OT: Breaking Applewhite News from 2009

[mr. pony]

Deloss Dodds: ""Major Applewhite engaged in inappropriate, consensual behavior with an adult student one time during the 2009 Fiesta Bowl.

I will admit to my interest being piqued by this quote, although the article clears things up by saying "during the 2009 Fiesta Bowl festivities".

And some people wanted this orange bozo to be our coach...

Wasn't our coach accused of the same thing with volleyball player? Just saying we might not want to cast stones in this situation.

Never made the DMN though. Too bad.

[gostangs]

digety - i understand what you are saying, but the law is not on your side. If you are in any position of influence (i.e. a coach or teacher would be considered to have influence over ANY student - adult or otherwise, and regardless if they are your student or not) - then that can be construed as sexual harassment. not saying that is right - but that is what you should assume.

[Digetydog]

digety - i understand what you are saying, but the law is not on your side. If you are in any position of influence (i.e. a coach or teacher would be considered to have influence over ANY student - adult or otherwise, and regardless if they are your student or not) - then that can be construed as sexual harassment. not saying that is right - but that is what you should assume.

I get your point. 90%+ of the time - it is skeezy at best and often illegal.

When I was in HS, the school’s tennis coach married one of the seniors (and a member of his team) a few weeks after she graduated. He should have been arrested. Unfortunately, his wife denied that anything happened while they were students.

But, I do not see anything wrong with a young, assistant professor dating a grad student provided he/she doesn't supervise that student's work. In my mind, that type of relationship (and the rules governing it) is very much like a typical office romance. Just as there are risks with dating coworkers, they can be managed and are not per se - wrong.

BTW - I got a kick out of the original story that suggested that he got some "during the Fiesta Bowl." Halftime, under the desk while he was calling plays on the headset, … ???

[DiamondM]

digety - i understand what you are saying, but the law is not on your side. If you are in any position of influence (i.e. a coach or teacher would be considered to have influence over ANY student - adult or otherwise, and regardless if they are your student or not) - then that can be construed as sexual harassment. not saying that is right - but that is what you should assume.

This is not a "sexual harrassment" issue, and doesn't even sound like a legal issue at all. The student has made no allegation of sexual harrassment. And even if she did, the legal test for sexual harrassment does not seem likely to be met.

This seems to be a school policy issue. The policy may or may not preclude consensual relationships between students and staff when the staff member has no direct supervisory authority of the adult student. The big problem for the school is if it is selectively enforcing such policy, whatever it is. But no, Applewhite doesn't have to be fired. The University would just be liable for damages/backpay to the coach terminated for similar infractions IF she can prove that the motivation for the difference was race and/or gender.

[smudubs]

FWIW, SMU does not have a policy prohibiting employees or professors from dating students. IN fact, in the required HR training they are specifically advised they can have a consensual relationship with students.

Regarding the golf coach, It does not appear that she was fired-she resigned. I have no idea of the circumstances surrounding her resignation. Specifically, she may have been advise to resign in lieu of termination. Absent that, the written warning alone will not likely rise to the level of adverse employment action. She's going to have to argue constructive discharge.

Employment case like these are very difficult to prove.

[Oldmins]

FWIW, SMU does not have a policy prohibiting employees or professors from dating students. IN fact, in the required HR training they are specifically advised they can have a consensual relationship with students.

Regarding the golf coach, It does not appear that she was fired-she resigned. I have no idea of the circumstances surrounding her resignation. Specifically, she may have been advise to resign in lieu of termination. Absent that, the written warning alone will not likely rise to the level of adverse employment action. She's going to have to argue constructive discharge.

Employment case like these are very difficult to prove.

Right, we don't know the details, but from what I understand, she resigned, alright, but in time to avoid being fired, therefore keeping some of the benefits her deal brought her.

[Stallion]

FWIW, SMU does not have a policy prohibiting employees or professors from dating students. IN fact, in the required HR training they are specifically advised they can have a consensual relationship with students.

Regarding the golf coach, It does not appear that she was fired-she resigned. I have no idea of the circumstances surrounding her resignation. Specifically, she may have been advise to resign in lieu of termination. Absent that, the written warning alone will not likely rise to the level of adverse employment action. She's going to have to argue constructive discharge.

Employment case like these are very difficult to prove.

Understatement-my basic form answer to a sexual harrassment lawsuit I think has 36 basic affirmative defenses. Big publicity for outrageous fact situations but they rarely survive summary judgment. The deck is stacked against any person asserting sexual harrassment but the exhibit file is always entertaining