Thank God

[jtstang]

Two recruiting classes, produced a big ZERO for local signings.

You may think Dez Willingham sucks, but he was a highly prized local recruit.

[Hoop Fan]

he did bring immediate improvement to that disaster he inherited. Only an idiot would have expected him to get blue chips recruits immediately or else. What world do you people live in?

Wait, so now Dement was a "disaster?"

yes, the last two years of the Dement tenure was a disaster. Recruiting went to hell and the team flat out quit on him. I dont even think that is opinion, thats pretty close to fact.

[Hoop Fan]

You moron, go ahead and be a revisionist. There is nothing we can change now, I am going to move on and hope for something positive.

I'm not revising anything, even knowledgable people who dont like Tubbs will admit he brought a new discipline to the team that first year and reigned Hopkins in.

[SMU Football Blog]

More directed at Hoop Fan who didn't want Dement fired in late January/early February'04, as he said back then, he "wasn't in the fire the coach crowd." And on the day Dement was fired, referred to the situation only as "stale."

But of course, even as far back as November 2003, one name resonated out of Hoop Fans posts (if a change were to be made, of course): Jimmy Tubbs.

And Dez Willingham was a transfer and Dez Willingham is from De Soto. First, neither K-State or De Soto are in DISD. Second, you can debate the influence of his HS coach after he graduated and went to K-State.

[Hoop Fan]

you seem to think you are pointing out some sort of contradiction or agenda on my part, but you are not.

I am not in the fire the coach crowd at SMU. Never have been. But I knew it was time for Dement to go after 7 or 8 years. I'm sure I said as much at the time. And I think its patently absurd to fire a coach after his second year for anything other than major violations. Where are they?

As for Dez, Desoto is basically South Dallas so you are parsing words and splitting hairs. Besides, who are you arguing against? Anybody with a clue knew that DISD coaches in themselve could not and would not deliver players. Its takes a network of relationships to make inroads, which Tubbs had.

[jtstang]

And Dez Willingham was a transfer and Dez Willingham is from De Soto. First, neither K-State or De Soto are in DISD. Second, you can debate the influence of his HS coach after he graduated and went to K-State.

I did not say he was a DISD player, just a prized local recruit. And it may have been coincidence, but he transferred to SMU after Tubbs hired in, so I think that's some evidence he wanted to play for him.

[SMU Football Blog]

you seem to think you are pointing out some sort of contradiction or agenda on my part, but you are not.

I am not in the fire the coach crowd at SMU. Never have been. But I knew it was time for Dement to go after 7 or 8 years. I'm sure I said as much at the time. And I think its patently absurd to fire a coach after his second year for anything other than major violations. Where are they?

As for Dez, Desoto is basically South Dallas so you are parsing words and splitting hairs. Besides, who are you arguing against? Anybody with a clue knew that DISD coaches in themselve could not and would not deliver players. Its takes a network of relationships to make inroads, which Tubbs had.

I dunno, if I had a "disaster" on my hands, I would want to fire the coach. Two years ago, you called the situation stale, but now it was a disaster. And you say the last two years were a "disaster", but in December 2003, you said you expected them to contend in the WAC. You see, if I think something is a disaster, I think it is a disaster. Maybe you were being polite. I dunno, I can't read your mind.

Fact is you lauded Tubbs for a long, long time. You certainly suggested, as others did, that Tubbs would get top DISD talent to SMU. I seriously doubt SMU hired Tubbs to come in second place in every recruiting battle.

I think Tubbs should have been given another year. Look it up. Hell, I wouldn't have been too upset if he was given a one year extension. I see the logic in that. But I am not going to cry over it. The RPI dropped by more than 100 during Tubbs tenure! MORE THAN 100! If an RPI in the 130's is a "disaster," what is an RPI in the 240's? What is an RPI in the 240's and losing your best player? You can like Tubbs. You can even say that eventually he would have turned it around. I would disagree, but you can say it. But let's not pretend that SMU was a made layup away from hanging a C-USA championship banner or that Tubbs even made SMU respectable.

[MustangIcon]

I think Tubbs should have been given another year. Look it up. Hell, I wouldn't have been too upset if he was given a one year extension. I see the logic in that. But I am not going to cry over it. The RPI dropped by more than 100 during Tubbs tenure! MORE THAN 100! If an RPI in the 130's is a "disaster," what is an RPI in the 240's? What is an RPI in the 240's and losing your best player? You can like Tubbs. You can even say that eventually he would have turned it around. I would disagree, but you can say it. But let's not pretend that SMU was a made layup away from hanging a C-USA championship banner or that Tubbs even made SMU respectable.

Amen to the Blogger. Results are results even if you don't have as much time as you would like. In this instance, the results were poor. Whoever our new coach ends up being won't even miss a beat if his only bar is to match Tubbs success (or lack there of). I hope to see us bring in a guy that will make the progress we all had hoped Tubbs might have made.

[Hoop Fan]

[quote="SMU Football Blog]I dunno, if I had a "disaster" on my hands, I would want to fire the coach. Two years ago, you called the situation stale, but now it was a disaster. And you say the last two years were a "disaster", but in December 2003, you said you expected them to contend in the WAC. You see, if I think something is a disaster, I think it is a disaster. Maybe you were being polite. I dunno, I can't read your mind.

Fact is you lauded Tubbs for a long, long time. You certainly suggested, as others did, that Tubbs would get top DISD talent to SMU. I seriously doubt SMU hired Tubbs to come in second place in every recruiting battle.

I think Tubbs should have been given another year. Look it up. Hell, I wouldn't have been too upset if he was given a one year extension. I see the logic in that. But I am not going to cry over it. The RPI dropped by more than 100 during Tubbs tenure! MORE THAN 100! If an RPI in the 130's is a "disaster," what is an RPI in the 240's? What is an RPI in the 240's and losing your best player? You can like Tubbs. You can even say that eventually he would have turned it around. I would disagree, but you can say it. But let's not pretend that SMU was a made layup away from hanging a C-USA championship banner or that Tubbs even made SMU respectable.[/quote]


uh, in December of 2003, the team had not absolutely quit. That came later in the season, did it not? And the recruiting disaster that was developing and is now clear, had nothing, absolutely nothing to do with the on court possibilities of the team then. Can we agree on that simple logic? The WAC that year appeared to be very weak, and was weak. Nevada was an up and comer, but nothing special yet. There is nothing about what I said then or now which i have to apologize for in the least. And yes, I was apt to be polite about Dement. We all knew it was time for him to go, but ya see, unlike alot of people I don't to like kick people when they are down nor do I stand for scapegoating.

[SMU Football Blog]

I don't suggest you need to apologize to me or anybody else.

I would suggest some people on this board need to acknowledge that Tubbs' two years here were not good by any measurable standard. I don't think that is kicking people when they are down. Particularly when the people that are allegedly being kicked thought they deserved an extension.

[McClown27]

Killer post Blog!!

[Hoop Fan]

whats wrong with wanting an extension especially when you got shorted by a year to begin with? I bet tubbs would be the first to tell you he was not satisified with the results but he was going to work like heck to get the players to make it better. And his game coaching was fine. And ya know, they all said Billy Donovan couldn't coach not long ago too.

[Pony Up]

There's no rule that says a coach should get a 5-year deal, a salary of a certain amount or anything else. Coach Tubbs didn't have to sign the contract. Having said that, I also think he got cut loose too quickly. If, for example, Bamba Fall turns out to be the star we hope he will, and Brian Morris turns out to be as effective as we hope he might be, then Tubbs' tenure can not be called an abject failure. He will have to be given credit for recruiting two key's to the immediate future of SMU hoops.

[Hoop Fan]

i didnt say there was a rule but 5 years is typical and all I asked was what was wrong with him asking for extension? Nothing.

[jtstang]

I am used to the fact that Tubbs got fired. I don't like it, but I'm used to it. What I cannot palate is the manner in which it happened, and the fact that the booster responsible for it is skating without so much as a reprimand. Burgers and Cheer is what he got fired for, as far as we know, and that's not a good reason. I don't speak for Hoop Fan, but I think he understands where I'm coming from.