US News Rankings

[tristatecoog]

Adjuncts, lecturers, larger classes, fewer electives/majors/sports, more online offerings, higher tuitiion and less aid is a growing trend at public universities and to a lesser extent at private ones.

[Mustangs_Maroons]

A few observations on the UG rankings.

- I think we need to figure out a way to increase our applications. At the end of the day, the application and yield play a role in the assessment scores because it goes into competitiveness, etc. We can't have an acceptance rate of 50% even if our applicant pool is much better quality than baylor, tcu, etc. We need more applicants. What is the admin doing to address this within texas, out top out-of-states (CA, florida) but also focus on some of the states nearby?
- we need to invest money on increasing our research efforts. this also impacts the assessment scores
- We have stayed within this range for too long and need a concerted effort to get into the top 50.
- I think I remember us being ranked the same with OSU a few years ago and they have moved to #54, one spot below UT, so it can be done.
- don't understand how some schools listed are in the 40 to 50 range (northeaster being one and yeshiva being another)
- tcu seems to be making strides to move up but I think this is their peak, don't see them getting pass baylor
- separately, Uchicago, Stanford and Columbia all tied for #4. Will be tough to get into top 3 with Princeton, harvard and yale. It's amazing how competitive it is in the top 7-10 schools.

At the graduate level,
- very disappointed with the MBA full-time rankings. I think it's just unacceptable that Rice MBA is #33, and A&M is 37 with UTDallas. Less so on Rice but unacceptable that being in Dallas and with our history, that A&M and UTDallas. This is on Dean Niemi, and he has to be held accountable for our position here. He focuses so much on the part-time program, which is great too, but does so without emphasizing the importance that the full-time program has on the overall reputation of the school.
- impressed by the upward trend in the law school which came in ranking #42. Crucial to be in the top 50, goal should be to be in the top 30. Kudos to the new dean for helping us here.

[smusportspage]

going chinese is not worth it. THey don't participate in any university life, and they don't give back after they graduate. There is a reason all the California kids are coming to Texas - and one of the reasons is that the chinese are ruining the west coast schools.

Not to argue with you, I don't know one way or the other....but, Harvard just received a cool $350 mil from one of its China alums. I thinkg SMU would take that kind of "give back".

[couch 'em]

When I was in school the engineering school had a bunch of arabs. When we inquired why the professors allowed them to blatantly cheat on exams right in front of everyone, I was told "they pay full tuition, take their degree home, and donate a bunch of money"

[imisstexas]

smusportspage, people like gostangs are naive. They clearly don't get it! The 350 million dollar gift is the largest in Harvards history. SMU should take a group to Asia every year to meet with potential families.

[Mustangs_Maroons]

going chinese is not worth it. THey don't participate in any university life, and they don't give back after they graduate. There is a reason all the California kids are coming to Texas - and one of the reasons is that the chinese are ruining the west coast schools.

Not to argue with you, I don't know one way or the other....but, Harvard just received a cool $350 mil from one of its China alums. I thinkg SMU would take that kind of "give back".

Yup, I saw that too. The Chinese, asians and Indians, and I mean those that are first generation and their parents are from these areas, tend to make up a significant portion of the composition of the student body at many top schools. In fact, I think asians may make up 20-25% at the top schools, because of their top sat scores, gpa, etc. It's important to have diversity, and that involves geographic too.

[Planter's Punch]

SMU continues to bounce around 60-56. The next real jump will be getting passed Tulane and UT. Acceptance rate seems to be the problem, even though the student quality keeps going up. SMU is clearly targeting students that are a good fit. A shame we could go up in rankings just by having terrible students waste money by applying to be rejected. Can we just give away a ton of free student applications? Not sure what other metrics can be so easily influenced. Being top 50 and ahead of UT is still a major hurdle.

Washington Post made a useful table of rankings over the years:
http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/page/l ... ends/1292/

[tristatecoog]

Well, 2014 is already in the books and SMU's avg SAT for incoming freshmen was 1309. I believe that's a slight improvement over 1302 in the fall of 2013. Maybe there were a few more applicants due to Larry Brown but many have decided on schools by Feb/March.

I was at a luncheon with Dean Niemi last week and he used the Business Week rankings because "those are the only ones anyone cares about." In BW, the FT Cox program is ranked #29 but that's a stark drop from #12 in 2010. New rankings will come out this fall. A&M moved up from #30 in 2010 to #26 in 2012. UT was 19th in 2012. My guess is that the big drop at Cox is due to a 25% larger incoming class.

To me, Niemi is all about making money. He spends most of his time talking about all of the new programs that are being created. He's good for the bottom line but you have to balance that with a strong core, which in this case is your FT MBA program.

The Dedman Law School movement was great, but it's not due to the new dean since these are Fall 2013 figures. Besides UT at #15, there is BU at #51, UH at #58 and then a big drop to TX Tech at #107 and then South TX at #146. All other TX schools are below 150 and unranked.

[CoxMustangFan]

Well, 2014 is already in the books and SMU's avg SAT for incoming freshmen was 1309. I believe that's a slight improvement over 1302 in the fall of 2013. Maybe there were a few more applicants due to Larry Brown but many have decided on schools by Feb/March.

I was at a luncheon with Dean Niemi last week and he used the Business Week rankings because "those are the only ones anyone cares about." In BW, the FT Cox program is ranked #29 but that's a stark drop from #12 in 2010. New rankings will come out this fall. A&M moved up from #30 in 2010 to #26 in 2012. UT was 19th in 2012. My guess is that the big drop at Cox is due to a 25% larger incoming class.

To me, Niemi is all about making money. He spends most of his time talking about all of the new programs that are being created. He's good for the bottom line but you have to balance that with a strong core, which in this case is your FT MBA program.

The Dedman Law School movement was great, but it's not due to the new dean since these are Fall 2013 figures. Besides UT at #15, there is BU at #51, UH at #58 and then a big drop to TX Tech at #107 and then South TX at #146. All other TX schools are below 150 and unranked.

I'm biased since I was a PMBA, but real long term value is in the PMBA/EMBA programs. The value proposition to quit working and go to school full time is eroding. Trust me, from being a PMBA I know the focus is on FTMBA's, but it's a big mistake IMO. They've done an A+ job building programs to attract working professionals, but once you're on campus some have a different experience than he/she anticipated.

[Mustangs_Maroons]

Well, 2014 is already in the books and SMU's avg SAT for incoming freshmen was 1309. I believe that's a slight improvement over 1302 in the fall of 2013. Maybe there were a few more applicants due to Larry Brown but many have decided on schools by Feb/March.

I was at a luncheon with Dean Niemi last week and he used the Business Week rankings because "those are the only ones anyone cares about." In BW, the FT Cox program is ranked #29 but that's a stark drop from #12 in 2010. New rankings will come out this fall. A&M moved up from #30 in 2010 to #26 in 2012. UT was 19th in 2012. My guess is that the big drop at Cox is due to a 25% larger incoming class.

To me, Niemi is all about making money. He spends most of his time talking about all of the new programs that are being created. He's good for the bottom line but you have to balance that with a strong core, which in this case is your FT MBA program.

The Dedman Law School movement was great, but it's not due to the new dean since these are Fall 2013 figures. Besides UT at #15, there is BU at #51, UH at #58 and then a big drop to TX Tech at #107 and then South TX at #146. All other TX schools are below 150 and unranked.

I'm biased since I was a PMBA, but real long term value is in the PMBA/EMBA programs. The value proposition to quit working and go to school full time is eroding. Trust me, from being a PMBA I know the focus is on FTMBA's, but it's a big mistake IMO. They've done an A+ job building programs to attract working professionals, but once you're on campus some have a different experience than he/she anticipated.

IMO, CMF, you can't have a top PMBA without focusing on the Full-time program. the reality is that the top professors focus on research and the attractiveness of their position in a business school that is highly-regarded, and that is primarly driven by Full-time mba rankings, not part-time.

when you look at Uchicago or Northwestern, for instance, they have generally regarded as the two top part-time programs, because they leverage the professors that come here to Uchicago and NU because of their pedigree (largely determined by their doctoral programs and the full-time mba rankings). the PT programs are cash flow generators for them, but they are not what drives the professors and the rankings. Now, I don't think the two are mutually exclusvie, but you cannot have a viable top-notch part-time program in the long-run if you don't significantly invest in the FT program as well.

[tristatecoog]

CMF, to your point, Dean Niemi said that the focus is increasingly on one year MBA programs because working professionals don't want to give up two years. He mentioned that Kellogg's top FT program is its one year offering. Also, Cornell is offering a one year program in NYC. Due to the summer internship, the two year program still helps you transition better to another field but it may not be worth the extra cost.

SMU will again offer a one year FT program in a year or so and expects it to be bigger than the two year program. Again, the focus seems to be on revenue generation. However, I was intrigued that the MS in Finance was capped around 45 (one cohort) because they want to guard against having too many hard to place international students in the program.

[CoxMustangFan]

CMF, to your point, Dean Niemi said that the focus is increasingly on one year MBA programs because working professionals don't want to give up two years. He mentioned that Kellogg's top FT program is its one year offering. Also, Cornell is offering a one year program in NYC. Due to the summer internship, the two year program still helps you transition better to another field but it may not be worth the extra cost.

SMU will again offer a one year FT program in a year or so and expects it to be bigger than the two year program. Again, the focus seems to be on revenue generation. However, I was intrigued that the MS in Finance was capped around 45 (one cohort) because they want to guard against having too many hard to place international students in the program.

Thanks for the input. I'm not a big fan of the one year FTMBA. The hallmark value of the FTMBA is the internship. The one year serves a market, but it further dilutes the MBA market (even if from a good school).

[RGV Pony]

As prof Tassu said re FTMBAs "those sh%ts are worthless.. They have what two years working?"

[Lonestarguido]

Full time is the pure driver of all the MBA programs. I was a Pmba and going full time would have been awesome, but having a company that paid for my full costs and factoring in giving up two years of earnings would have been a 350-400k swing. I just couldn't imagine giving that up to go full time to SMU...to a top 10 school yes...but you also have to be able to get into a top 10 school!

It's a numbers game and dean is not hiding that. The Pmba and emba programs bring in the money. The ft brings in the prestige, and they really do blend pretty well together.


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[Chnash318]

CMF, to your point, Dean Niemi said that the focus is increasingly on one year MBA programs because working professionals don't want to give up two years. He mentioned that Kellogg's top FT program is its one year offering. Also, Cornell is offering a one year program in NYC. Due to the summer internship, the two year program still helps you transition better to another field but it may not be worth the extra cost.

SMU will again offer a one year FT program in a year or so and expects it to be bigger than the two year program. Again, the focus seems to be on revenue generation. However, I was intrigued that the MS in Finance was capped around 45 (one cohort) because they want to guard against having too many hard to place international students in the program.

I was a member of the first MS in Finance class. I thought it was a good program and made a lot more sense to me at the time than a two year program (time, costs, etc). Our class was about 50% international kids and none of them were able to find jobs in the US once they graduated. They needed companies to sponsor their green cards ($$) and their English wasn't quite good enough.