Game Thoughts

[PonyDoh]

Meanwhile Christian's boys over at TCU knocked off UNLV last night, 80-73. He's had 16 games. Doherty's had 2-plus years.

The worst thing that could happen to Doherty is that Christian catches lightning in a bottle, has a winning record and gets the Frogs into the postseason.

That should be a thing that makes every SMU follower go hmmmm.

They aren't in our conference, we don't recruit against them, so what's the infatuation about? Admittedly, he's doing a good job, but I'm not going to gauge our program off what theirs is doing. Also, I lived in Vegas for many years, and quite tied to the UNLV program. Simply, they are good this year, but they are tiny and not particularly deep. They are going to get stung on the road a bunch this year. That said, their future is pretty much incredible.

What I am concerned with is the lack of ships, relative to our needs for next year. We aren't that far away from being decent, but we need a few more players that can fill it up. So far, our 09 class is about as big a bust as imaginable

[MustangIcon]

So far, our 09 class is about as big a bust as imaginable

I think that is a little bit of an extreme statement. We've got Julius (a bit of a project), who will replace the graduating Bamba Fall. We were in on a couple rivals top 100 guys and lost out. Now I'm sure Doherty is moving on to our next targets for the 1 remaining scholarship we have (assuming Cort Hoge got his scholarship as a loaner this season and that we don't have any attrition, which we may). Basically, I have faith in Doherty's ability to recruit. I think he has done a solid job up to this point and don't see any reason why that won't continue.

[therack]

These are my thoughs on the game:
First of all, I knew that UTEP travels well, especially in Dallas, and they made a terrific game-time atmosphere in Moody on Saturday night. I just wish we had more students like the swim team... Those guys were great!!! I really liked the fact that our team didn't give up when UTEP went up by double digits. We continued to battle and with a few small things going our way we could've pulled an upset. Great game by Mo as he continues to show that he is a very good player and should be a force for SMU. Williams and McCoy were struggling at time against the quality oponents. I was really disappointed by our bigs - they didn't do their part. We played a ton of zone but i'm ok with that as we were going against superior athletic team... Let's hope we can learn from this game and do better next time...

[EastStang]

With regard to zone defenses, anyone ever watch Temple play. Their match-up zone drives teams nuts. We have a 7'+ center who is not that mobile, it makes sense to play zone. However, there are pressing zones for late game situations which would work around Bamba (leaving him as a statue in the paint so to speak to just block shots). I was a bit surprised about a big man coach. Doherty played forward at UNC. He ought to be able to coach up a big man.

[papawasamustang]

These are my throughs on the game:
First of all, I knew that UTEP travels well, especially in Dallas, and they made a terrific game-time atmosphere in Moody on Saturday night. I just wish we had more students like the swim team... Those guys were great!!! I really liked the fact that our team didn't give up when UTEP went up by double digits. We continued to battle and we a few small things going our way we could've pulled an upset. Great game by Mo as he continues to show that he is a very good player and should be a force for SMU. Williams and McCoy were struggling at time against the quality oponents. I was really disappointed by our bigs - they didn't do their part. We played a ton of zone but i'm ok with that as we were going against superior athletic team... Let's hope we can learn from this game and do better next time...

Agree. I thought our inside game with Bamba & Papa would be one of our strengths this year. Instead, its our biggest weakness.
Its disappointing that Bamba can't make a quicker move to the basket & the Papa seems to have turned into a mid range jump shooter.

[papawasamustang]

Meanwhile Christian's boys over at TCU knocked off UNLV last night, 80-73. He's had 16 games. Doherty's had 2-plus years.

The worst thing that could happen to Doherty is that Christian catches lightning in a bottle, has a winning record and gets the Frogs into the postseason.

That should be a thing that makes every SMU follower go hmmmm.

They aren't in our conference, we don't recruit against them, so what's the infatuation about? Admittedly, he's doing a good job, but I'm not going to gauge our program off what theirs is doing. Also, I lived in Vegas for many years, and quite tied to the UNLV program. Simply, they are good this year, but they are tiny and not particularly deep. They are going to get stung on the road a bunch this year. That said, their future is pretty much incredible.

What I am concerned with is the lack of ships, relative to our needs for next year. We aren't that far away from being decent, but we need a few more players that can fill it up. So far, our 09 class is about as big a bust as imaginable

I have disagree with you re: recruiting PonyDoh. We do recruit many of the same players the Frogs do.
Re: our recruiting, TK & Hoge don't appear to be major college basketball talents to me. TK gets no PT & Hoge's presence on the team appears to be a favor to someone. Hoge is nothing more than a walk-on type that 3 to 4 years down the road may develop, but I don't see us having that type of luxury. So hopefully we will have @ least 2 more rides available.

[MustangIcon]

Meanwhile Christian's boys over at TCU knocked off UNLV last night, 80-73. He's had 16 games. Doherty's had 2-plus years.

The worst thing that could happen to Doherty is that Christian catches lightning in a bottle, has a winning record and gets the Frogs into the postseason.

That should be a thing that makes every SMU follower go hmmmm.

They aren't in our conference, we don't recruit against them, so what's the infatuation about? Admittedly, he's doing a good job, but I'm not going to gauge our program off what theirs is doing. Also, I lived in Vegas for many years, and quite tied to the UNLV program. Simply, they are good this year, but they are tiny and not particularly deep. They are going to get stung on the road a bunch this year. That said, their future is pretty much incredible.

What I am concerned with is the lack of ships, relative to our needs for next year. We aren't that far away from being decent, but we need a few more players that can fill it up. So far, our 09 class is about as big a bust as imaginable

I have disagree with you re: recruiting PonyDoh. We do recruit many of the same players the Frogs do.
Re: our recruiting, TK & Hoge don't appear to be major college basketball talents to me. TK gets no PT & Hoge's presence on the team appears to be a favor to someone. Hoge is nothing more than a walk-on type that 3 to 4 years down the road may develop, but I don't see us having that type of luxury. So hopefully we will have @ least 2 more rides available.

I am fully convinced that Hoge is a walk-on and was recruited as such but that Doherty gave him a scholarship for this year since we didn't have anyone we wanted to use it on. He is just keeping it warm for someone in the '09 class is what I am thinking. I believe in a past blog of Doherty's he even mentions Hoge as a walkon (along with Maag).

TK is 7 ft tall and somewhat athletic. He is a project and that is okay. I sometimes wonder if people on here actually think we will ever be a team 13 deep of starter worthy players. In another thread someone mentioned that we have 3 studs- McCoy, Williams, and Faye and that everyone else is a role player. Guess what? Everyone has role players and in fact you need them to win ball games! Yes I think that we need to continue to aqcuire talent and constantly upgrade the team but people also need to be realistic. Hardly anyone gets polished, college ready 7 footers. MOST 7 footers headed to play NCAA hoops are projects.

[papawasamustang]

Meanwhile Christian's boys over at TCU knocked off UNLV last night, 80-73. He's had 16 games. Doherty's had 2-plus years.

The worst thing that could happen to Doherty is that Christian catches lightning in a bottle, has a winning record and gets the Frogs into the postseason.

That should be a thing that makes every SMU follower go hmmmm.

They aren't in our conference, we don't recruit against them, so what's the infatuation about? Admittedly, he's doing a good job, but I'm not going to gauge our program off what theirs is doing. Also, I lived in Vegas for many years, and quite tied to the UNLV program. Simply, they are good this year, but they are tiny and not particularly deep. They are going to get stung on the road a bunch this year. That said, their future is pretty much incredible.

What I am concerned with is the lack of ships, relative to our needs for next year. We aren't that far away from being decent, but we need a few more players that can fill it up. So far, our 09 class is about as big a bust as imaginable

I have disagree with you re: recruiting PonyDoh. We do recruit many of the same players the Frogs do.
Re: our recruiting, TK & Hoge don't appear to be major college basketball talents to me. TK gets no PT & Hoge's presence on the team appears to be a favor to someone. Hoge is nothing more than a walk-on type that 3 to 4 years down the road may develop, but I don't see us having that type of luxury. So hopefully we will have @ least 2 more rides available.

I am fully convinced that Hoge is a walk-on and was recruited as such but that Doherty gave him a scholarship for this year since we didn't have anyone we wanted to use it on. He is just keeping it warm for someone in the '09 class is what I am thinking. I believe in a past blog of Doherty's he even mentions Hoge as a walkon (along with Maag).

TK is 7 ft tall and somewhat athletic. He is a project and that is okay. I sometimes wonder if people on here actually think we will ever be a team 13 deep of starter worthy players. In another thread someone mentioned that we have 3 studs- McCoy, Williams, and Faye and that everyone else is a role player. Guess what? Everyone has role players and in fact you need them to win ball games! Yes I think that we need to continue to aqcuire talent and constantly upgrade the team but people also need to be realistic. Hardly anyone gets polished, college ready 7 footers. MOST 7 footers headed to play NCAA hoops are projects.

I agree with u re: role players. Doh himself was a solid role player.
re: TK, I'm just disappointed he hardly even gets a sniff of the court.
Looks like a bust to me. The center & PF positions need upgraded.
We have a big need for both next year & it doesn't appear @ this point TK or Julius is the answer next season. Leaves Dia as the only returning inside player with any experience.

[MustangIcon]

First everyone here is up in arms about too many players getting minutes. Now we are clamoring for TK to have had minutes as well? There simply aren't minutes to go around.

Also, we are only losing Bamba from our interior players. Otis and Faye are very much considered bigs in CUSA, in addition to Dia. Otis and Dia will have large increases in minutes and TK/Julius will be coming off the bench in some manner. Nayakundi and Malone are also players with some decent height that come off the bench (6'6-6'7ish?). CUSA plays often very small and quick lineups and you don't have to have a legion of 6'10 plus guys to contend.

[jtstang]

With regard to zone defenses, anyone ever watch Temple play. Their match-up zone drives teams nuts. We have a 7'+ center who is not that mobile, it makes sense to play zone. However, there are pressing zones for late game situations which would work around Bamba (leaving him as a statue in the paint so to speak to just block shots). I was a bit surprised about a big man coach. Doherty played forward at UNC. He ought to be able to coach up a big man.

In case you can't tell I am an advocate for man-to-man pretty much all the time, but if you're going ot play the zone you need to play the agressive match-up zone like Temple. It's pretty much a man-to-man when a guy is in your area, agressive defense with the defender on the man. You challenge the passing lanes and the ball handler just like in a man-to-man. Problem is that is not what we ran on Saturday and not what we've run since Doherty has been here. We sag in and let them pass at will on the perimeter and it ate up all the time on the clock in the end and gave that #3 plenty of open looks from downtown. That's a bad defense no matter how you slice it.

And for those advocates of zone when you play "superior athletes" I say BS. It's all about staying active and moving your feet and stepping out to help on screens or if somebody's beat and rotating into the middle from the weak side. And making adjustments in personnel and matchups when you need to. Like I said, Fall was a liability on Saturday, and if he's the reason we had to run a zone then something needed to be done about it. Fact is, any team can learn to play the man against any other team if the proper fundamentals are taught and followed.

[papawasamustang]

With regard to zone defenses, anyone ever watch Temple play. Their match-up zone drives teams nuts. We have a 7'+ center who is not that mobile, it makes sense to play zone. However, there are pressing zones for late game situations which would work around Bamba (leaving him as a statue in the paint so to speak to just block shots). I was a bit surprised about a big man coach. Doherty played forward at UNC. He ought to be able to coach up a big man.

In case you can't tell I am an advocate for man-to-man pretty much all the time, but if you're going ot play the zone you need to play the agressive match-up zone like Temple. It's pretty much a man-to-man when a guy is in your area, agressive defense with the defender on the man. You challenge the passing lanes and the ball handler just like in a man-to-man. Problem is that is not what we ran on Saturday and not what we've run since Doherty has been here. We sag in and let them pass at will on the perimeter and it ate up all the time on the clock in the end and gave that #3 plenty of open looks from downtown. That's a bad defense no matter how you slice it.

And for those advocates of zone when you play "superior athletes" I say BS. It's all about staying active and moving your feet and stepping out to help on screens or if somebody's beat and rotating into the middle from the weak side. And making adjustments in personnel and matchups when you need to. Like I said, Fall was a liability on Saturday, and if he's the reason we had to run a zone then something needed to be done about it. Fact is, any team can learn to play the man against any other team if the proper fundamentals are taught and followed.

“He’s a great shooter,â€

[PoconoPony]

With regard to zone defenses, anyone ever watch Temple play. Their match-up zone drives teams nuts. We have a 7'+ center who is not that mobile, it makes sense to play zone. However, there are pressing zones for late game situations which would work around Bamba (leaving him as a statue in the paint so to speak to just block shots). I was a bit surprised about a big man coach. Doherty played forward at UNC. He ought to be able to coach up a big man.

I agree. For years Don Chaney's match up zone defense at Temple both protected the lane and put pressure on the ball. We absolutely needed more pressure on the ball at the end of the game to make something happen. You cannot catch up and make things happen in a passive zone defense.

[George S. Patton]

With regard to zone defenses, anyone ever watch Temple play. Their match-up zone drives teams nuts. We have a 7'+ center who is not that mobile, it makes sense to play zone. However, there are pressing zones for late game situations which would work around Bamba (leaving him as a statue in the paint so to speak to just block shots). I was a bit surprised about a big man coach. Doherty played forward at UNC. He ought to be able to coach up a big man.

In case you can't tell I am an advocate for man-to-man pretty much all the time, but if you're going ot play the zone you need to play the agressive match-up zone like Temple. It's pretty much a man-to-man when a guy is in your area, agressive defense with the defender on the man. You challenge the passing lanes and the ball handler just like in a man-to-man. Problem is that is not what we ran on Saturday and not what we've run since Doherty has been here. We sag in and let them pass at will on the perimeter and it ate up all the time on the clock in the end and gave that #3 plenty of open looks from downtown. That's a bad defense no matter how you slice it.

And for those advocates of zone when you play "superior athletes" I say BS. It's all about staying active and moving your feet and stepping out to help on screens or if somebody's beat and rotating into the middle from the weak side. And making adjustments in personnel and matchups when you need to. Like I said, Fall was a liability on Saturday, and if he's the reason we had to run a zone then something needed to be done about it. Fact is, any team can learn to play the man against any other team if the proper fundamentals are taught and followed.

“He’s a great shooter,â€

[EastStang]

jt - I love man to man defenses. I also like full court zone presses. But you have to have the horses to keep up, otherwise, you're giving up lay ups. On the other hand, you have to defend the perimeter in the modern game because of the possibility of the 3 pointer. If the choice is an unguarded 3 attempt or a contested 15 footer, I'd take my chances with the 15 footer because at least then it only costs you 2 points instead of 3. A passive zone is death in today's game, unless the team you are playing is full of Bambas. Otherwise, a team can just 3 point you from all over the Court. Having played and coached, I subscribe to the pressure all over all the time school, but I have used zones with some success as well when I have been over matched athletically or when I had a short bench. But pressure is always a part of basketball without it, you lose.

[Pony_Fan]

I haven't read much of the thread above but I think part of jstang's point was not to play zone in that part of the game. Down by too many points and it slows the game down.

Zone can be effective and we need to play it occassionally but we always lose our assignments and give teams WIDE OPEN 3 point shots. Very annoying. They just drain them and drain them at terrible parts of the game.

Doh said in an interview he would like to play man 90% of the time if he could but we don't have the players to do so.