Ponies tell MWC to shove it

[Mexmustang]

Hart is not making any of the decisions. This is all Gerald. Who else would have put Tulane in play? I can't think of another Big East or New Big East school that would have even considered Tulane. Gerald wanted his mate on the knight Commission to second his future recommendations for the league.

Just what does Tulane bring? Tradition? Football or basketball success? Television sets? Large Alumni base? What? Answer: the "last-straw" that moved the Holy Seven from the conference.

[PonyKai]

lol bring something concrete. Have to do better than "they're buddies and on the Knight Commission."

[Grant Carter]

Are you arguing that RGT got Tulane into the big east when no one else wanted them? Silly. How is that even possible, he only has one vote.

[LHS81]

Since SMU isn't officially in the Big East, how would Turner have a vote?

[Oliver]

Mex, we know that Turner was unhappy with the Tulane add..

[CalallenStang]

Hart is not making any of the decisions. This is all Gerald. Who else would have put Tulane in play? I can't think of another Big East or New Big East school that would have even considered Tulane. Gerald wanted his mate on the knight Commission to second his future recommendations for the league.

Just what does Tulane bring? Tradition? Football or basketball success? Television sets? Large Alumni base? What? Answer: the "last-straw" that moved the Holy Seven from the conference.

It's been well-documented that Tulane was voted in by the Catholic Schools' presidents and that SMU had no say in the matter.

[Mexmustang]

I am not aware that it is well known. Could you help me out here?

[CalallenStang]

I am not aware that it is well known. Could you help me out here?

I don't have the link but there was an article a few weeks ago that said that the presidents who voted (Catholic 7 schools + USF + Temple - as Cincy, UConn, Louisville abstained) were given a presentation by Aresco on Tulane and voted them in unanimously. The C7 athletic directors were not consulted and they rebelled, which resulted in the C7 presidents backtracking and deciding to leave the Big East.

I will try to find the link for you.

[CalallenStang]

I can't get the link to the article to work but here's a discussion of the article:

http://csnbbs.com/showthread.php?tid=608064

Here's one USF poster's summary:

Ok, I just tried the same thing and it won't link correctly. It is one of the top articles in sports on NJ.com

My thoughts:

1. Pittsburgh and Syracuse leaving seriously diminished the loyalty of the C7 to the Big East. Not surprising.

2. They voted for Tulane because, "they were a warm body". They had reservations about the move AFTER voting for them, and if those reservations were present before hand, they just decided to keep quiet. That makes no sense considering they had the majority vote, and should have dictated which all-sports invite was issued, if any. Apparently the football schools could have presented any candidate and the basketball schools would have gone along with it.

Personally, I'm ok with adding Tulane. But if the basketball schools opposed adding them for other sports, they could have been a football-only invite (other sports to Missouri Valley?), or another school could have been added for football-only. It still makes zero sense for them to complain about the Tulane invite, as they took part in issuing the invite.

3. They decided to split after a speculative article from Dennis Dodd on Big East TV value. There appears to have been no consideration for potential value of a Catholic League, or that those numbers might have been leaked by television companies in an attempt to gain leverage in negotiations. They took the article at face value and decided to leave a few days later.

Things might turn out ok for the Catholic League, but it appears the C7 presidents have not done their due diligence.

[PonyKai]

As long as we're throwing stuff against the wall, I'm going to toss out that the Big Priest schools voted Tulane in so it would appear to be such a shocking tipping point that they could split off and go do their own thing. Much easier to scream "TULANE" than it is to say they were tired of playing 2nd fiddle for two and a half decades and owning up to the numerous poor decisions they made and contributed to the conference making all while being subsidized by the football schools for years and finally jumping off the gravy train when it was running low.

[GiddyUp]

Probably true in this cut throat game

[Water Pony]

2014 Prediction for 14 FB teams (if 12, then UMass and Rice are not invited). BE would still have good media markets and some big athletic budget schools:

Big East - East (ET)

UConn*
UMass*
Cincinnati*
Temple*
ECU
UCF
USF*

Big East - West (CT)

Memphis*
Tulane
Houston*
SMU*
Rice
Tulsa*
Navy (2015)

Perhaps Creighton* in BB/all sports, except FB?

* Projected strength for BB

[CalallenStang]

As long as we're throwing stuff against the wall, I'm going to toss out that the Big Priest schools voted Tulane in so it would appear to be such a shocking tipping point that they could split off and go do their own thing. Much easier to scream "TULANE" than it is to say they were tired of playing 2nd fiddle for two and a half decades and owning up to the numerous poor decisions they made and contributed to the conference making all while being subsidized by the football schools for years and finally jumping off the gravy train when it was running low.

Quite a bit of truth in this

[Treadway21]

Sorry but please no Rice. I know it is traditional rival, but the baggage of their lack of commitment to sports will taint us as badly as the Tulane partnership is. We need to separate ourselves from the last twenty years.

[Mexmustang]

I would argue that even if I am entirely wrong, which a couple of speculative articles don't necessarily prove (but, thanks for your patience in finding them) they conflict in their conclusion. First the Holy Seven vote them in and then they object that they weren't consulted when Tulane is brought in?

They already had plans to leave and had already begun exploratory investigations into a TV, basketball only contract (other speculative articles) before Tulane was invited in. Why the rush to add a new member, any new member?

As far as SMU (and Houston, etc.) not having a vote, I very much doubt that. The conference was and is falling apart, there was a new president. Who would he be loyal to in terms of football? Answer: The remaining football schools and especially the new football schools he was trying to hold in line while cobbling together a new Big East. He was aware of the the threats by the Holy Seven and would be paying attention to his new bosses (read SMU), not his former ones. I would suggest that the conference was run under the "Robert's Rules of Order" in name only and that considerable polling of all the prospective football members actually made the decision and recommendation.

Once more, what was the motivation to bring on Tulane? Rice or Tulsa are better candidates (none are perticularily to my liking). But, to suggest that SMU, Houston and BSU has no say so in the decision is naive.

I am sorry to sound so condescending, but I have been through over a dozen changes in management (generally by merger and acquisition) and smart people change allegiances overnight. In the case of the conference president, he was going to side with the "winners", and those constituted primarily the new football schools not the basketball schools, who had been threateninng to leave for sometime. What would happen if the new schools had all opted out? His practical authority came from the new schools plus those football school remaining, not the conference by-laws.