Governor of Penn to Sue NCAA

[RedRiverPony]

If Paterno and Penn State fostered an environment in which Sandusky could repeatedly commit the crimes he was charged with and convicted for, it's hard to imagine a more clear example of a lack of institutional control.

I hated Penn State before all of this stuff came out, when people thought the place was "clean." There's too much money to be made in a stadium that size, and with the Big 10's TV contract, but if it were up to me, it would be shut down for years.

[Stallion]

Because there are about 200 pages in the NCAA Bylaws and none of it authorizes the NCAA to sanction criminal conduct of employees of a state institution or authorize the imposition of a 60 Million dollar fine against a state institution. I bet few member institutions ever envisioned a possible 60 million direct fine, not just sanctions that resulted in lost revenue, to the NCAA before this scenario arose. We have a criminal and civil justice system that clearly provide remedies for victims and DAs and attorney generals to enforce criminal law. Whay kind of evidentiary rules or procedures does the NCAA have to weigh evidence of punitive damages which the 60 million clearly was. I guarantee the NCAA knows they stepped out on a limb in this case with zero legal or regulatory precedent.

[ponyte]

Does the fact that Ped State worked with the NCAA and agreed to the penalties bear any consideration? I understand all the issues (well, somewhat understand) concerning the rules and definitions but in this case this was an agreed negotiated action.

[Stallion]

Yes that's gonna be where the argument is. Can Pennsylvannia reject liability for claims that were not approved by the appropriate highest levels under sovereign immunity. That's a matter of Pennsylvannia law. A good example though under Texas law is Mike Leach. Tech university officials signed a contract to pay Leach. But in some situations that promise to pay actually can't be enforced in state court against a state institution if they decide -hey screw you -we just aren't going to pay.

[ReedFrawg]

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8800479/pennsylvania-gov-tom-corbett-sue-ncaa-penn-state-sanctions


Great denial and arrogance on a state level. As if I didn't hate that part of the world enough.

Really a disgusting situation...I loathe politicians...

[Treadway21]

Blah Blah Blah enjoy selling your own reality to gulliable SMU fans. The actual facts in the SMU scandal define lack of institional control-there has never been another example so clearly fitting the description by the President, AD and Board of Govenors of a University.

Other examples by definition will never be the same. The NCAA had an easy target in SMU and passed on other targets that fit the criteria for the death penalty. They passed on enforcement for monetary reasons and political reasons. If we had the same political and fiscal pull as the big reveue generating state schools, the NCAA would have found a way not to give us the DP whether we deserved it or not. If Penn State was Tulane, they would be playing football much less playing on TV very week. That is the real issue not the nature of the infractions.

As far as blah blah blah, that fits your broken record DP posts far better that anyone else's. Your constant apologizing for other schools violations is funny. The NCAA has developed into a money laundering operation for the big state schools and a few others. Just look at the Florida State mascot; they get to keep their mascot and S Dakota loses theirs. Wonder why? Equal justice from the NCAA is a joke.

[EastStang]

A guy I know was caught in one of the predator stings in PA and spent like four years in prison. He deserved it. But the PA AG was crowing about the conviction and the sting. Now, when a state sanctioned University was caught covering up a guy molesting young boys, the State thinks that its University should not be punished. The guy I know will have a SO tag the rest of his life despite serving his sentence. PSU doesn't want to serve its sentence, but in the school of public opinion, will have that SO tag for a long time no matter what it does. Would you send your kid to a Penn State football camp?

[dbone]

Blah Blah Blah enjoy selling your own reality to gulliable SMU fans. The actual facts in the SMU scandal define lack of institional control-there has never been another example so clearly fitting the description by the President, AD and Board of Govenors of a University.

Stallion...I thought I did a decent job outlining where the NCAA went wrong penalizing Penn State...you chose to attack me...again...instead of my argument. You also choose over and over to attack SMU's transgressions and give passes to all others. That's just weird.

You seem to miss my main point about SMU...the essential paradox of our case was that the NCAA framed a guilty school (us). And per NCAA bylaws...that is grounds for reversal of a penalty.

My offer still stands to give you a book...then try to tear apart my facts...I welcome it.

See how polite I am?

[ponyboy]

I have always thought there was due process issue with the NCAA imposing death penalty sanctions or even draconian penalties for criminal behavor by individuals at state institutions for breaking NCAA Bylaws that are meant not to regulate criminal behavior but instead illegal recruiting and competitive conduct. We have a criminal and civil court system which the NCAA usurped. Instead, the NCAA made a tortured interpretation of its own Bylaws to do the job that is reserved for the Court system. There is zero precedent nor clear and definite NCAA regulations concerning sanctions for criminal conduct. Under what authority are they authorized to imposed draconian monetary sanctions? As for SMU we got everything we deserved because there is absolutely no doubt there could not be a clearer example of lack of institutional control over areas that the NCAA is authorized by its Bylaws to adjudicate

Yes. Well said.

[well travelled pony]

Stallion is a knowledgeable fan, but an [deleted]. Really. So many other schools should have gotten the dp. Many should have received major sanctions. I had met a person who worked at duke. They do a lot to protect their "student athletes." More than what that person revealed to me. Same with a connection at stanford. Don't get me started on sec schools. What goes on at lsu is beyond the pale. Stallion, if you think the powers of that school do not know, you are just out of your mind. It makes me sick. If I know what I do, then a head in the sand defense ought to work anywhere.

Go Ponies!

[Stallion]

Look you are just spouting a lot of gossip. They don't take the marginal academic risks we routinely take in the first place. They haven't signed a real JUCO in 6 years probably more than that-I quit looking. The only one was a JUCO who originally went to John's Hopkins on a Lacrosse scholarship. There's no evidence they take late qualifiers or have a bunch of kids who failed to meet NCAA qualification standards. They perform at the highest level of NCAA APR score in the countrys, graduation rate (recently 97%) and last year had 19 academic All-ACC Football players more than double the second highest team in ACC-always have. BTW I'm not saying SMU should compete under the same standards as these schools-I'm just saying that its ridiculous to point to these programs as examples of schools that are succeeding as academic warehouses when they don't accept the marginal players SMU does in the first place.

[Junior]

They're never going to give a prominent program the DP. Ever. EVER! Whether they deserve it or not.

Did we deserve it? Yes, and we got it.

Do other universities deserve it, or have they in the past? Yes.

Will they ever get it? No.

It goes back to the nuclear bomb analogy. Only problem is, it's not really as strong a deterrent anymore because schools know the NCAA will never pull the trigger.

[ponyboy]

We deserved the limited ban on football activities. We decidedly DID NOT deserve the self flagellation beyond that limited set of penalties.

[SMUer]

Doesn't the NCAA amount to simply one big club? The NCAA says "pay us $60M for knowingly harboring a child molester in your athletic department", couldn't Penn State just say "hell no"? Sure, they wouldn't be allowed to play under the NCAA banner, bit it's still a choice. It's not like the NCAA can go break down your doors for the money. Oh, you don't like that option? Well, then you gotta pay the fine. And so, what if the NCAA infractions committee didn't dream up a senario where an athletic representative was raping little boys in locker rooms when they wrote their rules? Does that mean they can't issue penalties for it or deem it a clear example of lack of institutional control so egregious that they had never thought of it before?!? It's a club; and you don't have to be a member if you don't like their rules or penalties.

[dbone]

It is a club and as such members are subject to approved rules and procedures. NCAA screwed up big time with PSU. They never ran case through Enforcement Division...Infractions Committee never heard case...Executive Committee met in secret and made up penalties that were never approved by the membership.

NCAA's Emmert justified these actions saying it was such a unique case they had to break their Rules of Procedure to penalise them. Even today PSU is not referenced in the NCAA Major Infractions Database...because PSU didn't break any rules. Laws yes...NCAA rules...no.