How many games will it take for you?

[Cardinal Puff]

19. By any standard there was improvement last year. It has to build both in the regular season and winning a tournament game.

[Hoop Fan]

For me, I'd say 19-20 wins including at least 4 decent quality wins. 16-18 wins with the schedule we play is a worthless 'accomplishment'. Memphis was our one clearcut quality win last year. Houston was marginal, but i lean to calling it quality because they danced. We need to get a Northwestern at home in the non -conference and beat them next year. We really need to beat TCU even though it will be in Fort Worth. Having lost at home to Froggie last year, Doh really needs to return the favor on their floor if he wants to swing some fan support back his way early in the season. I think you have to finish in the upper half of CUSA otherwise you've done squat and will not be winning a first round game most likely, which is a must next year.

I'm just not optimistic that next years team is anything but a rebuild with at least 3 freshman playing alot of minutes and finding their way. I see another 14-16, 15-15 type season with alot of but, but, but, we're young excuses being shamelessly floated by Doh on post game interviews.

[MustangIcon]

For me, I'd say 19-20 wins including at least 4 decent quality wins. 16-18 wins with the schedule we play is a worthless 'accomplishment'. Memphis was our one clearcut quality win last year. Houston was marginal, but i lean to calling it quality because they danced. We need to get a Northwestern at home in the non -conference and beat them next year. We really need to beat TCU even though it will be in Fort Worth. Having lost at home to Froggie last year, Doh really needs to return the favor on their floor if he wants to swing some fan support back his way early in the season. I think you have to finish in the upper half of CUSA otherwise you've done squat and will not be winning a first round game most likely, which is a must next year.

I agree with most of what you have said here. My threshold is a tad lower than yours in that I think an 18 win season would be a nice accomplishment, but other than that, pretty much in agreement.

[Hoop Fan]

let me add one criteria based on the breaking news. Its imperative that Ponytails matches up favorably with Fab head to head, otherwise it will be time to draw the curtain on this s_hit show.

[FriscoPMG]

I'm just not optimistic that next years team is anything but a rebuild with at least 3 freshman playing alot of minutes and finding their way. I see another 14-16, 15-15 type season with alot of but, but, but, we're young excuses being shamelessly floated by Doh on post game interviews.

This is what I can't wait for! We will have officially come full circle since Doh can pull out the "young and inexperienced" card once again! He can justify a bad non-conference schedule since he'll be attempting to incorporate a new PG running the show along with the other new freshmen.

[PonyDoh]

let me add one criteria based on the breaking news. Its imperative that Ponytails matches up favorably with Fab head to head, otherwise it will be time to draw the curtain on this s_hit show.

I doubt they go head to head very often. We'll start Pats at point, and zone the crap out of them, and make them prove they can chuck it. If we let Fab just get in the lane at will, the whole staff should empty their lockers at half

[LA_Mustang]

Doherty has failed to bring a legit college level scorer who can create his own shot and knock down an outside jumper. Until we get this type of player, we will continue to struggle.

[PonyDoh]

Doherty has failed to bring a legit college level scorer who can create his own shot and knock down an outside jumper. Until we get this type of player, we will continue to struggle.

I agree about a SG that can kill you off the bounce, but we've brought in a slew of shooters these past few classes. Clink/Pats/Smith/Vilde can all shoot the ball, no idea about Pigtails. You're right though, we need a real assasin at the 2

[SMUSportsTalkNow101]

To original post....19 reg and 2 conf tourney wins with post season birth NIT minimum. Its year 5.

[PonyDoh]

To original post....19 reg and 2 conf tourney wins with post season birth NIT minimum. Its year 5.

What does year 5 matter, if the entire administration wrote off years 1-3 coming in? I really think some of you need to look at this thing starting last year. Seldom do coaches get the unilataral control to gut a program and start from scratch. When that happens, call off any expectations for at least the first two years.

[moodymadmen]

What does year 5 matter, if the entire administration wrote off years 1-3 coming in? I really think some of you need to look at this thing starting last year. Seldom do coaches get the unilataral control to gut a program and start from scratch. When that happens, call off any expectations for at least the first two years.

You've got to be kidding me.

[SMUSportsTalkNow101]

PonyDoh - It is year 5. Even writing of years 1-2 you can say now it is Year 3. Either way, results are warranted at this point. I want Doherty and SMU to succeed. 5 more wins this year makes 19 and then there has to be minimum 1 if not 2 conf tourney wins. NIT or not, what matters. If the team can end with 20-21 total wins, thats then good enough.

[PonyDoh]

PonyDoh - It is year 5. Even writing of years 1-2 you can say now it is Year 3. Either way, results are warranted at this point. I want Doherty and SMU to succeed. 5 more wins this year makes 19 and then there has to be minimum 1 if not 2 conf tourney wins. NIT or not, what matters. If the team can end with 20-21 total wins, thats then good enough.

I have no problem w/that number, nor was I really debating this being year 3 vs 5. My point is that any AD or admin who allows a new coach to napalm a roster, isn't asking for wins now. There were several moves that both coach and ad knew would cost the program wins in the first two years, but were deemed necessary. I'm not defending those years, just saying that the fans were the ones w/the expectations. The rotating staff, head coach and AD were busy slashing and burning. In theory, no big deal IF & when you come out the other side, you're a vastly improved program. As of now, we're supposed to be rebuilt, and we look roughly the same. Anyway, I think evidence suggests our expectation level was considerably higher then the higher-ups

[FriscoPMG]

PonyDoh - It is year 5. Even writing of years 1-2 you can say now it is Year 3. Either way, results are warranted at this point. I want Doherty and SMU to succeed. 5 more wins this year makes 19 and then there has to be minimum 1 if not 2 conf tourney wins. NIT or not, what matters. If the team can end with 20-21 total wins, thats then good enough.

I have no problem w/that number, nor was I really debating this being year 3 vs 5. My point is that any AD or admin who allows a new coach to napalm a roster, isn't asking for wins now. There were several moves that both coach and ad knew would cost the program wins in the first two years, but were deemed necessary. I'm not defending those years, just saying that the fans were the ones w/the expectations. The rotating staff, head coach and AD were busy slashing and burning. In theory, no big deal IF & when you come out the other side, you're a vastly improved program. As of now, we're supposed to be rebuilt, and we look roughly the same. Anyway, I think evidence suggests our expectation level was considerably higher then the higher-ups

So after Doh squeezed 14 wins out of the "garbage" he inherited, did he and the administration really expect to go downhill in years 2 & 3? I guess having a little success with his inherited players and giving fans a little hope was the worst thing Doh ever did...

[mrydel]

I would look at it this way. Could another coach (any of the ones that have been mentioned as replacements) take our current players and get us into a psot season tourney? If so, then that is where the bar should be. Because if the kids are good enough and he cannot get them there then we need a change. If not, then we have to wonder why after this many years of recruiting he is not able to get there. I think the bar for return should be post season tourney. That is the same deal Bennett got in football.