The Final Straw

by **smu1975** » Tue Jul 01, 2003 2:39 am

If the 'have' schools make it impossible for the 'have not' schools to acquire capital from tv and bowl contracts, then the 'haves' will finally squeeze the 'have nots' out of major college football.

College football is now totally driven by the 'dog eat dog' attitude where it is every man for himself. Conference affiliations mean nothing and the spirit of sportsmanship and competition of the old Southwest Confernce has died, never to return. In my alma mater's (SMU) case this began sadly when fellow Texas universities destroyed the old SWC. This was surely driven by greed and arrongance. Legally, the 'have' schools of the old SWC had the right under our wonderful free enterprise system to do so. But, sometimes, you give up some of your rights to help preserve associations in the name of friendship and fellowship. So be it. The days, I fear, of wonderful games between great friends like Doak Walker at SMU and Bobby Layne at Texas are a thing of the past.

However, tv and bowl monies will eventually max out. Then I believe that the 'haves' will turn on each other and devour each other. Turn out the lights. The party is over.

But, my final statment is that if my alma mater, SMU, is brushed aside by the mass manipulations of the powers that be, I am done with college football forever. I did not attend or watch any college football during our 2 year death penalty. Without SMU, it would be very easy to fill my Saturday afternoons withe other activites without missing any of it except watching my dear old Ponies. This is from a 50 year old lifelong Dallasite and attendee of SMU football since 1965.

I hope that I am wrong. But, I believe that the handwriting is on the wall.

by **BUS** » Tue Jul 01, 2003 9:59 am

I think I understand and feel simular. Being a Dallas native and SMU alum ( 3rd Generation ) I just want to spend my day watching my Mustangs give some team HELL. I loved growing up and being able to go with my father to Lubbock and watch the Tech game with his business associates. The drive to HOuston to stay with my Aunt and Uncle for the Rice and UH games. It was ALL GOOD.

I hope and pray that Mr. Copeland and Mr. Turner have made enough changes to prove SMU is willing to play Div. I. Over the years since Turner has been here he has changed the Faculty Senate into a non combative source of athletic friction.

I hope that one or both of our leaders have some political saavy and " Strategery " (On purpose)

What ever happens - It's on their watch!

by **SMU Blue** » Tue Jul 01, 2003 11:31 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>In my alma mater's (SMU) case this began sadly when fellow Texas universities destroyed the old SWC<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The toothless, overall wearing, hicks from the Ozarks of Arkansas were the ones who destroyed the SWC. Up until that time, the SWC was still fairly solid.

by **OldPony** » Tue Jul 01, 2003 11:42 am

Ark had some impetus to leave following the DP and all of the SWC probabtions. Ark considers itself to be in the Mid South geographically, not the Southwest. We also brought much of this on ouselves with the self destructive regime after the DP.
I agree that college football will never be the same. It is only a matter of time until Baylor is replaced in the Big 12 and the top 3 or 4 programs either go to another conference or split the pie on an uneven basis.
One of the reasons the Texas schools are not liked by old Big 8 schools is that TV money from football goes to those who are on TV in a much disproportionate way. Basketball revenues, however, are split evenly. How much love does KU get for being on TV nearly every week in b'ball. The machinations are far from over. We may end up with about 30 football schools trying to run everything. The basketball schools will be left behind unless they wise up quickly.

by **NavyCrimson** » Tue Jul 01, 2003 11:51 am

"But, my final statment is that if my alma mater, SMU, is brushed aside by the mass manipulations of the powers that be, I am done with college football forever. I did not attend or watch any college football during our 2 year death penalty. Without SMU, it would be very easy to fill my Saturday afternoons withe other activites without missing any of it except watching my dear old Ponies. This is from a 50 year old lifelong Dallasite and attendee of SMU football since 1965"

i truly don't think the bcs knows the true gravity of your statement & the repercussions of it b/c there will be many more millions just like you (me, too) who will do the same thus causing their ratings to crash thru the basement for sure! LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL now that's true revenge!

by **smu1975** » Tue Jul 01, 2003 1:53 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by SMU Blue:
 The toothless, overall wearing, hicks from the Ozarks of Arkansas were the ones who destroyed the SWC. Up until that time, the SWC was still fairly solid.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry, I cannot agree with that point exactly. I believe that the departing Texas universities had been planning for just such a deal for some time. Ideas like that do not pop up over night. Anyway, I do not regret the loss of Arkansas. I have never seen fans that are so arrogant when they truly have little to be arrogant about. I expect those people not to be loyal to the SWC. However, I expected better from fellow Texas based universities. If the Alamo had had a back door, folks from those greedy Texas universities would have quickly made a hasty retreat out the back door. Hardly the grit of the actual defenders of the Alamo. I expect more from fellow Texans. I was extremely disappointed with them. If I had my druthers, I would wipe the dust off from my sandles onto them and would never have anything to do with them. I cannot stomach disloyalty from people or institutions (which they hide behind).

by **MrMustang1965** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 5:16 am

...And now you know why I DESPISE, HATE and LOATHE the Longhorns, the Aggies, the Razorbacks and the Red Raiders with a few Bears thrown in for good measure!

------------------
"Winning ain't everything...but it's a lot more fun than the alternative!" S.M.U. SPIRIT: IT STARTS NOW!

by **MeanGreenGem** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 8:57 am

You have a great quote at the bottom of this post, SMU1975; AND as a 6'th generation Texan (my grt.grt.grandfather was one of the first appointed Texas Rangers and was very highly involved with the Cynthia Parker/Quanah Parker story in Texas history); anyway, I am a dyed-in-the-wool traditionalist in many ways and as one who did not attend an SWC school, I have to admit that I miss that storied old conference. It was a Texas tradition for all of us no matter what university we attended.

As I am from the Houston area, I was at that Astro-Bluebonnet game when Hayden Fry's SMU Mustangs beat Chuck Fairbank's OU Sooners in a cliffhanger of a game in 1968. I saw Gene Stallings coach his last game at TAMU against DKR and the Longhorns on a rainy day at Kyle Field. His Aggies got slaughtered by the James Street, Steve Worster, etc, etc, etc, era UT Horns.

My first college game ever was at Rice Stadium in 1961 (or 1962?) watching Jess Neely's Owls host John Bridges Baylor Bears. There were not many in the stands that day sitting on the old splintery wood seats but that did not really matter to a 10 year old.

We 'boomers ALL miss that icon of an SWC radio voice, and that being the late, great one, Mr. Kern Tipps, describing so eloquently an SWC game that you thought was surely a classic by the tone of his voice even if both schools had not so good records that particular season. Tipps radio description made each SWC game sound like it was the most important one in the season.

So yes, I am Sun Belter who misses the old Southwest Conference and (as you said) those days are gone forever, but no one can ever take those great memories away from us, now can they?

quote from SMU1975: "If the Alamo had had a back door, folks from those greedy Texas universities would have quickly made a hasty retreat out the back door. Hardly the grit of the actual defenders of the Alamo. I expect more from fellow Texans. I was extremely disappointed with them. If I had my druthers, I would wipe the dust off from my sandles onto them and would never have anything to do with them. I cannot stomach disloyalty from people or institutions (which they hide behind)." [/B][/QUOTE]

[This message has been edited by MeanGreenGem (edited 07-03-2003).]

by **OldPony** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:20 am

A purely Texas conference had no appeal beyond Texas. That's why the league broke apart. No large TV revenue for a Texas only league.
I, too, miss the old SWC but no TV revenue means no league. The only way to save non-BCS schools is through a fair playoff system. The more teams the mo-better.

by **smu1975** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 11:25 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by OldPony:
A purely Texas conference had no appeal beyond Texas. That's why the league broke apart. No large TV revenue for a Texas only league.
I, too, miss the old SWC but no TV revenue means no league. The only way to save non-BCS schools is through a fair playoff system. The more teams the mo-better.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Again, sorry to disagree. But, the SWC did have days when it was the talk of the country. My 46 year old wife is a Clemson graduate who did not leave South Carolina until I married her and brought her to Texas. She told me that her family enjoyed watching the nationally televised games of the SWC if it didn't conflict with a Clemson game. If it still existed, those days could have returned. There have been SWC games that captured the national imagination way back to the 1935 SMU-TCU game. I think that the faint hearted group just gave up too easily. Loyalty contains the components of being well-headed and well-hearted. The quitters just lost heart. Part of the loss of tv viewship is the unstable nature of athletics today. If the SWC had remained virtually intact, it could have eventually boomed because that very nature would have attracted fans nationwide.

There will never be a national playoff unless the 'haves' demand it. If and when the 'havenots' are unable to continue in major college football, then tv can say adios to me and a large chunk of college football fans.

By the way, I have only attended a couple of Cowboy games since Coach Landry was fired. And then, only to see Landry-era players being honored. Jones had the right to fire whom he wanted, but, I have the right to forsake his product. As I have said, I cannot stomach disloyalty.

by **OldPony** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 12:02 pm

The world has changed mightily since the 1960's. A Texas confernce would not get good ratings except for a few traditional games (UT-A$M). Why do you think UT etc moved to the Big 12? It is about money and they saw a lot more with a wider based conference with state schools.

by **DR'95** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 1:29 pm

Nothing happens in a vacuum.
IMHO, Not one of, but probably ALL of these: greed, marketing, NCAA sanctions and geography, played a part in the death of the SWC.
I believe the best answer would be what's proposed on these boards - a mixture of a heavy TX and heavy AOS school conference, much like the Big XII. I believe this is the only way it could be, in this day and age, playing ONLY TX schools would NOT be beneficial to any schools.
Also, when you talk about Have's and have not's, you've got to look at what you're selling and buying.
I know SMU is a small school, but you're going to have to do better than the 94th home attendance ranking to do that.
I think SMU has a ready made market, in a sports city, with a good history. But you have to put a product on the field.
I think you've finally got the coach to do it, but it will take time and patience.

Right or wrong, winning cures a lot.

by **smu1975** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 8:33 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by OldPony:
The world has changed mightily since the 1960's. A Texas confernce would not get good ratings except for a few traditional games (UT-A$M). Why do you think UT etc moved to the Big 12? It is about money and they saw a lot more with a wider based conference with state schools. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, indeed, the world has changed. Instead of evolving (as the evolutionists believe), the world is becoming more perverse and wicked (the whole world, America included). As I have said earlier, what is lost is the spirit of sportsmanship and felllowship that existed in the days of Doak Walker and Bobby Layne. The old SWC way was to share revenues in a spirit of mutual support along with the spirit of competition. The SWC turned into a conference (as all conferences are now becoming, I fear) that shoots its wounded. In a sense, I can agree with you in a way. If the old SWC schools are going to stab each other in the back, the maybe it is good that the SWC was put to sleep.

by **smu1975** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 9:01 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by DR'95:
Nothing happens in a vacuum.
IMHO, Not one of, but probably ALL of these: greed, marketing, NCAA sanctions and geography, played a part in the death of the SWC.
I believe the best answer would be what's proposed on these boards - a mixture of a heavy TX and heavy AOS school conference, much like the Big XII. I believe this is the only way it could be, in this day and age, playing ONLY TX schools would NOT be beneficial to any schools.
Also, when you talk about Have's and have not's, you've got to look at what you're selling and buying.
I know SMU is a small school, but you're going to have to do better than the 94th home attendance ranking to do that.
I think SMU has a ready made market, in a sports city, with a good history. But you have to put a product on the field.
I think you've finally got the coach to do it, but it will take time and patience.

Right or wrong, winning cures a lot.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I certainly would like to see my alma mater, SMU, be successful again in football. However, winning does not cure all ills. I seem to remember that the only sellouts (where all tickets were actually purchased, not give away) that we had in the Dickerson-James era were when UT, A&M, or Arkansas fans bought up our tremendous amount of unsold tickets.

Also, my parents did not go to college. But, a relative of ours went to SMU during the days of Doak Walker and Kyle Rote. Those games were 80,000 fan sellouts. The great thing also was that most of those fans were SMU fans. The City of Dallas and its residents generally were supporters of SMU. We were seen as the home town team.

But, what happened, I think, that as Dallas grew from a large, small town into the eight largest city in the U.S., the home town feeling toward SMU disappeared. It has never returned in all these years. So, I fear, that it will never return.

Heck, as is often spoken, the SMU alumni base and the student body do not whole heartedly support SMU. Probably, because, bless their trendy little hearts, they do want to be associated with anything that is not already completely successful.

These groups are not patient groups. Their loyalty is easily swayed or put aside. I think that unless the people in the Dallas area change, SMU will not have tremendous support except from a few 'throwbacks' like myself.

To tell the truth, I will always support SMU and go to all our football and basketball games (as will my wife, my 9 year old son, and my 6 year old son) no matter what conference or NCAA division that SMU is in. By the way, my wife, who is a native South Carolinian and Clemson graduate, yells for our boys louder than any fan at the games (except maybe me). She immediately adopted SMU as her school in automatic loving loyalty after we married 13 years ago. Also, my wedding present from her was something that I just mentioned once to her. I told her that I had always wanted to find the Life magazine that had Doak Walker on the cover. Guess what, the night before our wedding, she gave me a mint condition copy of that magazine that she had been trying to find for months. Now that is the kind of support and loyalty that I am talking about.

by **No Cal Pony** » Wed Jul 02, 2003 11:01 pm

1975, my wife is a diehard florida gator fan. She went to school there, and boy do I hear about it. BUT, she is good spirited about my Ponies. She'll root hard for us too, and let me name our son Conor WALKER. I do love her for that.

Go Ponies!

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