Outside Perspectives

[Z1]

Ignoring moral victories for the moment, why is it that very little is said about the teams' efforts, how close several of the last few games have been, and even the coaching efforts required when we lose close games now, against what was decidedly better teams earlier in the season? Our team was superior for most of the game last night. Superior - not equal to. Despite the TO's. It was a disappointing loss and it hurt to see it happen.

But I think it was a statement of how far a young team can come in 3/4 of a seasons' time. If not for Bamba, Faye's rebounding(not his offense last night) and several of the bench players it would have been the same story as at the beginning of the season. A loss by 10 or more pts.

I know that these thoughts are generalizations to an extent so to be clear this post is not directed at any particular post or poster. It is simply an observation of my experience with the general overall tone of the board. Other than bagice and a few other posters, not much is said about the BB team when they lose. Few posts are placed and in general aren't supportive. It's my perspective and just wanted to offer that as something of an outsider. I also want to offer another perspective that I found on the web just now also. People are beginning to take notice out there. Currently I think that the outside comments have been a mixed bag of opinions and analysis for the last year. But take a peak at the link. I definitely feel that the tide is beginning to turn and that the evidence is beginning to show on the court. The guys played real hard last night, but as hard an effort as they put forth, the TO's and the shooting for the whole game set up the loss last night. Again - take a look below. The report cards from outside the board aren't all bad.


http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketb ... report/SMU
The Sports Xchange

[Alaric]

Fans somehow thought freshman and sophomores would be more organized than they are...

[papawasamustang]

Who in the world is the sports exchange? You know that Doherty used to work for CBS. Those are his buddies over there.
I can promise you they aren't watching many SMU games.
I thought the statement that we were trying for our first two game winning streak since January was funny. Pretty much sums it up.

Its all about the W.

Nice try.

[jkflamebo]

Fans somehow thought freshman and sophomores would be more organized than they are...

like were the only team comprised of freshman and sophomores? come on, get real

[Pony_Fan]

Wow, this sounds like the Bennett era - coulda won those close games guys - but I was 1-12 for the season ....doggoneit..


At this point in the season, it's time for W's ...not moral victories. We should have won that game, no excuses whatsoever. TO's have been idiotic all year and inbounds plays are the worst I have ever seen.

[Z1]

Fans somehow thought freshman and sophomores would be more organized than they are...

That's because right now, SMU's fan base should be considered
" freshman". You know - uncertain about supporting the team, how to do that, whether to attend a game, griping about growing pains, etc. There hasn't been much for fans to support at SMU in a long time. You can find more "senior " fans (no puns about age please) posting here nightly. It's not always positive, but you can tell that there are people who care about the state of SMU sports.

And I know MD was on CSTV for a year or so before it was bought out by CBS in 2005. At that point MD was out recruiting for FAU. So he may have a friend or two there. No harm in having friends. And I can see the humor in the winning streak statement too. I'll be conservative and wait til we get to three W's before I call it a "streak". I disagree about the W's tho- SMU committed to building several programs when they hired
Orsini. BB is just one of them. Everyone want's the W's because it boosts morale immediately. It's tangible evidence of growth. We're still a year away from seeing or even requiring that in quantity. According to Orsini, we are building a program in FB and BB. That takes time and work on the intangibles. The most obvious work to be done is still promoting the men's teams to the fans. Without educated fans that support the team SMU will never get the results they want. I'm still amazed at how hard a sell this has been just to get the students to attend games. This year you can see a few more out there but it seems like most of the seats are being filled by alumni.

Z

[papawasamustang]

Fans somehow thought freshman and sophomores would be more organized than they are...

That's because right now, SMU's fan base should be considered
" freshman". You know - uncertain about supporting the team, how to do that, whether to attend a game, griping about growing pains, etc. There hasn't been much for fans to support at SMU in a long time. You can find more "senior " fans (no puns about age please) posting here nightly. It's not always positive, but you can tell that there are people who care about the state of SMU sports.

And I know MD was on CSTV for a year or so before it was bought out by CBS in 2005. At that point MD was out recruiting for FAU. So he may have a friend or two there. No harm in having friends. And I can see the humor in the winning streak statement too. I'll be conservative and wait til we get to three W's before I call it a "streak". I disagree about the W's tho- SMU committed to building several programs when they hired
Orsini. BB is just one of them. Everyone want's the W's because it boosts morale immediately. It's tangible evidence of growth. We're still a year away from seeing or even requiring that in quantity. According to Orsini, we are building a program in FB and BB. That takes time and work on the intangibles. The most obvious work to be done is still promoting the men's teams to the fans. Without educated fans that support the team SMU will never get the results they want. I'm still amazed at how hard a sell this has been just to get the students to attend games. This year you can see a few more out there but it seems like most of the seats are being filled by alumni.

Z

Where have you been over the last X # of years?
Try getting a job on Sunday morning & you can preach there.
Real fans, patience, growing pains? My [deleted].
Do you know how many years we have been hearing this BS?
I'm a die hard & u have no clue to the level of frustration of losing year after year after year. Until that changes, I will continue to ? the bad product I see on the court. When I see something positive I'll tell you.

Get real dude.

[Alaric]

Fans somehow thought freshman and sophomores would be more organized than they are...

like were the only team comprised of freshman and sophomores? come on, get real

Get real, about what?

Having measured and realistic expectations for freshman & sophomores and Bamba plus two junior newcomers? You need to get real. There's improvement to be found & things look a lot better for next year. That being said, I'm disappointed that the team disappears at times, goes from being organized to disorganized at crucial points, Doh seems to return to the wild persona that earned him a mutiny, on the floor leadership seems to be lacking, way too many turnovers, motion offense has no motion, guys stand around, why don't we have a bunch of juco's, why aren't these guys empowered enough to be able to think on their own on the court, why could Doh close on a couple of studs he had lined up this fall...I've got those questions too but there are so many new, young guys on the team, that I don't think it's reasonable to expect all those things to come together with a bunch of freshman and sophomores UNLESS THEY'RE TALENTED ENOUGH to overcome mistakes. Give me a team full of guys with Paul McCoy's talent and I'm going to be as impatient as you are today.

[papawasamustang]

Fans somehow thought freshman and sophomores would be more organized than they are...

like were the only team comprised of freshman and sophomores? come on, get real

Get real, about what?

Having measured and realistic expectations for freshman & sophomores and Bamba plus two junior newcomers? You need to get real. There's improvement to be found & things look a lot better for next year. That being said, I'm disappointed that the team disappears at times, goes from being organized to disorganized at crucial points, Doh seems to return to the wild persona that earned him a mutiny, on the floor leadership seems to be lacking, way too many turnovers, motion offense has no motion, guys stand around, why don't we have a bunch of juco's, why aren't these guys empowered enough to be able to think on their own on the court, why could Doh close on a couple of studs he had lined up this fall...I've got those questions too but there are so many new, young guys on the team, that I don't think it's reasonable to expect all those things to come together with a bunch of freshman and sophomores UNLESS THEY'RE TALENTED ENOUGH to overcome mistakes. Give me a team full of guys with Paul McCoy's talent and I'm going to be as impatient as you are today.

Your statement about McCoy is correct. Good players help make the coach look good don't they? I guess when I hear the Doh hype about his great recruitng class of 7 & this year's team goal is 20/10 & Daye has the talent to dominate CUSA that I buy in a little too much. My bad.
So I bought in to the Doh hype & go to Moody & see bad basketball & come away disappointed & have folks tell me to be patient that things are getting better. I'm not blind. I see what's going on & it ain't gettin better

[Hoop Fan]

No, its not better. Besides the play and potential of one Paul McCoy, this team and program is a young disaster. The sophomore class is AWOL. We play in a terrible conference top to bottom, even for a mid major. Read up on the subject and look around if you are in denial. This is not a league where its acceptable for Doh or anybody else at smu to go 2-16 or whatever and finish alone in dead last in the league! Doesnt matter if its his first year or third year, which it is.

Let me tell you something. If Paul McCoy for some disasterous reason chose to transfer (GOD FORBID), the entire first 3 years of Doh's tenure would amount to ZERO at this moment. I can think for myself and I can see what is what, just to borrow a phrase from Papawasamustang.

Faye is ok, certainly not what he was promised to be. Williams is ok but fading big time down the stretch. The real problem is that these guys are gone after next year. There is no future with them. We aren't going to be worth a damn as soon as next year, that much is pretty clear now since we have not improved during this season in any real way. Next point is, our current one man recruiting class is a project by all accounts. Great.

So, bottom line, after three years, either we need a miraculous turnaround in the sophomore class, or we need a miraculous juco haul after a house cleaning (is that a good thing to be proud of?), or we are just waiting for a miracle in next years recruting class who might be able join McCoy when he is a senior for the promise of more youth and MAYBE a .500 season in CUSA. Am I dismissing Otis and Haynes too soon? maybe. But Otis is a very limited basketball player even for a freshman. Haynes looks like another in the long line of lost small forwards at smu. Is he going to end up any different than bennie rhodes, whose frosh year eerily resembled haynes.

Thats the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. So help us God. We are way behind schedule at this moment.

[jkflamebo]

No, its not better. Besides the play and potential of one Paul McCoy, this team and program is a young disaster. The sophomore class is AWOL. We play in a terrible conference top to bottom, even for a mid major. Read up on the subject and look around if you are in denial. This is not a league where its acceptable for Doh or anybody else at smu to go 2-16 or whatever and finish alone in dead last in the league! Doesnt matter if its his first year or third year, which it is.

Let me tell you something. If Paul McCoy for some disasterous reason chose to transfer (GOD FORBID), the entire first 3 years of Doh's tenure would amount to ZERO at this moment. I can think for myself and I can see what is what, just to borrow a phrase from Papawasamustang.

Faye is ok, certainly not what he was promised to be. Williams is ok but fading big time down the stretch. The real problem is that these guys are gone after next year. There is no future with them. We aren't going to be worth a damn as soon as next year, that much is pretty clear now since we have not improved during this season in any real way. Next point is, our current one man recruiting class is a project by all accounts. Great.

So, bottom line, after three years, either we need a miraculous turnaround in the sophomore class, or we need a miraculous juco haul after a house cleaning (is that a good thing to be proud of?), or we are just waiting for a miracle in next years recruting class who might be able join McCoy when he is a senior for the promise of more youth and MAYBE a .500 season in CUSA. Am I dismissing Otis and Haynes too soon? maybe. But Otis is a very limited basketball player even for a freshman. Haynes looks like another in the long line of lost small forwards at smu. Is he going to end up any different than bennie rhodes, whose frosh year eerily resembled haynes.

Thats the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. We are way behind schedule at this moment.

quality post i agree with. dare to take mccoy off this team, we'll be bottom 10 in bball too.

[MustangIcon]

You guys act like we were just lighting it up in CUSA and have fallen off the map. We have NEVER won more than 4 games in conference during the regular season. 4 seasons (this is our 5th) and 4 is the most we have EVER won. We have been the bottom of our conference since we entered it.

[SoCal_Pony]

You guys act like we were just lighting it up in CUSA and have fallen off the map. We have NEVER won more than 4 games in conference during the regular season. 4 seasons (this is our 5th) and 4 is the most we have EVER won. We have been the bottom of our conference since we entered it.

I don't think so.

This is our 4th season in C-USA...3 have been with Coach Doh.

You are correct though that we have failed to win more than 4 conference games.

Couple of other interesting notes...

During Coach Doh's 3 years here, we have only won 5 road games, all against teams with losing records, most of whom were bottom dwellers like ourselves.

Our highest quality win this season per Sagarin is Texas A&M CC, they are ranked #181.

That Arkansas Pine Bluff team we lost to at Moody has a Sagarin ranking of #316.

[LA_Mustang]

Our highest quality win this season per Sagarin is Texas A&M CC, they are ranked #181.

That Arkansas Pine Bluff team we lost to at Moody has a Sagarin ranking of #316.

I think that will put us on the bubble. Selection Sunday should be interesting

[EastStang]

Other than perhaps Memphis, UAB, UH and Tulsa, let's look at CUSA. Rice, Marshall, ECU, UCF, USM, Tulane, and UTEP (no longer Texas Western). None of them has made a ripple in the NCAA pond in 40 years. This conference is okay in football, but a disaster in basketball. That's why Memphis wants out sooo bad. Last night they played UAB in Birmingham and won by 11 after it was close with about 6 minutes to go and UAB is the second best team in the conference. I'm sorry, but even with freshmen and sophomores, we ought to be able to have a winning record against CUSA teams. I'm giving Doh the benefit of the doubt this year, but next year, he knows its win or walk. My view is that next year we ought to be at least .500 overall and .600 in conference with an RPI under 120. Not huge expectations. But if not, Doh's rope will be very short.