Virginia Tech shooting spree

[mr. pony]

[quote="mrydel"]This really is not even a gun control debate. Nowhere in our country is gun control any tighter than on a campus in Virginia, and look what happened. That should prove that gun control does not work.[/quote]

AMEN. VT is a "gun-free zone." how quaint.

[mrydel]

Come on JT. Do you actually believe a criminal could not get a gun if he wanted one. Even if he could not get the one he wanted, I would imagine he would make do. Someone tell me in sincerity how you keep the bad guys from getting guns. If we ban them all today, will the gang bangers line up and turn them in.

For an authomatic handgun ban to work, I think you have to make the penalty for carrying illegal an illegal one so stiff it truly is a deterrent. Make it a 20 year, no parole, one strike offense, and maybe it's just too risky. The bad guys will continue to carry, but maybe when a few of them get sent away for merely carrying, actual use will be deterred. Just maybe.

I am anti gun control, BUT I do not see the merit in allowing the assault rifles and such. However, I do strongly believe that once they are banned, the gun control folks will target the next level and then the next until we have lost our constitutional right. Just as I would rather a guilty person go free than imprison an innocent man unjustly or defy a person his rights, I would rather the big bad guns exist as opposed to taking away my right to have one at all. I say again, if anyone can tell me how you keep the bad guys from having the guns, I will sign on to your program. My body does not discriminate. It can die just as easily from one shot as it can from several at a rapid speed. A gun in the hand of a criminal is a bad thing, but worse is not having the right to defend oneself.

I am now going to bow out of this discussion. Like politics and religion, this is a topic that will not be solved on this board. I have my beliefs and feelings and respect those of the other side. I just do not agree.

[EastStang]

Yeah, but when we get some Nazi in power who interns all your relatives, you're gonna wish you had an automatic weapon. As much as I hate to say it, the guys who wrote the Second Amendment also wrote the Declaration of Independence and the Virginia Bill of Rights and were in a word "revolutionaries". They wanted to ensure that the people had sufficient firepower to overthrow a tryrannical government. The Virginia Constitution makes it clear that the "well-regulated militia" is in fact ALL of the people (except of course at the time these phrases were penned "people" did not include slaves or women). It also directs that there should be no army in times of peace since an Army can take away freedom. Strictly looking at the intent of the founding fathers, it would appear to me that there should be no gun regulation, and in fact the people should have access to the same weaponry as our military has which would include assault rifles, grenades, and even helicopter gunships. You see what happens whe a country is founded by a revolution, there might be some things in the founding documents which tend to make life difficult for the established government.

[BUS]

Come on guys, this has very little to do with guns. This is an issue of how we raise our children. Do they respect life? Do they respect other peoples rights? Do they have self discipline? Have we been taught to hate?

It is all too simple to blame guns for the thoughts of mis-guided humans.

If not, guns, knives, baseball bats, Fireplace pokers and 2 x 4 boards should all be illegal.

Think folks.

[Imperator]

Come on guys, this has very little to do with guns. This is an issue of how we raise our children. Do they respect life? Do they respect other peoples rights? Do they have self discipline? Have we been taught to hate?

It is all too simple to blame guns for the thoughts of mis-guided humans.

If not, guns, knives, baseball bats, Fireplace pokers and 2 x 4 boards should all be illegal.

Think folks.

For all we know, the gunman was raised in a great home with loving parents who disciplined him, etc. He just snapped--now, when we can figure out how to prevent the human condition let me know.

[Stallion]

I'd agree-these incidents don't seem to arise from disadvantaged school districts or the projects-they seem to arise out of suburbia, rural settings and heck even from traditional Amish upbringing. Again, this is American problem not a bad guy/good guy or them v us type of problem.

[BUS]

Odds are he was not. Also do some research on the past 10 years and the kids that did the shootings. I did this last year and something like 11 out of 12 took drugs. Not goood old pot or coke but from the DR.
Paxil, Welbrutin, Ridellin ( sorry about the spelling )

what I am saying is it not the gun it's...
The movies, TV shows, parenting, easy to control DR. that perscribe drugs, and other societal behaviors.

This is a sad day and I know we all wish that something was done to stop this and these kinds of evil acts.

[abezontar]

Something to think about...if the argument against passing a criminal statute is that it won't matter because criminals will do it anyway, then why pass any criminal statute?

[jtstang]

Something to think about...if the argument against passing a criminal statute is that it won't matter because criminals will do it anyway, then why pass any criminal statute?

Well said. A for you in criminal law.

[expony18]

Something to think about...if the argument against passing a criminal statute is that it won't matter because criminals will do it anyway, then why pass any criminal statute?

Well said. A for you in criminal law.

ok if that gets you an A what gets you a B?

[Nacho]

LB you have seen through my thinly veiled plan.

[mrydel]

Something to think about...if the argument against passing a criminal statute is that it won't matter because criminals will do it anyway, then why pass any criminal statute?

Now you make me come back. The argument was not against passing a criminal statute, it was taking away the rights of the innocent in order to "stop the crime". That is what does not work. The criminal statutes are what allow us to punish those that are guilty. The taking away of freedom is what punishes the innocent.

[mrydel]

It's hard to kill many people with a knife.

Just be sure to travel in threes when you visit O.J.

[Nacho]

OJ was found by a jury of his peers to be innocent. "If the glove does not fit you must acquit." Try Jim Bowie.

[expony18]

Stallion, JT, etc. , what potential lawsuit could the school see from this, if any (neg., etc.?) for not closing down the campus for nearly two hours after the intial shooting?