Would you rather.....?

[mustangxc]

Even if we were a Final Four team, I guarantee tickets would be easy to come by at SMU. I don't think the team's performance has as great an impact on tickets as we would like. That's just the way it is at SMU. Also, you can't base the season on 1 game. We beat Memphis and we all know we are not as good as Memphis yet. We managed to beat Rice at home and on the road only to lose on a last second play on a neutral court. We did manage to beat Tulsa and Houston on the road. RPI-wise, Oral Roberts (131) and Jacksonville (142) rank ahead of Rice (187). So I wouldn't just dismiss these last 2 wins. You accuse hoopmanx of spinning everything but you yourself twist everything to highlight all the low points and simply brush aside all of the high points.

[hoopmanx]

why wouldn't you place emphasis on the CUSA tournament???????? Are you saying we had the CIT locked up so it didn't matter what we did in our conference tournament? Thats so ridiculously apologetic its unbelievable. You still play to win in your conference tournament with your two all conference players and all-time great center, don't you? Man, which is it?

If Doherty got anything but a meaningless in name only extension, that is a farce. And now you are already starting to back peddle on being better next year. Can i ask you this, can we even expect to beat TCU at home next year?? MUST WIN, period.

I place emphasis on the OOC & conference season primarily , not the conference tourney. It's the same way w/my ACC team. Obviously, SMU didn't schedule anyone in the OOC, and did far better than expected in conference. A tourney win would have been nice, and I'll all for them, but those are 3 day money making, made for TV events, that should never be responsible for automatic bids. They invalidate 16, sometimes 18 regular season games, in one bid leagues, which is a farce and a shame.

You are skewing things. I'd love to win every time we take the floor, but I'm not going to categorize the season based on 1 conference tourney loss, no more than I'd value it on two CIT wins. All of this is gravy, I saw what I needed to see in terms of system/execution, half way through the CUSA schedule. I know what's in the pipeline, and I know what it took to get to this point. Changing directions coming off a very well coached season, w/a huge influx of talent, makes sense never. I'm not backpedaling off next year. It's a very talented team, that's extremely young. I think they'll gel sooner than most, but we'll see. Either way, talent won't be an excuse anymore, and should be taken off the table.

I care more about beating New Mexico than TCU, but I'd rather have both. Neither are must win

[Mitch McConnell]

Yes, you're right. Any conference games that SMU won at Moody should be immediately discredited.

Your assessment of the Rice CUSA tournament game vs. the postseason tournament is complete garbage. And you know it. Of course, had SMU been on the road and won in Tulsa and Jacksonville then I bet you wouldn't have had as much of a problem.

BTW, you know as well as anybody else that the attendance issue has plagued this program for more than a decade. And you know as well anybody else that winning 1 postseason game isn't going to all of the sudden change everything.

But congratulations on changing the rules so it can fit your agenda.

You also are aware that winning consistently over several seasons will change the attendance. The program changes first and the fans eventually start showing up -- the casual fans.

Regardless of what we all think what the CIT is or is not (or what Yesteryear Syndromers will take to their grave), the bottom of this thing is this:

* It's mid-March 2011
* SMU is still playing basketball
* A postseason tournament was created that invited SMU and 23 OTHER TEAMS.
* There is a championship trophy awaiting the winner
* And there's a better than 0 chance that most of the Geritol Gang will either track the game, maybe even watch it online or check in sometime Monday night to find out what happened.

What pisses you old cranksters off is that SMU had the AUDACITY of winning these games. The nerve of those Mustangs.

Hoopfan, I'm sorry you hate Doherty. I'm not a fan of his either. And everybody knows I am. I think you let it get personal, though. I just want the program to win, and if this system and recruits combined with Doherty being there gets the program turned, I'm fine with it.

[Hoop Fan]

yeah right, why would i buys tickets and spend my 75 degree spring Saturday afternoon in Moody if i wasn't open to Doherty succeeding? You guys talk out of both sides of your mouth. You say not to point to one game, and then you immediately point to Memphis game. If you dont wanna look at the terrible loss to Rice when it counted, fine. The complete body of work says that we were 9-10 in CUSA this year. If that exceeded your vast expectations, good for you, it didn't exceed mine. You can't say on one hand that Papa belongs in the pantheon of great SMU bigs and on the other hand conclude that we overachieved. All that amounts to is giving Doh a total pass because he sucked it up so bad in the OOC with a team full of seniors he recruited and groomed. So far we are like 11-14 in real games this year, not including some of the total garbage we played in most of the OOC. Break out the lifetime extension!

[hoopmanx]

yeah right, why would i buys tickets and spend my 75 degree spring Saturday afternoon in Moody if i wasn't open to Doherty succeeding? You guys talk out of both sides of your mouth. You say not to point to one game, and then you immediately point to Memphis game. If you dont wanna look at the terrible loss to Rice when it counted, fine. The complete body of work says that we were 9-10 in CUSA this year. If that exceeded your vast expectations, good for you, it didn't exceed mine. You can't say on one hand that Papa belongs in the pantheon of great SMU bigs and on the other hand conclude that we overachieved. All that amounts to is giving Doh a total pass because he sucked it up so bad in the OOC with a team full of seniors he recruited and groomed. So far we are like 11-17 in real games this year, not including the total garbage we played in most of the OOC. Break out the lifetime extension!

Umm, the reason Papa is a great is b/c he put an undermanned team on his back, helping them achieve above expectations. He's recognized by the league twice as an All-league selection and this years DPOY. We're competing b/c he's utterly dominating. He's a 19/9/3 type player in CUSA. That's why he's great. You aren't making sense. Nobody is saying the loss to Rice doesn't matter, but it's no more or less important than these last few games. Every team in america plays garbage out of conference games relative to their level, but you don't hear their fans going we were 11-17 in real games etc. Your record is your record, and it' s been a nice building block year.

Anyway, I get the Tubbs thing, but this is a program, and will be a program long after Tubbs & Doherty. At some point, you have to care for it's direction, more than spite its past. Given what's happening on the court, on the trail etc, you're just moaning to moan.

[mustangxc]

yeah right, why would i buys tickets and spend my 75 degree spring Saturday afternoon in Moody if i wasn't open to Doherty succeeding? You guys talk out of both sides of your mouth. You say not to point to one game, and then you immediately point to Memphis game. If you dont wanna look at the terrible loss to Rice when it counted, fine. The complete body of work says that we were 9-10 in CUSA this year. If that exceeded your vast expectations, good for you, it didn't exceed mine. You can't say on one hand that Papa belongs in the pantheon of great SMU bigs and on the other hand conclude that we overachieved. All that amounts to is giving Doh a total pass because he sucked it up so bad in the OOC with a team full of seniors he recruited and groomed. So far we are like 11-17 in real games this year, not including some of the total garbage we played in most of the OOC. Break out the lifetime extension!

You really are very bitter. I said not to look at one game because you can't base results off one game. I even said, we beat Memphis, but we are not at their level yet!!!! Simply to state that you cannot conclude anything from 1 game. We also beat USM, Tulsa, ECU, which are all top 100 rpi wins. Officially we were 8-8 in CUSA. We are 16-14 in games counted by rpi so you are now adding losses to teams we didn't even play??? Where did those 3 additional losses come from??? Get your facts straight before you speak out of both sides of your mouth!!!

[Mitch McConnell]

SMU's record is 19-14 NOT 11-17. When you look at future media guides, it will list whatever that record is AND NOT YOUR VERSION.

Get it?

Oh, and that was your choice to show up on Saturday afternoon for the game. No one stuck a gun to your head and said, "You need to see SMU play Jacksonville.''

[Hoop Fan]

I corrected it before you pointed it out, it was an innocent mistake. Congratulations 11-14.

[Hoop Fan]

SMU's record is 19-14 NOT 11-17. When you look at future media guides, it will list whatever that record is AND NOT YOUR VERSION.

Get it?

Oh, and that was your choice to show up on Saturday afternoon for the game. No one stuck a gun to your head and said, "You need to see SMU play Jacksonville.''

is that how you evaluate your coach and program Mitch, what future media guides will say? Lets just join the Southland now and make ourselves feel good. Get it?

[Mitch McConnell]

Facts are facts. I'm just letting you know what the media guide is going to list as the record.

[Hoop Fan]

Even if we were a Final Four team, I guarantee tickets would be easy to come by at SMU. I don't think the team's performance has as great an impact on tickets as we would like. That's just the way it is at SMU. Also, you can't base the season on 1 game. We beat Memphis and we all know we are not as good as Memphis yet. We managed to beat Rice at home and on the road only to lose on a last second play on a neutral court. We did manage to beat Tulsa and Houston on the road. RPI-wise, Oral Roberts (131) and Jacksonville (142) rank ahead of Rice (187). So I wouldn't just dismiss these last 2 wins. You accuse hoopmanx of spinning everything but you yourself twist everything to highlight all the low points and simply brush aside all of the high points.

ya know XC, this is really not correct. SMU fans do show up in greater numbers for games they perceive as meaningful. Were you present during the Dement season that we were fighting for an NCAA bid? The infamous Willie Davis game? For those games against TCU, Tulsa, and others there were 5000 people in Moody for meaningful reg season games. Great atmospheres for truly meaningful games. Its not all the same and the teams performance has a huge impact on attendance. Yesterday's 894 people (not a typo) was pitiful even by SMU standards. People have voted with their feet.

[GiddyUp]

this thread is going nowhere fast. Let's hug it out - cheers -- this Bud's for you if you show'd up at Moody this year. The few and the proud

Hoop Fan - you are going to have to live with Doh whether you like it or not.

[CalallenStang]

Even if we were a Final Four team, I guarantee tickets would be easy to come by at SMU. I don't think the team's performance has as great an impact on tickets as we would like. That's just the way it is at SMU. Also, you can't base the season on 1 game. We beat Memphis and we all know we are not as good as Memphis yet. We managed to beat Rice at home and on the road only to lose on a last second play on a neutral court. We did manage to beat Tulsa and Houston on the road. RPI-wise, Oral Roberts (131) and Jacksonville (142) rank ahead of Rice (187). So I wouldn't just dismiss these last 2 wins. You accuse hoopmanx of spinning everything but you yourself twist everything to highlight all the low points and simply brush aside all of the high points.

ya know XC, this is really not correct. SMU fans do show up in greater numbers for games they perceive as meaningful. Were you present during the Dement season that we were fighting for an NCAA bid? The infamous Willie Davis game? For those games against TCU, Tulsa, and others there were 5000 people in Moody for meaningful reg season games. Great atmospheres for truly meaningful games. Its not all the same and the teams performance has a huge impact on attendance. Yesterday's 894 people (not a typo) was pitiful even by SMU standards. People have voted with their feet.

Can you compare the two eras? In one, SMU had a marketing department, and in another, they didn't.

It's hard to say whether more SMU fans would have shown up yesterday had they actually known that a game was going on, but as it is, I think we can all agree that SMU has to make at least some effort to market the program.

[Mitch McConnell]

ya know XC, this is really not correct. SMU fans do show up in greater numbers for games they perceive as meaningful. Were you present during the Dement season that we were fighting for an NCAA bid? The infamous Willie Davis game? For those games against TCU, Tulsa, and others there were 5000 people in Moody for meaningful reg season games. Great atmospheres for truly meaningful games. Its not all the same and the teams performance has a huge impact on attendance. Yesterday's 894 people (not a typo) was pitiful even by SMU standards. People have voted with their feet.

Well, antihoopfan, you've just described the typical fair-weather fans. Good for you.

[Hoop Fan]

mitch you are so full of contradictions. You attended your first games of the season this week and you are calling out the fair weather fans and their definition of a meaningful game because it differs from yours? funny. Truth is 894 speaks volumes. Cal, the marketing was virtually no different 10 years ago, meaning non-existant except for a small campaign in Sasser's freshman year.