Aresco Says AAC Will Expand

[Mustangs_Maroons]

I know you disagree, and it's called being delusional. Take an objective metric such as average SAT scores.

https://www.collegeevaluator.com/ncaa-c ... ct-scores/
UNT - 1155. You're similar academic quality to Middle Tennessee and UTSA.

https://www.collegeevaluator.com/ncaa-c ... ct-scores/

SMU is 1390. Rice is 1520.

SMU is 235 over UNT, and Rice is +130 over SMU.

This doesn't have the updated schools but it shows the relevant trends that C-USA is an inferior conference not only in athletics but for sure academically (save for Rice which is a program I would want to be with SMU). The difference in quality is night and day between SMU and UNT, and I can't believe I'm arguing a point that is so obvious to anyone that is somewhat informed.

[MeanGreenChris]

I know you disagree, and it's called being delusional. Take an objective metric such as average SAT scores.

https://www.collegeevaluator.com/ncaa-c ... ct-scores/
UNT - 1155. You're similar academic quality to Middle Tennessee and UTSA.

https://www.collegeevaluator.com/ncaa-c ... ct-scores/

SMU is 1390. Rice is 1520.

SMU is 235 over UNT, and Rice is +130 over SMU.

This doesn't have the updated schools but it shows the relevant trends that C-USA is an inferior conference not only in athletics but for sure academically (save for Rice which is a program I would want to be with SMU). The difference in quality is night and day between SMU and UNT, and I can't believe I'm arguing a point that is so obvious to anyone that is somewhat informed.

Those are both significant average differences, but for the sake of argument, if UNT narrowed their enrollment to their top 6,000 students, what does that number look like? We have different missions. So by this logic, you also concede that UT is academically superior or equal to SMU based on USNWR ranking and SAT? If so, what justifies paying the sticker price? Everyone has their reasons for where they go, but UNT is not in the class of schools you want it to be in, and neither is SMU. It's about on par with much cheaper UT and A&M. If their trajectory continues, UNT will eventually be on par with Houston and other large regional colleges. You never complained about them in your conference.

[Topper]

quote: I get the disappointment on SMU's end but that isn't really a beef with UNT

Yes, it is.

When you don't complain about UTSA and then try and bash UNT you show how ridiculous you are and start looking like someone who is worried about what happens if UNT and SMU are in the same conference and the advantage you had might slip. Have you looked at their facilities and budgets? You start looking like someone who has always been able to buy their way out of issues. Does UNT need to keep investing and improving; yes. But SMU has not done so much to where they have set themselves apart or the Big 12 would have invited you already. You ended up with a great hire with Dykes, but before him, you were not relevant. You might still end up going to the Big 12 if they lose more teams a good for you.

There is no beef with UNT. The fact is simply that we don't want a school in such close proximity on equal footing conference wise. The same reasoning applies on the part of TCU which is keeping us out of the Big 12. No hard feelings, this is business, but it does no good to come here and criticize us for opposing UNT entry to the AAC. UNT is a big commuter school that serves an important purpose in our community. No doubt about it. But SMU has a recruiting and prestige advantage that we don't want to lose while we are fighting tooth and nail with TCU for kids who want to play locally. I really have no particular complaint with UTSA simply because it is the only major school in its metro area and it doesn't really compete with us for recruits. UTEP and Rice are my number one choices in Texas.

[MeanGreenChris]

quote: I get the disappointment on SMU's end but that isn't really a beef with UNT

Yes, it is.

When you don't complain about UTSA and then try and bash UNT you show how ridiculous you are and start looking like someone who is worried about what happens if UNT and SMU are in the same conference and the advantage you had might slip. Have you looked at their facilities and budgets? You start looking like someone who has always been able to buy their way out of issues. Does UNT need to keep investing and improving; yes. But SMU has not done so much to where they have set themselves apart or the Big 12 would have invited you already. You ended up with a great hire with Dykes, but before him, you were not relevant. You might still end up going to the Big 12 if they lose more teams a good for you.

There is no beef with UNT. The fact is simply that we don't want a school in such close proximity on equal footing conference wise. The same reasoning applies on the part of TCU which is keeping us out of the Big 12. No hard feelings, this is business, but it does no good to come here and criticize us for opposing UNT entry to the AAC. UNT is a big commuter school that serves an important purpose in our community. No doubt about it. But SMU has a recruiting and prestige advantage that we don't want to lose while we are fighting tooth and nail with TCU for kids who want to play locally. I really have no particular complaint with UTSA simply because it is the only major school in its metro area and it doesn't really compete with us for recruits. UTEP and Rice are my number one choices in Texas.

This is the best argument, I've been mostly addressing people who are acting like this is anything other than being worried about being on equal conference footing with UNT. I would be worried about that too.

[EastStang]

Still think the expansion to 14 and the inclusion of UNT is weird and duplicative. Like I said before Aresco may be planning a conference without SMU and Memphis.

[Topper]

We want in the Big 12. Texas Tech, Kansas State and West Virginia have composite SAT scores equal to or lower than UNT. OSU is only 7 points higher. U of H is surprisingly higher. As far as sports are concerned my only concern is that we may have more academically ineligible students than UNT. Neither Baylor, UT, A&M nor TCU have composite SATs as high as SMU but we really want to be in that type of conference.

[MeanGreenChris]

Still think the expansion to 14 and the inclusion of UNT is weird and duplicative. Like I said before Aresco may be planning a conference without SMU and Memphis.

Two teams in the metroplex is duplicative but you also want into the Big 12? What do you call it then?

For the record, I don't think the Big 12 expands. This was conjecture but if I remember correctly a Big 12 AD already shot it down because 14 doesn't make sense logistically for them and they don't want to split the pie up anymore. If it did happen, I asked a connected SMU alum if it would include SMU. Response: "s*** no, we just need to worry about getting people to our games."

Look forward to our continued and now totally equal rivalry, roomies. It's happening.

[Comet]

Still think the expansion to 14 and the inclusion of UNT is weird and duplicative. Like I said before Aresco may be planning a conference without SMU and Memphis.

Two teams in the metroplex is duplicative but you also want into the Big 12? What do you call it then?

For the record, I don't think the Big 12 expands. This was conjecture but if I remember correctly a Big 12 AD already shot it down because 14 doesn't make sense logistically for them and they don't want to split the pie up anymore. If it did happen, I asked a connected SMU alum if it would include SMU. Response: "s*** no, we just need to worry about getting people to our games."

Look forward to our continued and now totally equal rivalry, roomies. It's happening.

It’s like Tech fans thinking their rivalry with the Longhorns is on equal level. It’s just how some dynamics are.

[MeanGreenChris]

Still think the expansion to 14 and the inclusion of UNT is weird and duplicative. Like I said before Aresco may be planning a conference without SMU and Memphis.

Two teams in the metroplex is duplicative but you also want into the Big 12? What do you call it then?

For the record, I don't think the Big 12 expands. This was conjecture but if I remember correctly a Big 12 AD already shot it down because 14 doesn't make sense logistically for them and they don't want to split the pie up anymore. If it did happen, I asked a connected SMU alum if it would include SMU. Response: "s*** no, we just need to worry about getting people to our games."

Look forward to our continued and now totally equal rivalry, roomies. It's happening.

It’s like Tech fans thinking their rivalry with the Longhorns is on equal level. It’s just how some dynamics are.

These things bear out, Texas is going to a superior conference now, so no they aren't equal. If SMU moves to the P5, I won't make that claim either. Personally, I think we are stuck here in G5 purgatory together for a long time and the big boys may break off soon. We may as well get used to each other and stick to the AAC narrative that this is the best non-P5 conference instead of cutting down all of the schools you're about to be affiliated with for the foreseeable future.

[SMU Pom Mom]

As someone who went to a top 10 university and recently got another graduate degree (somebody stop me!) from my local state commuter school ranked in the 240s, I have seen first hand the difference in academic quality and anyone who thinks schools ranked down are anything but four more years of high school are kidding themselves. Oh, and we are R1 rated which doesn't change the fact that it's just not a good college. These are the kind of places where students say "a degree is a degree."

I don't think it matters that much in football though, unless you are in the Big 10. What does matter in football is that people care about the flagship state school and maybe one other. After that interest drops off and only people with a personal interest give a hoot. That goes for directionals and private schools.

[Oldmins]

In this debate about who's the smartest, someone is going to mention sooner or later UNT'S HEALTH Science Center. It has over 2,000 students studying to become MD's, pharmacists, DO's, medical researchers, etc. Don't think SMU has much to compete with this other than its great fraternity/sorority system.

[Charleston Pony]

The arrogance and entitlement attitude of so many SMU fans never ceases to disappoint me

[Charleston Pony]

if the goal of a higher education these days is essentially job training and attainment, do you realistically believe a SMU candidate will be seen as head and shoulders better than a UNT candidate?

As someone who spent years hiring college graduates to fill "trainee" positions that required them to learn related law, medicine and construction, I hired grads from both SMU and UNT while in Texas and have to admit my UNT grads fared better. I didn't care much about where a new hire had earned his/her degree but was more concerned about whether they graduated and what their GPA was. All I wanted to know was that the individual had good communication skills and had demonstrated a work ethic and the ability to learn.

All this talk about SMU being a better academic institution than UNT is comical. This is about athletic relevance and while I'm as disappointed as anyone with the current state of SMU's conference affiliation, I know there are a lot of people trying to keep SMU relevant on a national level and the bottom line is that fielding Top 25 teams in football and men's bball is what generates revenue. Maybe some of you should just be pleased we might soon be reunited with Rice.

[ponyboy]

The arrogance and entitlement attitude of so many SMU fans never ceases to disappoint me

Fair analysis.

[MeanGreenChris]

As someone who went to a top 10 university and recently got another graduate degree (somebody stop me!) from my local state commuter school ranked in the 240s, I have seen first hand the difference in academic quality and anyone who thinks schools ranked down are anything but four more years of high school are kidding themselves. Oh, and we are R1 rated which doesn't change the fact that it's just not a good college. These are the kind of places where students say "a degree is a degree."

I don't think it matters that much in football though, unless you are in the Big 10. What does matter in football is that people care about the flagship state school and maybe one other. After that interest drops off and only people with a personal interest give a hoot. That goes for directionals and private schools.

Between what, the top-10 college and the local commuter school? I guess I’d need you to elaborate, but in undergrad it’s pretty much the same everywhere outside very highly ranked colleges. In fact, UNT could very well have better professors depending on your major, since they are bigger and have more research dollars. Your biggest drop off is probably going to be in average quality of student, but again that’s not as pronounced in undergrad, since pretty much everyone is stupid at that age. Your undergrad degree the academic prestige is way less important. My advice is always go where you get the most money, but alumni network is definitely a draw. I’ve just never been convinced it was worth it to go to a TCU, Baylor et al over your local regional college if you’re paying full price or without a substantial scholarship. Especially if that regional college has FBS football. UT and A&M are nearly impossible these days because of top 10% rule and I think some kids make bad decisions when choosing their backup schools. Especially if you want to be a teacher or the like.