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Undergraduate or graduate students, it doesn't matter. Or SMU students in general, it doesn't have to be strictly Cox. I've been accepted to the MS in Finance program, and wanted some help in deciding where to go for graduate school. I specifically would like to hear more about career services, classroom experiences, student life, anything that would be relevant really. Just want an unbiased view.

For a little background, I went to UT Dallas about 20-30 minutes north of y'all for my undergrad degree in Econ. I only went there because I got a full ride, I wanted to save money as I knew I would be going to graduate school at some point in time. I had a great time at UTD, but I made it a point to look for graduate programs that are at Division I schools. It would be nice to actually have a rooting interest in CFB and CBB, go to tailgates, and do things that aren't really possible at a Division III school. Obviously that isn't my #1 priority, but it's a nice benefit because well-regarded schools generally have good athletic programs as well.

Career services and job placements are especially important to me, because I graduated last December and couldn't find a job, so I decided to take the GMAT and explore my options. This is a good chance for me to rebrand myself, as it's pretty obvious that the networking opportunities and name recognition at SMU are 1000x better than at UTD. I figured out too late that in the real world it's about who you know rather than what you know.


TL;DR : tell me why should attend SMU for graduate school.

Smart strategy. I mentor Cox masters students and know this works.
Good coursework and excellent placement, especially for US citizens. Big 4 consulting and advisory, banks, corporate finance, etc all come to pay more (50-70k) for someone finance focused that's a bit less expensive than the MBAs. You still retain the option to get an MBA later. I believe there are only 60 students in the MS class and the school is very career focused.

I am a Cox BBA grad. I majored in Financial Consulting, but declared as Finance as one of the professors (Jeff Hart) urged students to take as many accounting classes as they could handle, but really said that the name Finance is much more marketable than Financial Consulting. I am very pleased with the education received, professors, class size, class interaction, treatment by the faculty etc. I think academically everything was top notch. I also think that the career services is great, but you have to make an effort to reach out to them and make the most of it. I can tell you that they are always willing to help whether you are a student or graduate. I have used their help in adapting my resume several years after graduation and Kim Holladay was always very helpful. In terms of job prospects, I remember being 1 of 4 students selected for an interview by Goldman Sachs, which I didn't get. I decided to move abroad and landed a solid post at a Fortune 500 company. Socially, for me was tougher based on the fact that SMU at the time was extremely right wing (Pre- and Post-9/11). Additionally, at that time we were terrible in both revenue sports, so there wasn't much school spirit, but get the impression that there is a lot more school spirit now that we have a competitive basketball program and hopefully an emerging football program. I hope this helps. Best of luck with your decision.

There's a ton of hot girls

Stupid Question: Why are you looking at a MS in Finance rather than a MBA program?

If there is a specific job/career that the MS/Finance gets you that the MBA does not, you are probably making the right choice.

If not, you should consider post-graduation opportunities. Some employers (in particular HR departments) are idiots. If the job requirement includes "MBA-Finance" as a requirement, they will turn down people with MS-Finance degrees.

Good luck.

"I graduated last December and couldn't find a job, so I decided to take the GMAT and explore my options." MBA program wants candidates with 2+ years of work experience. MS in Finance takes people with good scores and grades who wants a more focused finance track that probably didn't get it in undergrad.

A friend of mine's kid graduated UTD last year in Political Science and is finishing up a MS in Finance. He has accepted an offer with a Big 4 firm making mid-$50s. Good ROI and much better than no decent offers after graduation. He still has the option of doing an MBA later.

tristatecoog wrote:Smart strategy. I mentor Cox masters students and know this works.
Good coursework and excellent placement, especially for US citizens. Big 4 consulting and advisory, banks, corporate finance, etc all come to pay more (50-70k) for someone finance focused that's a bit less expensive than the MBAs. You still retain the option to get an MBA later. I believe there are only 60 students in the MS class and the school is very career focused.

Thanks, that's good to hear. One of my concerns was the percentage of the international students. With a pretty small class, I need to take advantage of the connections I make; it's getting harder for people to get sponsored, so if some of my classmates aren't in the country in the future it makes my network slightly smaller than I expected. Not a huge issue though, since you said it places pretty well.

mustangxc wrote:I am a Cox BBA grad. I majored in Financial Consulting, but declared as Finance as one of the professors (Jeff Hart) urged students to take as many accounting classes as they could handle, but really said that the name Finance is much more marketable than Financial Consulting. I am very pleased with the education received, professors, class size, class interaction, treatment by the faculty etc. I think academically everything was top notch. I also think that the career services is great, but you have to make an effort to reach out to them and make the most of it. I can tell you that they are always willing to help whether you are a student or graduate. I have used their help in adapting my resume several years after graduation and Kim Holladay was always very helpful. In terms of job prospects, I remember being 1 of 4 students selected for an interview by Goldman Sachs, which I didn't get. I decided to move abroad and landed a solid post at a Fortune 500 company. Socially, for me was tougher based on the fact that SMU at the time was extremely right wing (Pre- and Post-9/11). Additionally, at that time we were terrible in both revenue sports, so there wasn't much school spirit, but get the impression that there is a lot more school spirit now that we have a competitive basketball program and hopefully an emerging football program. I hope this helps. Best of luck with your decision.

I appreciate the input, corporate finance in a F500 is what I'll be looking to be targeting for my interviews so this is great to hear. I didn't really reach out to career services as an undergrad, so I'm partly to blame. But it's good to hear that they help post-graduation as well, that means a lot. Thank you.

East Coast Mustang wrote:There's a ton of hot girls

Definitely a plus. I know you were joking, but in all seriousness even though I will probably be too busy to do anything besides admire them, it's nice to know that I won't have to look hard to find a girl to take out on a date once in a while.

Digetydog wrote:Stupid Question: Why are you looking at a MS in Finance rather than a MBA program?

If there is a specific job/career that the MS/Finance gets you that the MBA does not, you are probably making the right choice.

If not, you should consider post-graduation opportunities. Some employers (in particular HR departments) are idiots. If the job requirement includes "MBA-Finance" as a requirement, they will turn down people with MS-Finance degrees.

Good luck.

tristatecoog wrote:"I graduated last December and couldn't find a job, so I decided to take the GMAT and explore my options." MBA program wants candidates with 2+ years of work experience. MS in Finance takes people with good scores and grades who wants a more focused finance track that probably didn't get it in undergrad.

A friend of mine's kid graduated UTD last year in Political Science and is finishing up a MS in Finance. He has accepted an offer with a Big 4 firm making mid-$50s. Good ROI and much better than no decent offers after graduation. He still has the option of doing an MBA later.

To Digetydog, this pretty much sums it up. I don't have enough relevant experience, and even if I got into a top MBA program, I'd be in debt after graduation with little job prospects again. I would be too overqualified for entry-level positions, and too underqualified for anything more because of my lack of work experience. MS Finance programs are highly specialized; since Econ majors aren't in the school of business at UTD, I didn't get as much of a bus/finance background as I'd like. Also, since I'm looking at one-year programs, it won't be as much of a burden on me compared to an MBA. My parents bought me a new car as a graduation present with the remains of my college fund, but that was before I knew I would be considering graduate school (lucky me). Luckily I do have some college money left. Other programs have offered ~10k in merit, so I'd be taking out 10-15k in loans to attend if SMU acts similarly. Definitely doable, and I'll be receiving an email next week if I get any money. If not, then we'll see where we stand, because SMU is my top choice.

tristagecoog, if you don't mind me asking, where is your friend's son attending for his MSF? SMU?

Because I graduated with a BBA in a year when every bank/S&L in Texas closed, I feel your pain. It sounds like you have a good plan and I hope it works out for you.

Advice: regardless of where you elect to attend.
1) from your first day on campus, your job is to find a good job. Start networking immediately.
2) don't go to UTD if you can avoid it. While it is a fine school, a "new" school expands your network in a way that UTD cannot. Building your network is critical. 2 schools > 1 school.

My friend's son is in UT-Austin's MS Finance program. No matter where you go, heed digetydog's advice #1. My friend's son hustled like crazy and after many interviews landed one. He followed #1 impeccably. If you want to end up in Dallas, going to SMU will make informational, and real, interviews easier. If you're open, UT is solid as well.

A former colleague of mine recently hired an SMU MS Finance student at a $2B revenue CPG and she has turned out quite well.

Hope you do choose SMU and end up a lifelong Mustang!

Digetydog wrote:Because I graduated with a BBA in a year when every bank/S&L in Texas closed, I feel your pain. It sounds like you have a good plan and I hope it works out for you.

Advice: regardless of where you elect to attend.
1) from your first day on campus, your job is to find a good job. Start networking immediately.
2) don't go to UTD if you can avoid it. While it is a fine school, a "new" school expands your network in a way that UTD cannot. Building your network is critical. 2 schools > 1 school.

I will keep this in mind, that's definitely the plan. I've already started making a list (from LinkedIn) of program alumni to contact once I decide where to go, so I just have to follow through with that over the summer and once I'm on campus. I'm definitely not going to UTD, I'm pretty sure their program is upwards of 80% international students.

tristatecoog wrote:My friend's son is in UT-Austin's MS Finance program. No matter where you go, heed digetydog's advice #1. My friend's son hustled like crazy and after many interviews landed one. He followed #1 impeccably. If you want to end up in Dallas, going to SMU will make informational, and real, interviews easier. If you're open, UT is solid as well.

A former colleague of mine recently hired an SMU MS Finance student at a $2B revenue CPG and she has turned out quite well.

Unfortunately UT requires 3 letters of recommendation and I only have 2 solid ones, so I didn't think it was worth applying if my last one was weak and filled with cliches due to them not knowing me as well. Their program was definitely on my radar since it's McCombs. One of my friends, a UTD alumnus, will be heading to Vanderbilt in the Fall for their MS Finance program, so it's interesting to see UTD produce graduates making their way into top business school programs.

PonyTime wrote:As for the % of international students in the MSF program - it is actually lower than most MSF programs. Cox tries to ensure that only 50% of the incoming MSF class is from outside of the US for balance and so that the Career Management Center is not overloaded.

Many MSF programs are much higher International % than that (see Wash U., UTD, and especially Tulane - where 95% of the class of 100+ MSF students are coming out of China).

Eric - As a Cox alum (grad and undergrad), I can tell you that you will not regret the Cox experience - and you will be a part of the larger University and be a part of the Cox tailgates for home games. Hope you do choose SMU and end up a lifelong Mustang!

Yeah, I did notice that many MSF programs had higher percentages of internationals; I didn't find it worth applying to those, especially since many of their classes are small (<50 students). I do hope I end up here too, it's between here and Wake Forest's MA in Management program. If SMU matches my offer, then it's a no-brainer... if not, then I'll have to make some tough decisions.

eric513 wrote:Unfortunately UT requires 3 letters of recommendation and I only have 2 solid ones, so I didn't think it was worth applying if my last one was weak and filled with cliches due to them not knowing me as well.

Don't overthink this. If you have two solid letters of recommendation and one that is a little cliched, that's probably fine. Just try and find someone reputable for the third one, even if they don't know you incredibly well. Someone at your undergraduate institution can help with this, since they have a vested interest in your success.

Get an engineering degree. Join oil and gas. Start at or near $100k. More for wells engineers.
You're welcome

whitwiki wrote:Get an engineering degree. Join oil and gas. Start at or near $100k. More for wells engineers.
You're welcome

Such awful advice. Not everyone needs to be an engineer, and there certainly have been better times to go into oil and gas than the present.

I agree with Digetydog: 2 schools > 1

If he had an engineering degree he would have found a job after college with any decent GPA. You can then get your MBA later once you decide you want to be management.

Or you could just become a teacher and start at 45k in any large Texas school District. Why bother spending another $100k for a masters to start at $55k?