Cutting our losses with Tubbs

[Danny Noonan]

I can agree on this 100000%

Are you my pal, Mr. Scholarship Winner?

Yes, sir! I'm your pal!

[Hoop Fan]

what gets me is people like you who i thought were fair minded sit there in silence while idiots and haters spew a bunch of garbage unchecked.

So its OK for you to spew a bunch of garbage about Matt Williams, but not OK for others to spew it about Tubbs? Correct?

Now, I'm sure you'll come back with something about how Matt should leave and that's all you're asking. But I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about where you said that Matt ratted out his teammates and his coach. That, sir, is spewing a bunch of garbage unchecked.

in the heat of the moment I probably got a little harsh. My apologies to everyone. The term ratting has all sorts of connotations and i probably shouldnt have used it. You are latching on to that one word and ignoring the rest. I'm not the only one who has heard and stated Matts almost immediate discontent with playing time and burn with the first team. It sure seems obvious that grandpa had circumstantial motives that stem from his grandsons almost irrational complaint for pt as a freshman who by the way never appeared to be in shape in fall practice.

[Danny Noonan]

what gets me is people like you who i thought were fair minded sit there in silence while idiots and haters spew a bunch of garbage unchecked.

So its OK for you to spew a bunch of garbage about Matt Williams, but not OK for others to spew it about Tubbs? Correct?

Now, I'm sure you'll come back with something about how Matt should leave and that's all you're asking. But I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about where you said that Matt ratted out his teammates and his coach. That, sir, is spewing a bunch of garbage unchecked.

in the heat of the moment I probably got a little harsh. My apologies to everyone. The term ratting has all sorts of connotations and i probably shouldnt have used it. You are latching on to that one word and ignoring the rest. I'm not the only one who has heard and stated Matts almost immediate discontent with playing time and burn with the first team. It sure seems obvious that grandpa had circumstantial motives that stem from his grandsons almost irrational complaint for pt as a freshman who by the way never appeared to be in shape in fall practice.

Cool.

And I have not heard enough about this golf slush fund to begin believing it, however i am leaving the door open on it. Seems a little far-fetched to be just made up out of nowhere. I encourage you to at least consider the possibility that this could've gone further than burgers and cheer, and in that case, Max going to Copeland is what SHOULD have happened, regardless of his motive. His gradson complaining about playing time may have had absolutely nothing to do with Max not wanting himself or his alma mater involved in something that deep.

IF, (and I really stress the IF part) something larger was about to happen, we should be damn glad it stopped before it was started. The ramifications could have been FAR worse than local high school coaches being mad at us.

That said, the reason we're having to say IF is the school's fault. And an enormous f-up on their behalf.

[jtstang]

And I have not heard enough about this golf slush fund to begin believing it, however i am leaving the door open on it. Seems a little far-fetched to be just made up out of nowhere. I encourage you to at least consider the possibility that this could've gone further than burgers and cheer, and in that case, Max going to Copeland is what SHOULD have happened, regardless of his motive.

But also, with regard to Max, remain open to the possibility that where there's smoke there's fire. Assuming there was a proposed slush fund involving Max, this is the second one in which there is an indication he may have been involved, the first one leading to the death penalty. (And before anybody accuses me of defamation again, I am referring to the Blackistone article where he talks about Max's relationship with Bob Hitch, and flat refusal to talk with the Bishops' panel investigating the '80s scandal--and yes I know Hitch was spared somewhat in A Payroll to Meet). If he is a bad booster, then he needs to be banned as much as Tubbs needed to be fired. Just keep open to the possibility.

[Danny Noonan]

And I have not heard enough about this golf slush fund to begin believing it, however i am leaving the door open on it. Seems a little far-fetched to be just made up out of nowhere. I encourage you to at least consider the possibility that this could've gone further than burgers and cheer, and in that case, Max going to Copeland is what SHOULD have happened, regardless of his motive.

But also, with regard to Max, remain open to the possibility that where there's smoke there's fire. Assuming there was a proposed slush fund involving Max, this is the second one in which there is an indication he may have been involved, the first one leading to the death penalty. (And before anybody accuses me of defamation again, I am referring to the Blackistone article where he talks about Max's relationship with Bob Hitch, and flat refusal to talk with the Bishops' panel investigating the '80s scandal--and yes I know Hitch was spared somewhat in A Payroll to Meet). If he is a bad booster, then he needs to be banned as much as Tubbs needed to be fired. Just keep open to the possibility.

Absolutely, I will. But for that to have happened, he would have had to have funded the supposed slush fund and then turned himself and Tubbs in. Althoug I don't believe the conspiracy theories on Max giving "burger and cheer" money to Tubbs in a set up, it is at least inside the realm of possibility. Giving big $$$ to a slush fund for the sole purpose of setting Tubbs up, is not believable in my opinion. Nor is giving big $$$ to the slush fund, later getting upset with gradson's playing time and deciding to take himself down big-time, just for his grandson's ego.

IF IF IF IF the slush fund was happening, or proposed, I find it much more likely that Max went to Copeland to stop it, rather than to turn himself in for being part of it, all because of an argument over playing time.

Not saying the supposed slush fund didn't provide Max with the perfect opportunity to get what he might have wanted (Tubb's ouster), but at that point, the reasons behing going to Copeland are immaterial. Max should have gone to him no matter the motivation. We've been there, done that.

[jtstang]

Good lord, man, can you imagine if Max was really the hero in all of this? I'd have some serious egg on my face from all my tirades, but I guess I'd have to blame the DMN for inaccurate reporting, because I believed what I read. And of course, I'd get to blame SMU for not telling the truth from the beginning. We may get the results of SMU's investigation eventually, but I seriously doubt we'll ever get the skinny on the true nature of Max's relationship with the hoops program.

[MustangIcon]

based on the fact that none of the stories about him indicated any other Division 1A offers and the fact the No. 62 player in the State Of Texas generally doesn't get that type of offer unless his last name is Williams and his grandad is a major contributor to the BB program.

That ranking is higher than the kid out of Dunbar that we were looking at this season. I think his name is Roberts. He seems to have a little bit of love on Texas Roundball and might not even be a top 100 player (not exactly sure of his ranking but I am 99% sure it is lower than 62). Not to say that this Dunbar kid is a great prospect, hes prolly mediocre, but if he has D1 interest then a 3 star rated, 62nd ranked player must garner some interest. I dont think it was THAT much of a strecth for him to receive D1 interest. Granted, I never saw him in highschool and am just going off what I have read and what guys on the team at SMU have told me about him.

[Danny Noonan]

Good lord, man, can you imagine if Max was really the hero in all of this? I'd have some serious egg on my face from all my tirades, but I guess I'd have to blame the DMN for inaccurate reporting, because I believed what I read. And of course, I'd get to blame SMU for not telling the truth from the beginning. We may get the results of SMU's investigation eventually, but I seriously doubt we'll ever get the skinny on the true nature of Max's relationship with the hoops program.

Always good to have a fallback plan, even when it comes to distributing blame. SMU never fails as a viable option.

[MustangIcon]

jt, I will agree that if it plays out like that, SMU will win the award of worst PR job ever. I almost have a hard time believing the slush fund thing is true. But it sure would explain a whole lot.

[SMU Football Blog]

jt, I will agree that if it plays out like that, SMU will win the award of worst PR job ever. I almost have a hard time believing the slush fund thing is true. But it sure would explain a whole lot.

Anybody that doesn't think SMU is already a finalist for the "award of worst PR job ever" is seriously confused.

[Danny Noonan]

jt, I will agree that if it plays out like that, SMU will win the award of worst PR job ever. I almost have a hard time believing the slush fund thing is true. But it sure would explain a whole lot.

Anybody that doesn't think SMU is already a finalist for the "award of worst PR job ever" is seriously confused.

I think at the 2004 awards show they gave us an honorary "Lifetime Achievement" Award.

[Hoop Fan]

Good lord, man, can you imagine if Max was really the hero in all of this? I'd have some serious egg on my face from all my tirades, but I guess I'd have to blame the DMN for inaccurate reporting, because I believed what I read. And of course, I'd get to blame SMU for not telling the truth from the beginning. We may get the results of SMU's investigation eventually, but I seriously doubt we'll ever get the skinny on the true nature of Max's relationship with the hoops program.

i never maintained Tubbs innocence because i didnt know. I just wanted it substantiated and handled properly publicly, and for the punishment to fit the crime. If there are major violations such as this 'fund', it was one well kept secret. Better kept than the Tubbs firing and Doherty hiring in fact. Several people I talked to who usually are around the university and the program enough to know said there was really nothing major that occurred. This was afte the investigation was completed. One guy went so far as to say he talked to Robert Lineburg personally and he said there was nothing like a slush fund. Lineburg has a pretty good reputation around SMU, doubt he would lie to folks. So take it for what its worth, but a dark cloud still hangs over SMU which i wish we would remove by telling the whole story or saying there is nothing more to tell. One way or the other, just do it. What is Doherty telling recruits i wonder.

[gostangs]

I alluded to the issue in earlier posts - anyone ever think maybe the reason SMU could not go totally public with this is that is involves players that are still in the recruiting process? Unless it is totally proven, it ruins their prospects and opens you up for legal action. SMU knew enough to know it had a bigger problem on its hands, and took action because it had to, in order to avoid a bigger problem then a few worthless DISD coaches having their feelings hurt and a couple of nieve fans ranting about railroading, only to look stupid later when the truth trickles out.

Given the hire, SMU comes out of this just fine.

This is becoming archeology. We have a very nice shot at a fresh start. Bring on next season (actually next season will be a beating, bring on the season after that one).

[Hoop Fan]

I alluded to the issue in earlier posts - anyone ever think maybe the reason SMU could not go totally public with this is that is involves players that are still in the recruiting process? Unless it is totally proven, it ruins their prospects and opens you up for legal action. SMU knew enough to know it had a bigger problem on its hands, and took action because it had to, in order to avoid a bigger problem then a few worthless DISD coaches having their feelings hurt and a couple of nieve fans ranting about railroading, only to look stupid later when the truth trickles out.

Given the hire, SMU comes out of this just fine.

This is becoming archeology. We have a very nice shot at a fresh start. Bring on next season (actually next season will be a beating, bring on the season after that one).

nieve? Pretty funny when you are trying call someone else naive. As for your logic, what would prevent SMU from describing the alleged violation in a general way without naming any names? Nothing, Mr. Nieve.

[jtstang]

....a couple of nieve fans ranting about railroading, only to look stupid later when the truth trickles out.

The only one who looks stupid because the truth trickes out, if it ever does, is SMU. And rampant speculators like you.