rumor mill

[Hoop Fan]

I'm not saying my source is better than others you all might have, but I think its pretty good. I'm told that there is nothing MAJOR whatsoever. Minor stuff includes watching game film on a bus ride which apparently consistutes practice time. The deal here is that Maxie Williams simply wanted Tubbs gone. Word is Tubbs didnt necessarily want Matt to begin with but took him because he is (was) a good kid and it was good politics. Then Matt and Max pulled a playing time demand. Tubbs didnt capitulate and the rest is history. Word is Matt even told Bamba and Morris not to play hard so that tubbs would get fired. Nice. Just in case you dont think Max is capable of such things, he forced a coaching change at TCA Addision because he didnt like things there.

Apparently we had a verbal commitment from Ronnie Morgan from SOC this week. There was also a kid from Dunbar ready to commit. These guys are not all -americans but good local players. Oh well, hope the next guy can do better. We ruined tubbs career and slit our own throats in Dallas for what amounts to not much.

[McClown27]

Who is your source?

[Dement-ed]

I don't know you or your source, so it's not my place to challenge the accuracy of what you've been told. However, if it is as you describe, I'd like to be the first to thank Bamba Fall and Brian Morris for ignoring any pleas to play soft. Each played hard -- I was at every home game -- and each played through injuries.
And I hope what you're hearing is not accurate, because that paints a pretty unflattering picture of several people.

[Pony_Fan]

I don't understand that b/c from what I remember Matt had surgery before the season started and wasn't going to play anyway?

If that is the case, why does this guy have so much pull? Does he give millions to SMU and the Mustang Club? Sounds like a setup for sure.

SMU better have some good PR for this one. This is unbelievable the way this has played out.

[Hoop Fan]

i'm not giving up my source any more than anybody else is. If he wanted to get on here and give you his name he would. I am admitting my source is second hand and that its not much more than a credible opinion in my view from someone inside the workings of things. Dismiss it all you want. It makes me feel more confident that there are no major known violations. We'll see.

[Hoop Fan]

I don't understand that b/c from what I remember Matt had surgery before the season started and wasn't going to play anyway?

If that is the case, why does this guy have so much pull? Does he give millions to SMU and the Mustang Club? Sounds like a setup for sure.

SMU better have some good PR for this one. This is unbelievable the way this has played out.

check the season stats. Matt Williams played 4 minutes in one game. So there is no way he was completely out BEFORE the season started. I also remember him suited up in several games when he did not get in. I think after a few weeks of games, the Williams family saw the writing on the wall and decided to have some clean up on his knees and not waste a season of eligibility. I dont think he had a sudden injury. Its obvious that Williams was not happy. i guess if you believe that he made allegations of violations and kept those two issues separate, I cant help you. Human nature is what it is.

[Danny Noonan]

So Copeland, Orsini, Turner, Hunt, Ford, etc. are taking orders from Max Williams now? He has that much power?

HF, are you saying:

A) Max Williams used his status as a famous alum to force Tubbs to give his grandson a scholarship, and then used this same "pull" to force Copeland/Orsini to fire Tubbs? And Turner and the rest of the BIGGER boosters just went along with this?

or

B) Max Williams came up with a brilliant plan to give money to Tubbs and then turn around and turn him in? Once these minor violations came to light, Copeland/Orsini would have no choice but to fire Tubbs? Why would The Administration see these as fireable offenses if they obviously weren't? I guess in this scenario Max Williams again used his "pull" to get Tubbs fired.

Any way you look at it, your scenarios present a situation where Max Williams is making President Turner, Copeland, and Orsini fire Tubbs. Add somehow forcing the other big boosters to sit on their hands?

Sorry, don't see it. You're also not considering the ramifications from the OU investigation. Who was breaking all these rules regarding recruiting at OU? Sampson, or his main recruiter?

[Hoop Fan]

look, the burden of proof goes both ways. I don't know the truth, perhaps no one does except Jimmy and Maxie. But heres what we do know. Max made allegations. Those allegation spurred a massive investigation. The investigation turned up only very minor allegations. Nothing else major has been reported or even rumored beyond the suggestion of "something must have happened". Biggest thing is that Tubbs was fired WITHOUT CAUSE and received a buyout. Those are the facts.

What I think is this. Max Williams does not control or run the university. But he is very powerful apparently. He forced an investigation and any time you create controversy and allegations that cannot be proven or disproven (think about this), this was not an unlikely outcome at all. Tubbs was in trouble the day the allegations were made. You cant prove a negative. And when a powerful guy is making the allegation and SMU is involved, lookout. Why did Tubbs receive a buyout? Tells you something.

[Stallion]

all SMU Coaches post-DP have had a buy-out clause and there is also a secrecy clause generally included in the buy-out so the coaches won't go blabing about what a piss-poor Model they have had to work under.

[Danny Noonan]

The only fact we know if that Max Williams turned himself and Tubbs in for an NCAA violation? Period. Do you know anything other than that?

First, you obviously feel that he should not have turned this in. Am I correct in saying so? To you, Max reporting the violation is a worse offense than Tubbs breaking the rules?

Second, you are correct about the burden of truth bit. But if you're going to go into the following theories:

1) Tubbs did not want to give Matt Williams a scholarship, and was forced to.
2) Matt Williams was a good kid, but is not anymore.
3) Matt Williams demanded playing time from Jimmy Tubbs.
4) Matt Williams ran crying to granpa.
5) Max made a successful effort to get Jimmy Tubbs fired because he wasn't playing his grandson in his freshman season before he got hurt.
6) Matt Williams encouraged Bamba and Morris not to play hard.

You know one fact, yet decided to fill in all the details yourself. Sorry, but someone has to call BS on that.

[Ponymon]

Pony Fan,

The DMN reported in the early 80's that SMU's Athletic Director Bob Hitch called on Max Williams for a donation to the Mustang Club. Max wrote a check off his personal checking account. Hitch said he fell out of his chair when he saw the check was for $1 MILLION. That's MILLION with an M . Yes Max is a very, very wealthy alum who formerly was a star on SMU's basketball team.

[SoCal_Pony]

HF,

That is pretty amazing stuff.

If true, who in their right mind would want this job, especially with Matt on the team and Mad Max breathing down their necks?

Jimmy Tubbs did not deserve this treatment. Unlike any coach post-DP besides Forrest Gregg, he genuinely loved this school and would have stayed here regardless of personal success.

[Pony_Fan]

Pony Fan,

The DMN reported in the early 80's that SMU's Athletic Director Bob Hitch called on Max Williams for a donation to the Mustang Club. Max wrote a check off his personal checking account. Hitch said he fell out of his chair when he saw the check was for $1 MILLION. That's MILLION with an M . Yes Max is a very, very wealthy alum who formerly a star on SMU's basketball team.

Ok - thanks for clarifying.

[HixsontoLeVias]

I agree with Danny Noonan, I'm not buying the "Max Williams welds more power than god around Moody.." Wasn't he loosely associated with some of the fun and games during Bliss' tenure , as well as the football troubles?? Either way, I don't buy the fact that Maxie boy is waltzing around "calling the shots"..I am more inclined to think this is a pre-Orsini move, and Tubbs just handed them, though weak, what they needed to push him out...who will be the next savior? Probably someone not even on our radars....Long Live Sherwood Blount.

[Ponymon]

It is my understanding that Max was investigated by the NCAA because of that check, but he was completely exonerated. I also heard that he had sworn off SMU at the time because of the shabby treatment that he received during the investigation.