Arthur Rumors

by **friarwolf** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 10:18 am

It's been said here before but just think what might have been if we had focused on building a basketball program complete with new facilities after the DP...........

With the new Dedman Center, Tubbs ought to start a summer league for 4th graders through 8th graders. Gym space is always limited so I guarantee you it would draw a lot of interest. Have all those kids wearing a Mustang on the front of their jerseys.........................

by **giacfsp** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 10:27 am

If Billy G could get talented players to El Paso, which he did, he surely can get them to College Station. I agree that it's still nauseating, but a hell of a lot more tolerable than Waco.

by **Hoop Fan** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 1:54 pm

RGV Pony wrote:I know I've said this before, but man...all these things we're hearing about Gillespie & his newfound D/FW pipeline to College Station...I swear that's what we were led to believe was going to happen for us with Tubbs.

led to believe by whom? Anybody who thought Tubbs was going to have an easy time recruiting top players to SMU must believe in the Tooth Fairy too. The high school coaches support for Tubbs was not a promise to deliver talent, it just wasn't realistic. It was a promise to help Tubbs get a foot in the door and that has occurred. Build a facility, support the program and the chances of Tubbs or anybody else recruiting a few top players to smu goes up dramatically.

by **ponyboy** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:26 pm

Keep talking sense, HF.

by **DiamondM75** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 3:10 pm

Win games and the fans will support.

Support the team and the wins will come.

Win games and the fans will support.

Support the team and the wins will come.

Win games and the fans will support.

Support the team and the wins will come.

A circle has no ends.

by **jtstang** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 3:28 pm

DiamondM75 wrote:Win games and the fans will support.

Support the team and the wins will come.

Win games and the fans will support.

Support the team and the wins will come.

Win games and the fans will support.

Support the team and the wins will come.

A circle has no ends.

Pretty funny. But how's this for a straight line for SMU then: Keep losing and nobody will care enough to show up.

Of course, my engineer friend PK will tell you that a true line has no ends either.

by **Hoop Fan** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:17 pm

its not really that hard to figure out. Neither one comes first. The answer is you need at least a MINIMAL level of both support and competitiveness to even get off the ground at the 1-A level. Do you think Tubbs and Bennett have a minimally adequate level of support at SMU? I'd like to think they do, sometimes I try to convince myself they do, but i have sat in too many empty arenas and stadiums at SMU not to know better. The only way Tubbs or Bennett are going to succeed is if we, the people who do care, get off the coaches' asses, quit acting like bunch of whiny babies in year two of their contracts, give them the benefit of the doubt and actually support the programs a little.

by **SMUPhil** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 8:25 pm

Also, keep in mind that "supporting the team" doesn't just mean butts in seats. When people on here talk about support for the program, we are usually talking about practice facilities, upgrading offices/lockerrooms, higher coaches' salaries, athlete friendly majors, AND butts in seats. It's not just an argument about "show up and support, that's how we'll win", there are other things SMU could do to support bball.

by **McClown27** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 8:16 am

SMUPhil wrote: When people on here talk about support for the program, we are usually talking about practice facilities, upgrading offices/lockerrooms, higher coaches' salaries, athlete friendly majors, AND butts in seats. It's not just an argument about "show up and support, that's how we'll win", there are other things SMU could do to support bball.

What is wrong with the coaches offices in the football stadium? I also think Bennett and Tubbs are paid adequately. Maybe Moody should be renovated, but the priority should always be on football. As Ford has shown, upgrades in facilities do not necessarily help recruiting.

With my experience at SMU, the student body cared a lot more about the football team (I was there for two Cavan and the first two Bennett years) than about basketball. I went to a game against TULSA, and more people drove from Tulsa to the game than SMU. MAYBE 1500 people were there, and I have heard attendance has even gotten worse.

Otherwise, I am with you with changes to the model.

by **PonySnob** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 9:04 am

McClown27 wrote:I also think Bennett and Tubbs are paid adequately. Maybe Moody should be renovated, but the priority should always be on football. As Ford has shown, upgrades in facilities do not necessarily help recruiting.

Bennett and Tubbs are probably overpaid for what they have delivered during their times at SMU. Certainly, it is hard to justifty the multiple contract extensions that Bennett has received so far. If Tubbs can produce, one would have to think that more dollars would flow his way....but so far, our record has not been any better than it was under the coach he replaced.

by **SMU Football Blog** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 10:29 am

SMU's pay is more competitive than you think. Now, could SMU overpay to get a proven winner here? I suppose.

The only coaching issue with money I recall was during the search that landed Bennett, Norm Chow, then offensive coordinator of USC, expressed interest early on, but he wanted crazy money and SMU told him to get wet. And I mean he wanted crazy money, like Bob Stoops money. Chow wanted a lot more than he was getting at USC to be the OC, and he was the highest paid assistant coach in the NCAA by far, making $500,000 a year. For example, Chizik, the DC at Texas and probably the best in the country gets less than $300,000 a year.

SMU was right to say no to that, because first time head coaches simply don't get that kind of money. Not at SMU, and not anywhere else.

by **McClown27** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 10:37 am

SMU Football Blog wrote:SMU's pay is more competitive than you think. Now, could SMU overpay to get a proven winner here? I suppose.

Blog, what do you think about the connection between facilities and recruiting? It is obviously part of the equation, but I don't think a practice facility or a renovation of Moody would begin to put the program on par with the likes of UT or now A&M.

by **EastStang** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 10:47 am

Georgetown is doing great with dumpy practice facilities in a gym perhaps older than Moody. The difference is twofold. Street credibility (every gangbanger in DC has a Georgetown hat), and a winning tradition. It is very interesting that a mostly white preppy Jesuit school in the tonyest part of DC has street cred. But it does. Secondly, John Thompson, Sr. brought that program out of nothing and built it up. It took time and his great persona to get it done. His credentials prior to coming to Georgetown were that he was a back up center in then NBA and was a successful high school coach at St. Anthony's in DC. and he was able to recruit in the exceptionally talent laden Catholic leagues around DC because he knew all of the coaches. Success then bred further success.

by **abezontar** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 10:58 am

As I understand it they have practice facilities in addition to their gym, and while they may be dumpy at least they have them.

by **McClown27** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:12 am

EastStang wrote:Georgetown is doing great with dumpy practice facilities in a gym perhaps older than Moody. The difference is twofold. Street credibility (every gangbanger in DC has a Georgetown hat), and a winning tradition. It is very interesting that a mostly white preppy Jesuit school in the tonyest part of DC has street cred. But it does. Secondly, John Thompson, Sr. brought that program out of nothing and built it up. It took time and his great persona to get it done. His credentials prior to coming to Georgetown were that he was a back up center in then NBA and was a successful high school coach at St. Anthony's in DC. and he was able to recruit in the exceptionally talent laden Catholic leagues around DC because he knew all of the coaches. Success then bred further success.

I totally agree. I thought that was the kind of recruiting Tubbs was going to bring us.

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