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Let's not put the cart before the horse folks - let's focus on building the facilities the coaches need to recruit like an Indoor Practice Facility. Funny how the Administration has been saying for years that an IPF will be built soon but I have yet to see it. Funny how the Administration will say what everyone want to hear when they are asking for Mustang Club donations.

SMU2007 wrote:

sbsmith wrote:The only type of winning football June has brought here is winning against lousy competition.

This is the bottom line.

To be fair, it's the same lousy competition that Bennett and Cavan lost to year after year. Going 7-5 or 6-6 with a bowl game is certainly preferable to 0-12, 1-11, or 3-8.

That said, I thought June would have at least a conference championship or an appearance in the top 25 by now. Hopefully the next coach will get us there.

Mustangsabu wrote:

sbsmith wrote:

Mustangsabu wrote:So if A coach took over a program and went 1-11, 3-9, 5-7 and then 12-0 you'd call him a loser?

Wouldn't call him a loser but he'd still have a losing record, would have to examine who exactly he's playing against. Is that 12-0 a real 12-0 or a "June Jones 12-0" accomplished by beating up on junk?

Did you just manage to make June's 12-0 regular season at HI a pejorative term? Oh that's not really an unbeaten regular season, that's just a "June Jones 12-0"???? You think that the 41-10 beating my Georgia somehow undermines that achievement? Sure it showed HI were not an NC caliber team, but it was a magnificent season.

My oh my how the goalposts have moved in the last 5 years.....

Fact is Hawaii beat exactly 2 teams that season that finished with winning records, they also beat 2 1-AA teams and had extremely close calls (last second/OT victories) against four of the losing teams they beat. Hardly a magnificent season and yes getting beat down by Georgia undermines it because that's how most of the nation remembers that team.

sbsmith wrote:Fact is Hawaii beat exactly 2 teams that season that finished with winning records, they also beat 2 1-AA teams and had extremely close calls (last second/OT victories) against four of the losing teams they beat. Hardly a magnificent season and yes getting beat down by Georgia undermines it because that's how most of the nation remembers that team.

He also managed to beat Arizona State, Purdue, Alabama, Michigan State and Northwestern in the couple of years prior to the 12-0 season.

I would love to have SMU beat some of those ...

sbsmith wrote:

Mustangsabu wrote:

sbsmith wrote:[quote="Mustangsabu"]So if A coach took over a program and went 1-11, 3-9, 5-7 and then 12-0 you'd call him a loser?

Wouldn't call him a loser but he'd still have a losing record, would have to examine who exactly he's playing against. Is that 12-0 a real 12-0 or a "June Jones 12-0" accomplished by beating up on junk?

Did you just manage to make June's 12-0 regular season at HI a pejorative term? Oh that's not really an unbeaten regular season, that's just a "June Jones 12-0"???? You think that the 41-10 beating my Georgia somehow undermines that achievement? Sure it showed HI were not an NC caliber team, but it was a magnificent season.

My oh my how the goalposts have moved in the last 5 years.....

Fact is Hawaii beat exactly 2 teams that season that finished with winning records, they also beat 2 1-AA teams and had extremely close calls (last second/OT victories) against four of the losing teams they beat. Hardly a magnificent season and yes getting beat down by Georgia undermines it because that's how most of the nation remembers that team.[/quote]

So where was your vehement opposition to his being hired?

Didn't think so. Next....

Mustangsabu wrote:
So where was your vehement opposition to his being hired?

Didn't think so. Next....

And your point is someone needed to have been "vehemently opposed" to June's hiring in order to be critical of him now?

PK wrote:

feelthehorsepower wrote:If SMU gets rid of June Jones...don't expect us to win any more...we need him and if we would have listened to his recommendations and recruited the kids he wanted to bring in...we might have gotten things changed around already and not be in a 7-7 rut

OK...another off the wall tidbit...where did this one come from? Exactly who were all these kids JJ want to recruit and couldn't...inquiring minds want to know.

Crickets. I guess you don't want to reveal your source eh?

I believe that JJ was brought here to turn this program around with the following secondary objectives of winning a conference championship, getting to a BCS bowl game, building the program so it would consistently be in the top 25-30 programs and help to position SMU to get invited into a major conference.

So far (IMO) he has done a decent job of turning the program around and getting it headed in the right direction.. yet he seems to have failed at the secondary objectives. i.e. no BCS bowl, no conference championships, no top 25 rankings and no invite to a P5 conference.

I thank jj for what he has done but now it is time to move on to a coach that can help fulfill the rest of those objectives.

LA_Mustang wrote:

SMU2007 wrote:I'm anxiously awaiting that 12-0 season.

That season would happen after dropping to FCS. We've shown we can compete with and beat a good team at the level - Montana St.

We are never dropping to FCS...

sbsmith wrote:

Mustangsabu wrote:
So where was your vehement opposition to his being hired?

Didn't think so. Next....

And your point is someone needed to have been "vehemently opposed" to June's hiring in order to be critical of him now?

To be vehemently critical of what he did before he came to SMU, yes. All this looking back and demeaning his achievements because you don't like where we are now is what I object to. If you thought the 12-0 season at Hawaii was nothing special, why did you want him coming here, and why did you expect more out of him here?

Mustangsabu wrote:

sbsmith wrote:

Mustangsabu wrote:
So where was your vehement opposition to his being hired?

Didn't think so. Next....

And your point is someone needed to have been "vehemently opposed" to June's hiring in order to be critical of him now?

To be vehemently critical of what he did before he came to SMU, yes. All this looking back and demeaning his achievements because you don't like where we are now is what I object to. If you thought the 12-0 season at Hawaii was nothing special, why did you want him coming here, and why did you expect more out of him here?

You keep assuming that June Jones was the guy everyone wanted and that everyone was always 100 percent behind the guy when that clearly was not the case at the time of his hiring. June wasn't even on my radar screen for potential coaches when he got hired (pretty much came out of nowhere), so it's off base to say I wanted him to come here when I thought there were better fits for us. You're right I don't like where we are now but that doesn't mean June's "accomplishments" are off limits.

I'm not assuming anything. I remember the mood being vastly positive even by those who did not expect JJ to come here. And I remember Paul Johnson had us tracking flights and salivating and I don't think that would have had us in a better place. I certainly don't recall opposition in any meaningful form. But sure someone can dig up and old thread.

PK wrote:

PK wrote:

feelthehorsepower wrote:If SMU gets rid of June Jones...don't expect us to win any more...we need him and if we would have listened to his recommendations and recruited the kids he wanted to bring in...we might have gotten things changed around already and not be in a 7-7 rut

OK...another off the wall tidbit...where did this one come from? Exactly who were all these kids JJ want to recruit and couldn't...inquiring minds want to know.

Crickets. I guess you don't want to reveal your source eh?

We went with his stadium lights recommendation.

Mustangsabu wrote:I'm not assuming anything. I remember the mood being vastly positive even by those who did not expect JJ to come here. And I remember Paul Johnson had us tracking flights and salivating and I don't think that would have had us in a better place. I certainly don't recall opposition in any meaningful form. But sure someone can dig up and old thread.

I do seem to remember nearly everyone being very excited. He had just taken Hawaii to a bcs bowl and had a very exciting offense. All of that with his hands tied on the recruiting front. I don't remember many negative posts about him. I do about PJ though.

TidePony wrote:June has turned around the football program. Everyone knows that.

I disagree. I would have agreed prior to ASU, but since then we have been steadily declining back to a PB team in terms of talent.

Given this years' recruiting class, if we enter Yr 7 of the JJ era, I think we will have gone full circle, maybe be marginally better, but not much.