2010-11 Men's Schedule is out

[PonyDoh]

lol @ rush week hurting attendance. Its amazing I sweat blood for programs associated w/such a soft student body. Thank God my Terp brethren throw batteries

thoughtless comment.

my point is, only about 40% of the student body will be anywhere near campus at that point. and if not for rush week there wouldn't be any.

anytime I get to vent against preppy pansies, I'm taking it. Your point is well taken, though. moody will be a morgue.

[ponyboy]

anytime I get to vent against preppy pansies, I'm taking it.

[PoconoPony]

I don't have a problem w/hoops being on the back burner. W/the schedule we're playing though, just be forewarned that Doh may play/recruit his way into job security. If Doh only gets 19 wins and goes 8-8, it's going to be tough to fire the guy, that's all. I'm cheering for the kids, don't much care what happens w/Doh. I just find it disturbing that any Mustang fan would cheer against the kids, who work so hard for the school, b/c they want a coaching change. Those same folks can't name 3 legit candidates for the job, that are a definitive upgrade, in a similar price range.

FWIW, for all my griping of the Jfrog signing, he's a legitimately good kid it seems. He loves being at SMU, works hard, recognizes and is grateful for the opportunity. He's quickly becoming one of my favorites. On facebook, current Mav, Dom Jones, glows about Frog and his work ethic. Great stuff.

Hoops is not on the back burner. It is front and center, but failing. All ADs realize that both sports are the major revenue sports and both must be strong to support an entire athletic department. I saw some stats earlier this week in an article regarding University of California, Berkley dropping five highly successful sports in 2011 to salvage their athletic program. The online article indicated that only 12 Division I schools in the entire country are breaking even or slightly ahead of costs. All others are losing money including SMU big time. Basketball is Orsini's nightmare and he knows it. His problem is keeping his promise to Doh that Doh would be given 5 years to turn around a program that was already in deep trouble. The integrity of this promise has considerable impact on any new coach he may hire in the future. Orsini should be given credit for sticking to his promise and now the the ball is in Doh's court literally and figuratively speaking. At the same time, I cannot defend any of Orsini's decisions to sign off or put together this years OOC schedule. Short of winning the C-USA championship, winning 30 games this year would still not garner an NIT or NCAA invitation. This program is certainly not headed in the Top 25 direction in any aspect of the schedule or groveling for lightly regarded recruits. It does appear that 2012 holds some promise.

[RednBlue11]

anytime I get to vent against preppy pansies, I'm taking it.

it continues to amaze me that you guys take shots at the basketball team's most vocal supporters on campus.

[PonyDoh]

I don't have a problem w/hoops being on the back burner. W/the schedule we're playing though, just be forewarned that Doh may play/recruit his way into job security. If Doh only gets 19 wins and goes 8-8, it's going to be tough to fire the guy, that's all. I'm cheering for the kids, don't much care what happens w/Doh. I just find it disturbing that any Mustang fan would cheer against the kids, who work so hard for the school, b/c they want a coaching change. Those same folks can't name 3 legit candidates for the job, that are a definitive upgrade, in a similar price range.

FWIW, for all my griping of the Jfrog signing, he's a legitimately good kid it seems. He loves being at SMU, works hard, recognizes and is grateful for the opportunity. He's quickly becoming one of my favorites. On facebook, current Mav, Dom Jones, glows about Frog and his work ethic. Great stuff.

Hoops is not on the back burner. It is front and center, but failing. All ADs realize that both sports are the major revenue sports and both must be strong to support an entire athletic department. I saw some stats earlier this week in an article regarding University of California, Berkley dropping five highly successful sports in 2011 to salvage their athletic program. The online article indicated that only 12 Division I schools in the entire country are breaking even or slightly ahead of costs. All others are losing money including SMU big time. Basketball is Orsini's nightmare and he knows it. His problem is keeping his promise to Doh that Doh would be given 5 years to turn around a program that was already in deep trouble. The integrity of this promise has considerable impact on any new coach he may hire in the future. Orsini should be given credit for sticking to his promise and now the the ball is in Doh's court literally and figuratively speaking. At the same time, I cannot defend any of Orsini's decisions to sign off or put together this years OOC schedule. Short of winning the C-USA championship, winning 30 games this year would still not garner an NIT or NCAA invitation. This program is certainly not headed in the Top 25 direction in any aspect of the schedule or groveling for lightly regarded recruits. It does appear that 2012 holds some promise.

Pretty good take, Pocono. Lots of good points in there. I don't think we're really groveling for lightly regarded recruits, though. I think the issue on the trail has been more about aiming too high, only to miss, and then not having much depth in the prospect pool, mostly due to a rotating cast of assistants. Could happen again, as we watch guys like Karim York verbal elsewhere, while we wait on a national Top 100 in Cannen Cunningham etc.

[50's PONY]

Just curious but what Top 100 list has him it it?

[RGV Pony]

Just curious but what Top 100 list has him it it?

Rivals has him #16 forward #78 overall

[CalallenStang]

anytime I get to vent against preppy pansies, I'm taking it.

it continues to amaze me that you guys take shots at the basketball team's most vocal supporters on campus.

i don't see anyone taking shots at the band

[PoconoPony]

[quote="PoconoPony

Pretty good take, Pocono. Lots of good points in there. I don't think we're really groveling for lightly regarded recruits, though. I think the issue on the trail has been more about aiming too high, only to miss, and then not having much depth in the prospect pool, mostly due to a rotating cast of assistants. Could happen again, as we watch guys like Karim York verbal elsewhere, while we wait on a national Top 100 in Cannen Cunningham etc.[/quote]

My comments supra. are taking into account the situation of the program as a whole since the inception of the Doh era. The whole body of work to date and not those most recent situations re 2012 eligible transfers for which I only give partial credit to Doh and staff. I agree that the revolving assistants situation has been a major issue; however, it appears that despite good work by the assistants their efforts have been stifled by Doh and his failure to follow up on many of the inroads and opportunities they may have generated or agree with their evaluations. At times it has seemed that they have not had a very clear understanding of their needs and what type of players they should be recruiting. I guess this is directly related to Doh's extended failure to identify the system he seeks to run and the type of talent necessary to run the system. You cannot blame the assistants for apparently receiving mixed signals and nixed signals in their recruiting efforts.

When I used the term groveling for lower level prospects it is based on the evaluations and ratings attributed to the kids we have recruited based on the subscription service's evaluations. In Doh's tenure we have generally recruited some 1 star and generally 2 star kids with a lonely 3 thrown in periodically. I just reviewed the Scout top 100 list and did not see where SMU was even listed as pursuing any of these kids. Hence, I am not sure that you can make a very strong case for the point that we aimed too high and simply were not successful. It appears that we are not aiming sufficiently high. A top 50 program requires far better depth and talent than we have recruited thus far not to mention coaching issues. How can Memphis lose Calipari, hire a young first time head coach who proceeds in his first 2 years to recruit Top 10 classes in C-USA???? Doh was supposed to be that type of recruiter. Finally, how can you demonstrate the credibility and progress of an evolving program to a prospective recruit with our OOC schedule???? If I were a highly regarded recruit one look at our OOC schedule would immediately tell me virtually everything I needed to know and cause me to look elsewhere.

[MustangIcon]

[quote="PoconoPony

Pretty good take, Pocono. Lots of good points in there. I don't think we're really groveling for lightly regarded recruits, though. I think the issue on the trail has been more about aiming too high, only to miss, and then not having much depth in the prospect pool, mostly due to a rotating cast of assistants. Could happen again, as we watch guys like Karim York verbal elsewhere, while we wait on a national Top 100 in Cannen Cunningham etc.

My comments supra. are taking into account the situation of the program as a whole since the inception of the Doh era. The whole body of work to date and not those most recent situations re 2012 eligible transfers for which I only give partial credit to Doh and staff. I agree that the revolving assistants situation has been a major issue; however, it appears that despite good work by the assistants their efforts have been stifled by Doh and his failure to follow up on many of the inroads and opportunities they may have generated or agree with their evaluations. At times it has seemed that they have not had a very clear understanding of their needs and what type of players they should be recruiting. I guess this is directly related to Doh's extended failure to identify the system he seeks to run and the type of talent necessary to run the system. You cannot blame the assistants for apparently receiving mixed signals and nixed signals in their recruiting efforts.

When I used the term groveling for lower level prospects it is based on the evaluations and ratings attributed to the kids we have recruited based on the subscription service's evaluations. In Doh's tenure we have generally recruited some 1 star and generally 2 star kids with a lonely 3 thrown in periodically. I just reviewed the Scout top 100 list and did not see where SMU was even listed as pursuing any of these kids. Hence, I am not sure that you can make a very strong case for the point that we aimed too high and simply were not successful. It appears that we are not aiming sufficiently high. A top 50 program requires far better depth and talent than we have recruited thus far not to mention coaching issues. How can Memphis lose Calipari, hire a young first time head coach who proceeds in his first 2 years to recruit Top 10 classes in C-USA???? Doh was supposed to be that type of recruiter. Finally, how can you demonstrate the credibility and progress of an evolving program to a prospective recruit with our OOC schedule???? If I were a highly regarded recruit one look at our OOC schedule would immediately tell me virtually everything I needed to know and cause me to look elsewhere.[/quote]

doh has had lots of 3 stars according the the ratings companies. problem is he has turned a lot of them into 2 stars.

regarding the 2nd bolded comment, Memphis just finished playing in the national championship and over the 5 year period prior to Josh P taking over was EASILY a top 10 team in the country (arguably top 5). smu was complete dogsh*t when doh took over and they are still dogsh*t now, just with the crum center.

[RednBlue11]

Calallenstang

i don't see anyone taking shots at the band

Oh, I get it, you're trying to be clever. You honestly think the band does something to promote the team?

I appreciate the modest showing they make at the basketball games but that's all they do.

When was the last time you spent a significant amount time on campus interacting with or speaking with students? I have never seen the band set up tables in front of HT to promote games, or make facebook events telling the whole student body to basketball games...

Greeks do that every year, and I could care less about what you THINK campus is like but without Greeks making the commitment to have whole chapters there to attempt to inspire some of our almost hopelessly apathetic student body with some pride there wouldn't be anyone at the games.

The next basketball game you go to, see how many students there aren't Greek, it won't be many.

Some of you have your faces so pressed in the nostalgic bullsh*t from your past that you dismiss and disparage the students who care the most, and do the most for the athletic programs through promotion.

From what I can tell our band is a pathetic shell of itself that is barely relevant on our campus anymore, and it's a damned shame.

[CalallenStang]

Calallenstang

i don't see anyone taking shots at the band

Oh, I get it, you're trying to be clever. You honestly think the band does something to promote the team?

I appreciate the modest showing they make at the basketball games but that's all they do.

When was the last time you spent a significant amount time on campus interacting with or speaking with students? I have never seen the band set up tables in front of HT to promote games, or make facebook events telling the whole student body to basketball games...

Greeks do that every year, and I could care less about what you THINK campus is like but without Greeks making the commitment to have whole chapters there to attempt to inspire some of our almost hopelessly apathetic student body with some pride there wouldn't be anyone at the games.

The next basketball game you go to, see how many students there aren't Greek, it won't be many.

Some of you have your faces so pressed in the nostalgic bullsh*t from your past that you dismiss and disparage the students who care the most, and do the most for the athletic programs through promotion.

From what I can tell our band is a pathetic shell of itself that is barely relevant on our campus anymore, and it's a damned shame.

Let me be clear - I'm pro-greek (I'm no Lori White disciple). What I see, however, is that full chapters go to roughly 3-4 games per year with maybe 10% of each chapter's membership going to games that are not designated as "full-chapter" games. Meanwhile, the band takes roughly half of its members to each and every game - men's AND women's. Some of those people are there every game, while others (probably most) do the minimum by only going to whichever games their half of the band is supposed to go to, which is still more games than 90% of the Greeks attend.

Don't get me wrong, there are Greeks on this campus that go to each and every game (I remember Harry0569 posting about that last year). To them, I say thank you. But the vast majority of the Greeks go only to 3-4 games a year. Contrast that to the band members who go to at least half the games, both men's and women's, which is what, 20 games a year?

The band isn't what it was pre-death penalty, primarily because of a lack of support from the administration. They had to kill Pigskin Revue last year because the administration would rather support the Parents Weekend Talent Show than the band (FYI, Revue used to be what the campus used as a talent show).

That being said, the band people go to more games than 90% of the Greeks, meaning that the band is still the most prominent group of supporters on campus for SMU basketball.

If you want to change that fact, get more of your brothers to come out to games on a regular basis.

[RednBlue11]

Calallenstang

i don't see anyone taking shots at the band

Oh, I get it, you're trying to be clever. You honestly think the band does something to promote the team?

I appreciate the modest showing they make at the basketball games but that's all they do.

When was the last time you spent a significant amount time on campus interacting with or speaking with students? I have never seen the band set up tables in front of HT to promote games, or make facebook events telling the whole student body to basketball games...

Greeks do that every year, and I could care less about what you THINK campus is like but without Greeks making the commitment to have whole chapters there to attempt to inspire some of our almost hopelessly apathetic student body with some pride there wouldn't be anyone at the games.

The next basketball game you go to, see how many students there aren't Greek, it won't be many.

Some of you have your faces so pressed in the nostalgic bullsh*t from your past that you dismiss and disparage the students who care the most, and do the most for the athletic programs through promotion.

From what I can tell our band is a pathetic shell of itself that is barely relevant on our campus anymore, and it's a damned shame.

Let me be clear - I'm pro-greek (I'm no Lori White disciple). What I see, however, is that full chapters go to roughly 3-4 games per year with maybe 10% of each chapter's membership going to games that are not designated as "full-chapter" games. Meanwhile, the band takes roughly half of its members to each and every game - men's AND women's. Some of those people are there every game, while others (probably most) do the minimum by only going to whichever games their half of the band is supposed to go to, which is still more games than 90% of the Greeks attend.

Don't get me wrong, there are Greeks on this campus that go to each and every game (I remember Harry0569 posting about that last year). To them, I say thank you. But the vast majority of the Greeks go only to 3-4 games a year. Contrast that to the band members who go to at least half the games, both men's and women's, which is what, 20 games a year?

The band isn't what it was pre-death penalty, primarily because of a lack of support from the administration. They had to kill Pigskin Revue last year because the administration would rather support the Parents Weekend Talent Show than the band (FYI, Revue used to be what the campus used as a talent show).

That being said, the band people go to more games than 90% of the Greeks, meaning that the band is still the most prominent group of supporters on campus for SMU basketball.

If you want to change that fact, get more of your brothers to come out to games on a regular basis.

You're trying to make this into a [deleted] contest about numbers and I won' bite, and again, my pretty plain point was missed.

Greek people are highly involved in the promotion of athletics events at SMU, I routinely invite hundreds of people to events that are put up on facebook, that's what I was getting at.

Harry0569 (A Greek along w/ me) over the last 3 years was the man leading the charge for bball all over campus. I know that if many of y'all are on facebook that you are not connected in the networks that get the invites to these events but I promise you that most of the student body is aware of every home game because of people just like Harry0569. SMU has done a horrendous job keeping students informed, so you have individuals take up the torch.

I'm not killing the band for not being there in whole, I understand that there are different needs at a bball game than a fball game. What I feel down about is the fact that they are invisible outside of games.

of course we can b*tch and moan about people not going to games and how many this-and-that...we just need to win.

so hopefully this vanilla schedule will help us do that.

oh, and the talent show? awful...just awful...I would love to see some musically committed people up there raising our spirits.

[CalallenStang]

RnB - I think you and I are actually on the same page on this issue. We just have different ways of viewing it/expressing our viewpoint. Bottom line, let's get this program turned around.

[PonyDoh]

My comments supra. are taking into account the situation of the program as a whole since the inception of the Doh era. The whole body of work to date and not those most recent situations re 2012 eligible transfers for which I only give partial credit to Doh and staff. I agree that the revolving assistants situation has been a major issue; however, it appears that despite good work by the assistants their efforts have been stifled by Doh and his failure to follow up on many of the inroads and opportunities they may have generated or agree with their evaluations. At times it has seemed that they have not had a very clear understanding of their needs and what type of players they should be recruiting. I guess this is directly related to Doh's extended failure to identify the system he seeks to run and the type of talent necessary to run the system. You cannot blame the assistants for apparently receiving mixed signals and nixed signals in their recruiting efforts.

Agree w/all of this, and would add that Doh/Orsini just plain hired poorly, on more then a few occasions, as well.

When I used the term groveling for lower level prospects it is based on the evaluations and ratings attributed to the kids we have recruited based on the subscription service's evaluations. In Doh's tenure we have generally recruited some 1 star and generally 2 star kids with a lonely 3 thrown in periodically. I just reviewed the Scout top 100 list and did not see where SMU was even listed as pursuing any of these kids. Hence, I am not sure that you can make a very strong case for the point that we aimed too high and simply were not successful. It appears that we are not aiming sufficiently high. A top 50 program requires far better depth and talent than we have recruited thus far not to mention coaching issues.

Doh mostly grabs 3 star kids, w/a healthy mix of 2 & 4s. IF you are going to fall into the service ranking games, at least make it a cross-section of a bunch of services. Also, take into account local & regional rankings like texashoops, rcssports, metroplexhoops etc. None of that matters as much as actually seeing the kids play, which many of us do, not just coaches. In '10, we grabbed 3 foreign kids that never played the AAU circuit etc. Smith/vilde/Pats/Frog are a pretty darn good CUSA class that just won't rate on rivals/scout etc. For example, Vilde destroyed local Desoto product, Keith Davis, daily in practice at Lee. He only had an ESPN evaluation, based on one tournament in prep school. Davis played a full AAU circuit over his high school career etc. No one knows Vilde, who trains like Drago, while Davis is an Aggie. The guys at DC Assault stashed a few kids l at Lee that year, they'll tell you we stole Vilde. I don't remember if Pats was ever evaluated by the services, but those that saw him in JC know he's very skilled.

How can Memphis lose Calipari, hire a young first time head coach who proceeds in his first 2 years to recruit Top 10 classes in C-USA???? Doh was supposed to be that type of recruiter.

Pastner has been the chosen one since he was 16 y/o. His legend has been growing since recruiting Stephen Jackson and his Mom for Houston Hoops, when he had braces. His recruiting prowess was well known, and his career arc was on the rise, unlike Dohs. Beyond that, Memphis can let in kids that SMU can't dream of.

Finally, how can you demonstrate the credibility and progress of an evolving program to a prospective recruit with our OOC schedule???? If I were a highly regarded recruit one look at our OOC schedule would immediately tell me virtually everything I needed to know and cause me to look elsewhere.

Recruits aren't all that smart, that's your reality. You tell them they get huge minutes early, if they are as good as you think they are, and that we're going to smack some fools. Then, when the roster loads up in '11, we're gonna schedule up, make a run, and showcase them. Recruiting is spin. You know we're calling the princeton , 4 out and 1 in.