Recruiting...Locals vs 4stars

by **Real Talk** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:17 am

Cant help but wonder what SMU mens team wld look like if its roster looked like the womens team. All but one player is from the great Lone Star state.

Attendance would have to increase right?
The team hasnt won in years...so winning wldnt be sacrificed.
It wld do wonders for the budget I would imagine.

And in the era of AAU and kids pooling talent (see Kimball, FM Marcus, Grace Prep, Prestonwood, etc) something good would eventually happen right?

Shawn Williams,Jalen Jones, Cannen Cunningham havent played a game for SMU..but in browsing posts...I feel the buzz. (and I caution you to temper expectations because program changers...none of them are). But even if they go .500 like all of Dohs teams...its better for SMU right?

by **SMUguy** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:32 am

Texas kids don't mean attendance. Winning does.

The Texas approach was tried with Dallasites Jeryl Sasser, Willie Davis and Quinton Ross, plus Chad Elsey (Flower Mound) and Damon Hancock (Lancaster). But when the team didn't win a lot, crowds stayed modest. If the current crew of Mustangs-in-waiting lead the Ponies to a bunch of victories, the fans will turn out, but not because the players are locals.

Remember when the Cowboys were 1-15 in 1989? Everyone claims to be a lifelong fan now, but back then, there were 20,000-30,000 empty seats every week. It's a town that supports winners. Players can be from Mars, but if they win, fans will show up.

by **ponyboy** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:40 am

I've never seen a remotely convincing argument otherwise.

by **Stallion** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:44 am

The only good crowds and only recent "winning" has been done with Texas/Dallas area players. You dismiss that period when SMU reached as high as 39th in RPI as if it was no accomplishment. We've seen Doh flail away with his International Jet Set recruiting classes-including the much vaunted National Top 35 Class(ha! I still get a kick out of that one) and he still can 't crack the Top 200. You're damn right successful local recruiting will give the program greater buzz, more residual recruiting success, better attendance (as it did in those days) and better performance.

by **hoopmanx** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:45 am

Locals matter b/c we have a good talent base in DFW. That said, it's all about wins & losses. Why should the team have a greater percentage of Texans or DFW types, than the student body? Also, some years Texas, or any legit hoops state, is great. Other years it's shallow talent pool like '12, so you have to go national, cause the top 8-10 in state are accounted for. Often times, get past the top 20ish kids, and you aren't dealing w/high mid or high major kids. The drop off becomes rapid.

by **hoopmanx** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:47 am

Stallion wrote:The only good crowds and only recent "winning" has been done with Texas/Dallas area players. You dismiss that period when SMU reached as high as 39th in RPI as if it was no accomplishment. We've seen Doh flail away with his International Jet Set recruiting classes-including the much vaunted National Top 35 Class(ha! I still get a kick out of that one) and he still can 't crack the Top 200. You're damn right successful local recruiting will give the program greater buzz, more residual recruiting success, better attendance (as it did in those days) and better performance.

the next thing you learn about hoops will be your first. That top 35 national class put two kids on the all-conference team this year, and were the building blocks of turning the program around.

by **Mitch McConnell** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:53 am

Stallion wrote:The only good crowds and only recent "winning" has been done with Texas/Dallas area players. You dismiss that period when SMU reached as high as 39th in RPI as if it was no accomplishment. We've seen Doh flail away with his International Jet Set recruiting classes-including the much vaunted National Top 35 Class(ha! I still get a kick out of that one) and he still can 't crack the Top 200. You're damn right successful local recruiting will give the program greater buzz, more residual recruiting success, better attendance (as it did in those days) and better performance.

I agree with what you are saying about getting local kids...I've been screaming for that for years...But I don't understand why you are bagging on the national rating of that recruiting when it was the recruiting services responsible for issuing it. SMU couldn't control that but it certainly did boast about it when it was released.

by **Stallion** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:54 am

I know-I was about the ONLY one on this board at the time who said that rating was a CHARADE. I was the first one to criticize Doherty for taking 7 freshman in one class while cheerleaders were doing victory laps. It didn't take me two years to see through the hype of that Class. You keep talking about Terrapin Basketball-I was the one who said SMU should refocus on local recruiting when you were trashing Texas BB and you were lauding SMU for looking across the Country. Now we are going to find out who was right.

by **Wuba** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:14 pm

Stallion wrote:We've seen Doh flail away with his International Jet Set recruiting classes-including the much vaunted National Top 35 Class(ha! I still get a kick out of that one) and he still can 't crack the Top 200.

You are mixing rants here. That "top 35" class only included 2 international players (one of whom was first team all C-USA) and in fact had more Texas players than international players.

International
Papa Dia
Tomasz Kwiatowski

Texas
Ryan Harp
Robert Nyakundi
Alex Malone

Other States
Bennie Rhodes
Mike Walker

by **hoopmanx** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:37 pm

Stallion wrote:I know-I was about the ONLY one on this board at the time who said that rating was a CHARADE. I was the first one to criticize Doherty for taking 7 freshman in one class while cheerleaders were doing victory laps. It didn't take me two years to see through the hype of that Class. You keep talking about Terrapin Basketball-I was the one who said SMU should refocus on local recruiting when you were trashing Texas BB and you were lauding SMU for looking across the Country. Now we are going to find out who was right.

Umm, you weren't the only one, cause I'm the only guy here who knows Clark Francis, how he does his ratings, not to mention how he's regarded in the industry. How are we going to find out, when we're going to start 2 international kids next year, a kid w/African roots, and probably a kid from Florida? One of which, they expect to be an all-league type as soon as next year. How are we going to find out, when the focus for '12 is out of state kids? They've always wanted a mix, now we're just in a position to make that happen. It's not like we didn't want to recruit locally, but we'd just lynched a DISD legend.

Also, I trashed individual cities in Texas. You can't compare Texas hoops vs Atlanta or Dc for example. You have to compare Dallas or Houston vs those areas. As a state, given it's size, roughly 15 high major and mid major kids a year, isn't a ton. That said, '11 & '13 are banner years in the state and nationally, so it's becoming cyclical.

by **Stallion** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 6:32 pm

Once again-Total BS.
Now I can prove it. Rivals has a location search feature. For the 2011 Class
Total High School Commitments who signed with High Major Schools within 50 miles of Dallas 13
Total High School Commitments (etc) within 50 miles of Atlanta -7
Total High School Commitments(etc) within 50 miles of Washington DC-6

And if you want to go deeper to include Mid Majors and all Division 1A schools-trust me you are going to lose that argument too. Hint its not even close. You been passing this BS for years and you are and always have been wrong.

by **NickSMU17** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 7:53 pm

It's on like donkey kong

by **hoopmanx** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 8:35 pm

Stallion wrote:Once again-Total BS.
Now I can prove it. Rivals has a location search feature. For the 2011 Class
Total High School Commitments who signed with High Major Schools within 50 miles of Dallas 13
Total High School Commitments (etc) within 50 miles of Atlanta -7
Total High School Commitments(etc) within 50 miles of Washington DC-6

And if you want to go deeper to include Mid Majors and all Division 1A schools-trust me you are going to lose that argument too. Hint its not even close. You been passing this BS for years and you are and always have been wrong.

LOL, you don't read very well. I said '11 and '13 were absolutely banner years in Texas, specifically Dallas. Hell, I gave them props for those years in my last post for chrissakes. It was regarded as the best class nationally by most everyone. First time that's ever been the case. I never once would suggest either DC or Atlanta were better those years. In fact, DC has been pretty dry lately, as has Baltimore. Why don't we compare the '12 class in a year, cause it absolutely sucks in Dallas, sucks. Houston is holding the state down this year. Houston is also regarded, throughout the industry, as being a better hot bed than Dallas.

That said, I respect Texas hoops quite a bit these days, specifically b/c of the '11 class, which I spent a lot of time around. Also, part of the reason Dallas will never have the rep of other cities, is b/c of the diluted AAU circuit. Far too many teams for the amount of talent. Other than the Mustangs last year winning Real Deal etc, Texas club teams, specifically in Dallas, never win chips, ever.

You have such a hard-on for Texas, it's funny. I don't give a rat's anus where our players come from, never will, as long as they can ball. I'm a firm believer it has to be a healthy mix. You would take a crap local, over a better kid from Minnesota, just b/c he's local. BTW, we weren't better in the Sasser years b/c those kids were local. We were better, cause those were some of the better players we've recruited to SMU. We were better this year b/c Dia was ridiculous, and Nyakundi stepped up. We'll be good next year b/c Leslee Smith, Vilde & Cotton become eligible. It's about players and SMU is nationally regarded private that draws from everywhere. That's the way the team should be as well. You try and make it seem like I'm against locals, which couldn't be farther from the truth.

Would you trade Leslee Smith for Jalen Jones straight up? Would you trade Vilde for Cannen Cunningham straight up? Oh yeah, you don't know b/c you don't spend time actually watching games, just reading rivals.

by **ponyscott** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:54 pm

repeat

by **ponyscott** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:27 am

ponyscott wrote:
Stallion wrote:I know-I was about the ONLY one on this board at the time who said that rating was a CHARADE. I was the first one to criticize Doherty for taking 7 freshman in one class while cheerleaders were doing victory laps. It didn't take me two years to see through the hype of that Class. You keep talking about Terrapin Basketball-I was the one who said SMU should refocus on local recruiting when you were trashing Texas BB and you were lauding SMU for looking across the Country. Now we are going to find out who was right.

Sorry Stallion...enough with the 'I' stuff...who friggin cares about 'I'...?????? You are good at following rivals and scout in football ( for what it's worth) but you don't know jack about basketball and you come on here with your ego 'ONLY' chest beating 'I' this and 'I 'that...give us a break.....Really?......do you even know the basketball is round?..