigree. He's had success in the past and failures in the past like most coaches. I don't know if he is the answer, but right now SMU is not a place to where coaches will flock if he is let go. We fired Tubbs after two years and soiled our relations with the DISD coaches in the process. We fired Dement mid-season, and still have his wife coaching. And Dement has been relatively successful at UNCG since then. This is what other prospective coaches focus on. We need to at least give the appearance that Doherty is being given a full chance to turn this ship around. If he fails after 5 seasons, then we figure out a new plan and direction for the program. At this point, let's just hope that this corps of players gels and we start looking like a Division 1 basketball team.

[George S. Patton]

I love all this gloom and doom. The problem is as always, where is the greener grass? We have a National Coach of the Year coach with a Dean Smith pedigree. He's had success in the past and failures in the past like most coaches. I don't know if he is the answer, but right now SMU is not a place to where coaches will flock if he is let go. We fired Tubbs after two years and soiled our relations with the DISD coaches in the process. We fired Dement mid-season, and still have his wife coaching. And Dement has been relatively successful at UNCG since then. This is what other prospective coaches focus on. We need to at least give the appearance that Doherty is being given a full chance to turn this ship around. If he fails after 5 seasons, then we figure out a new plan and direction for the program. At this point, let's just hope that this corps of players gels and we start looking like a Division 1 basketball team.

If this season completely flattens, I think Doherty gets one more year to show marked improvement in 2009-2010. If its pretty close to what we've seen from the first three, he's gone.

[True Colors]

East Stang I just cannot agree with most of those points. Saying that Matt Doherty has the same pedigree as Dean Smith makes no sense. Just because those two men happen to share one common ex employer does not make them equal in coaching ability. If you compare all of their achievements side by side you will see a gigantic contrast there. It is like night and day.

SMU did not ruin any relationship with DISD coaches. There was never much of a relationship to begin with. The connections that Tubbs supposedly had were proven to be nothing more than empty PR. And if you think that Doherty is increasing the popularity of SMU with local high school coaches then you are incorrect about that.

TC

[EastStang]

By saying that he had a Dean Smith pedigree, I was saying that Smith was his mentor. He learned the game and his craft from Dean Smith. Just like Roy Williams has a Dean Smith pedigree and Coach K has a Bobby Knight pedigree. And while I agree that we didn't have much of a relationship with the DISD, what little we had is now toast because of the firing of Tubbs, not because of the hiring of Doherty.

[Pony_Fan]

East Stang I just cannot agree with most of those points. Saying that Matt Doherty has the same pedigree as Dean Smith makes no sense. Just because those two men happen to share one common ex employer does not make them equal in coaching ability. If you compare all of their achievements side by side you will see a gigantic contrast there. It is like night and day.

SMU did not ruin any relationship with DISD coaches. There was never much of a relationship to begin with. The connections that Tubbs supposedly had were proven to be nothing more than empty PR. And if you think that Doherty is increasing the popularity of SMU with local high school coaches then you are incorrect about that.

TC

I think DISD all ended with Bhop. All the Tubbs apparent DISD love was fluff. Dement sort of cracked the code back then, not sure how - especially with tougher admissions and recruiting.

I would agree that being around Dean Smith surely helped him a little bit. Not sure how exactly yet.

[PoconoPony]

[quote="True Colors"]Doherty lost his job at North Carolina for two reasons. He lost a lot of games and he p!ssed off a bunch of people.

Your Wikipedia article is discriptive of the scene, but does not delve into the reasons why the team members were upset with Doh, why they transferred and/or were threatening to transfer, why UNC officials were concerned about him. Yes, in his 3d year many players were young and getting pounded in the ACC; however, I stick with my original comments supra. that he was viewed by the players, officials and fans as a poor game coach. His game decisions, substitution patterns, quick yanks, restricting players from innovation to stay strictly patterned....etc. were at the heart of the player's dissention. Maybe these young kids just needed the discipline and experience he gave them to be champs under Roy Williams and/or maybe he is just not a good game coach, stymied their talent/confidence and was responsible for more of those losses than necessary especially with the level of talent he had.

Obviously complicating the scene were his initial descisions to not retain on board members of the previous coaching staff and dismissing several secretaries. These matters worked aginst him and added supplemental justification for the final decision of his dismissal.

I am not advocating anything regarding Doh nor am I judging him on his SMU performance thus far. I certainly want him to get a handle on the SMU program and get it turned around. I am merely pointing out that the real and/or percieved issues that caused his dismissal from UNC may also be present and impacting the current SMU situation. The concerns expressed/posted on this board by knowledgeable basketball people ( substitution patterns, quick yanks, restricting creativity, apparent dog houses for certain players, player's apparently losing personal confidence, playing tight and afraid to make mistakes, line up combinations....etc.) are all very reminicent and consistent with his apparent coaching issues at UNC. That is my point.