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ponyscott wrote:

ponyboy wrote:Most NFL teams run essentially this same "crappy" offense.

Sorry ponyboy no they don't...not this system.

Teams like the Giants use the same routes from more formations. Pretty much everyone bases their run game off of zone and power now so that is also the same.

ponyboy wrote:Most NFL teams run essentially this same "crappy" offense.

NFL teams also carry FBs, TEs, line the QB up under center at least occasionally and use short yardage packages. You won't find many NFL teams going deep on 3rd and short with regularity either. NFL teams use R&S concepts but no one is married to the philosophy like June is.

Most college offenses have a QB who can run with the ball and does by design. Without the threat of the running QB which the defense has to account for an offense is handicapped as far as the running game. The O line is handicapped further in blocking for the run by always being in the stand up position. Anyone wonder why few if any other colleges use the R&S? The R&S was a viable college offense back when most college defenses were stacked against the run. That is no longer true and "we do what we do" does not get the job done anymore. College football has evolved but JJ has not.

The Fog of June Jones........

sbsmith wrote:

ponyboy wrote:Most NFL teams run essentially this same "crappy" offense.

NFL teams also carry FBs, TEs, line the QB up under center at least occasionally and use short yardage packages. You won't find many NFL teams going deep on 3rd and short with regularity either. NFL teams use R&S concepts but no one is married to the philosophy like June is.

This! ^^

Obviously they do run some variances of it in NFL -- And we saw how well the Bucs looked last week - haha

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... n-offense/

This kind of looks familiar (but it says they run different formations) - We just need better players.

http://blogs.thescore.com/nfl/2011/08/3 ... tennessee/

I think the biggest problem is that maybe you run a few of these but you mix it up with other looks like Houston did or Tulsa, makes things more modern. I really don't know what Leach does or Oregon, etc.

Leach uses wide splits in his O line like the old split T to create running lanes.

Enter the zone blitz. Back in his days with Texas A&M, Bob Davie as a coach was known as an innovator and against run and shoot teams like the University of Houston offense, he would run his 3-4 defense, blitz his outside LBs (thus forcing the RB to stay in and block), and drop off defensive linemen and interior linebackers so he could still play zone defense with six to eight defenders. As a result the R&S's protection and formation scheme broke down just like it does at SMU when they play against any type of defense that Davie 'innovated'. UH had to block with six just like SMU and had/has the running back with a bad matchup with a good OLB and facing an unblocked rusher. But the defense still had/has 6-8 guys in coverage, so the R&S's "hot reads" and breakoffs just do not work very well anymore, just like at SMU. The run and shoot finally had to adapt. Sure UH and SMU can/could do things like certain quick breakoffs and other gadgets, but free rushers and seven guys in coverage is now a losing battle for the QB and WR's in the so called 'run and shoot' version that June runs...IMHO.

PS- good comments. Gee, maybe jj should go to the old double wing (or just go.)

redpony wrote:PS- good comments. Gee, maybe jj should go to the old double wing (or just go.)

I vote for option #2......

GG mentioned that A&M was good at disguising blitzes as Ponyscott mentioned. Looks like a blitz and then the LB's drop back into coverage. Can confuse routes and reads by the QB and WR, very smart defense.

and we will probably see a lot of that today. it is especially effective when the qb and wr's aren't on the same page to begin with.

ponyscott wrote:Enter the zone blitz. Back in his days with Texas A&M, Bob Davie as a coach was known as an innovator and against run and shoot teams like the University of Houston offense, he would run his 3-4 defense, blitz his outside LBs (thus forcing the RB to stay in and block), and drop off defensive linemen and interior linebackers so he could still play zone defense with six to eight defenders. As a result the R&S's protection and formation scheme broke down just like it does at SMU when they play against any type of defense that Davie 'innovated'. UH had to block with six just like SMU and had/has the running back with a bad matchup with a good OLB and facing an unblocked rusher. But the defense still had/has 6-8 guys in coverage, so the R&S's "hot reads" and breakoffs just do not work very well anymore, just like at SMU. The run and shoot finally had to adapt. Sure UH and SMU can/could do things like certain quick breakoffs and other gadgets, but free rushers and seven guys in coverage is now a losing battle for the QB and WR's in the so called 'run and shoot' version that June runs...IMHO.

They did adapt. The pass protection scheme is 100% revamped. The routes still work with a good qb which is the issue right now.