Brett Shipp Investigation

[East Coast Mustang]

Every kid has it in him or her to succeed in school. Education starts and ends with parents. Starts and ends. If it's a family priority, a kid will make it. If not, he or she usually will not.

Best K-12 schools in the world are South Korea and Finland. You couldn't get two approaches that are more different. The similarity is high cultural appreciation of education.

All this BS about spending, unions, etc. are secondary

Once again, couch 'em is right. All the money in the world won't do a bit of good if education isn't emphasized when the kid gets home from school.

[well travelled pony]

Just so you know couch 'em, South Korea education lags behind the US, unless a family is willing to pay for private or other additional instruction at public. I live in the LA area, and know first hand. Many South Koreans will come over, even split family, to gain access to US public schools. I.E. a parent will come to "study" at ucla, usc, or csun under a studenthe visa. They bring the children over, and also work the English second language angle, to maximize learning English. That way they can go back to Korea fluent in English. And they get to claim how the children have a US education. Chinese do this too. It really taxes our schools for other students, especially those who really are going to stay and live in the US.

Go Ponies!

[ojaipony]

Every kid has it in him or her to succeed in school. Education starts and ends with parents. Starts and ends. If it's a family priority, a kid will make it. If not, he or she usually will not.

Agreed, but even parent apathy can be overcome when learners are empowered to SELF DIRECT. The #1 reason for drop outs is "lack of interest" NOT demographics. When the learner is driving, they get real interested. We put too much emphasis on 'teaching' and 'parent engagement' when it all really comes down to "learner, what do YOU want to do?" I've seen kids completely engage when THEY drive. I've seen kids learn a years' worth of textbook geometry in one month due to their interest in skateboarding of all that things. I've seen kids learn entrepreneurship because of their interest in photography (raised money for a dark room and mentor all by themselves because they really wanted to learn photography - noncoercive, self directed). Public school. Lower middle class. Sounds pie in the sky, but it's really not.

Anyway, back to your regularly scheduled program.

[couch 'em]

Just so you know couch 'em, South Korea education lags behind the US, unless a family is willing to pay for private or other additional instruction at public. I live in the LA area, and know first hand. Many South Koreans will come over, even split family, to gain access to US public schools. I.E. a parent will come to "study" at ucla, usc, or csun under a studenthe visa. They bring the children over, and also work the English second language angle, to maximize learning English. That way they can go back to Korea fluent in English. And they get to claim how the children have a US education. Chinese do this too. It really taxes our schools for other students, especially those who really are going to stay and live in the US.

Go Ponies!

Never heard about the korean/chinese trend. Korean schools are expensive with emphasis on tutors, evening school, etc. They do however produce top academic outcomes and blow US outcomes away. Of course, I suspect the bottom end of korean cares a lot more about schools than the bottom of the US. Again, culture.

Here's a relevant article on the subject: http://ideas.ted.com/what-the-best-education-systems-are-doing-right/

[ponyboy]

What's clear is that money per student is not the problem. Another problem is the expectation of equality of results rather than equality of opportunity.

And a huge piece of this puzzle is that progressives want to knock Mom and Dad out of the picture so they can tell Junior how and what to think. "Education" to them is what everyone else would call indoctrination. It's not teaching kids how to think, but to conform.

[whitwiki]

Don't the conservatives do the same thing?

[ponyboy]

Some want to, for sure.

Education is supposed to be about the three Rs. Not, to choose just one example, how flawed and repressive our founders were. And the sole virtue these kids are taught, all of us have been taught for at least the last half a century, is openness to anything and everything. We're not teaching kids to think or even to be good human beings. We're indoctrinating. It gets worse at the university level, particularly in what used to be rightly called the liberal arts.

[PonyKai]

Some want to, for sure.

Education is supposed to be about the three Rs. Not, to choose just one example, how flawed and repressive our founders were. And the sole virtue these kids are taught, all of us have been taught for at least the last half a century, is openness to anything and everything. We're not teaching kids to think or even to be good human beings. We're indoctrinating. It gets worse at the university level, particularly in what used to be rightly called the liberal arts.

Hold me, I heard someone say something I disagree with and it "triggered" stress and I need a safe space from open debate and discussion.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/22/opini ... ideas.html

[StallionsModelT]

Yeah let's throw more money at a problem that can't be solved with money. Sounds good!

[Junior]

he doesn't seem to like lakewood.

[SoCal_Pony]

Just so you know couch 'em, South Korea education lags behind the US, unless a family is willing to pay for private or other additional instruction at public. I live in the LA area, and know first hand. Many South Koreans will come over, even split family, to gain access to US public schools. I.E. a parent will come to "study" at ucla, usc, or csun under a studenthe visa. They bring the children over, and also work the English second language angle, to maximize learning English. That way they can go back to Korea fluent in English. And they get to claim how the children have a US education. Chinese do this too. It really taxes our schools for other students, especially those who really are going to stay and live in the US.

Go Ponies!

WTP, you're painting too broad a brush. The South Korea system overall is better than the US, much better. If you attend elite public schools in America, then yes, I think the US has the advantage, primarily do to our freedoms (compared to China) & our multi-cultural system (compared to South Korea or China). Greater freedoms + multi-culture = greater creativity, the cornerstone of any educational system.

20 years ago, Chinese kids came to the US for college. Today, they feel it is an advantage (primarily for improving language skills, but also assimilation) to attend earlier, so you're seeing lots of Chinese kids attending HS here, I suspect the same thought process applies to the SKs.

But look at Dallas. Chinese kids go to Plano ISD due to its educational system. You will be hard pressed to find any Chinese kids in the DISD, it's not even a half of 1%.

Oh, and to my earlier post. DISD is shockingly only 4.5% white, and even that is misleading, as elementary schools such as Stonewall Jackson and Lakewood are predominately white, so what you are left with are a handful of schools that are either 50-75% white or an overwhelming amount that are 2% or less. No matter how you slice it, that represents a complete failure of our educational system. It was also stated by Toyota as a primary reason they did not relocate into Dallas proper, because of its school system. This is not unique to Dallas, but true of virtually every major city in America. And South Korea, considered by many to be one of the Top 5 in the world, their cost of educating kids is less than half what the US is.

[SMUer]

My DISD school allows me to request one printer cartridge per year and zero paper; which is super-fantastic when providing labs, tests and worksheet materials for 180+ students, five days a week. I think DISD budgets $2K per HS student; I can assure you almost none of that goes to paper, supplies or any other tangible object students can appreciate. Perhaps it goes towards their free breakfasts and lunches. Meanwhile DISD's staff has double the number of non-teaching employees as it has teachers. This district has a myriad of needs. Split up the district and divvy funding according to more specific needs.

[Puckhead48E]

A general shift in values, women's rights, and the hypersensitive nature of our modern society have combined to destroy our public education system.

First, how can I live with myself when I say that women's rights gains have led to the downfall of our education system? Because there were many exceptional women who had no other arena for their efforts and their expertise than teaching for a long period of time. These women are now leading offices, corporations, industry, etc. Well, there goes that significant impact on our youth.

Second, we have gone from a society of parents who inherently questioned our children's actions when negative reports arrived from the school to a collective of idiots who instantly blame the teacher for not bending over backward to care for "special" Johnny. I distinctly remember the 2 kids in elementary school who had their mouths washed out with soap. Not a pleasurable experience for them, but definitely a lasting impact on me. If a teacher did that for a foul-mouthed kid whose only specialty was talking back or disrupting class today...I can only imagine the mob that would be there to pillory them for assaulting the innocent child.

Third...the average American could give two shizt about education if it requires any effort from them. I repeatedly get to experience the joy of trying to explain to my two sons why it is that almost 1/2 of their fellow classmates don't do their homework regularly, and why some can't complete a simple sentence in 3rd grade. Teachers aren't working from a blank slate starting every year, they are molding clay that has already been formed into semi-malleable molds by those students parents.

Fourth, stop with the crap about the public vs private philosophy regarding schools. Here in Philly, they are trying to close charter schools due to NEA pressure...the same schools that are the only ones actually graduating kids with any capacity to participate in society as semi-lucid members. In DC, the success of the Charter school format was turned into a class and race issue and then a mass personal attack on their superintendent. Same Charter schools are the most successful ones and are offering opportunity for a safe learning environment with the potential for success and expectations of personal responsibility to minority students that was completely lacking under the prior system. So find a way to improve, grow, adapt, and build for the students.

And stop with the simple talking-point posts followed by Go Ponies!. Pretty sure the content followed by repeating the same close makes me think you sound like Clayton Bigsby explaining why he divorced his wife.

[PonyTime]

I am completely in favor of our investigation into Brett Shipp. Here he is assaulting John Wiley Price.




And what do John Wiley Price, Deion Sanders, Ulric Maligi and Keith Frazier all have in common?

[ender3]

First the "Move the Final Four out of Indiana" thread in basketball, and now this.

I never thought I'd miss June Jones, but I'd way rather be arguing about the QB walk of shame or the age of our coaching staff.

I guess it's a good sign that we just don't have much else to gripe about.